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clugo633

Audioholic Intern
I'm thinking of upgrading from my A1030. My local HT store is having sales on various AVR and I'm debating between another Yamaha or trying out a Sony ES model...possibly 2100es.

I can't seem to find much on current somy es models and was wondering if you guys had any thoughts? Looking to stay between 1000-1500. The local HT store is willing to work with my budget.

What do yo guys think? Any other AVR's you would recommend over these two that are in my budget?

Thanks.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
What are you upgrading for, i.e. just what is it you want in the new avr that your old one doesn't have?
 
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clugo633

Audioholic Intern
Good question. I should have included it in my OP.
I upgrade to a 4K TV (Sony x900f) and the 1030 doesnt support HDR or HDCP.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
How do you feel about your old Yamaha AVR?

Any complaints?

If not, then I would stick with another Yamaha, which is supposed to be #1 in reliability and HDMI-compatibility (per Mr. M Code). :D

Sony ES does offer a 5YR warranty, which is better than the 3YR warranty offered by Yamaha and Denon.

If you want to try Audyssey XT32, then try Denon X4400. However, according to repair records, Denon/Marantz are not as good as Yamaha.
 
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clugo633

Audioholic Intern
It seems like there was a time Sony was being talked about as making poor avrs. I’m not able to find many reviews online so I can’t tell if opinions have changed with their new lineup.

My Yamaha has been great. No issues but I’m always up for a change but want to make sure I do my research first. I wish I could see pictures of Sony’s transformer and reviews.


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Last edited:
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
In Through-Straight/Direct/Bypass modes, Yamaha, Denon/Marantz, and Sony will sound equally great.
 
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clugo633

Audioholic Intern
At what point does the Sony begin to fall away from the others? How would u rank them in terms of 7.2 home theater?


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AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
At what point does the Sony begin to fall away from the others? How would u rank them in terms of 7.2 home theater?


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If I were buying for myself right now, I would rank Yamaha #1, Sony ES #2, Denon/Marantz #3.
 
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clugo633

Audioholic Intern
Thank you.


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clugo633

Audioholic Intern
Out of curiosity, why Sony over Denon or marantz?


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Drunkpenguin

Audioholic Chief
Is sony a game player these days? Ive been avoiding them for decades. Never thought of them as quality. I was wrong?
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Out of curiosity, why Sony over Denon or marantz?


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Because his fancy Denon pre-pro bit it and Denon/Marantz (same company for a while now) couldn't fix it. :), he was quite the Denon fan before that; he's been a Yamaha fan since getting a Yamaha pre-pro and now repeats info mcode has been providing for a while about reliability stats reported by part of the industry; the stats aren't conclusive IMO, even those provided by an insider like mcode (who works for an unnamed and mysterious installer that pitches in on design/consulting work with various consumer audio gear).

Also note he is specifying Sony's ES line, their upper end line. Sony kind of went their own way for room eq and volume calibration, which some people knocked them for as it wasn't perceived as being very good, and Sony was having some focus issues for a while when they fell from grace somewhat due to bonehead corporate expansion in general. One of my more durable avrs has been an inexpensive Sony, but it lacks some of the bells and whistles, too (like hdmi). I've got a couple of Denons that have been just fine; also have an Onkyo and have had the famous hdmi/network board issues with the Onkyo (fixed by Onkyo) as well as a failed Pioneer (and Onkyo/Pioneer are now combined as far as such products go). Yamaha does likely retain the lead in reliability, and hasn't changed hands or used contracted production facilities; others haven't had as deep pockets from a stable parent organization to help out, and Yamaha does actually go thru hdmi certification whereas others don't. That said, I've never had (nor really wanted) a Yamaha.

That's my take at least.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Out of curiosity, why Sony over Denon or marantz?

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Why I think Sony ES is more reliable than Denon/Marantz?

Personal experience. Intuition. Gut instinct. :D

I could be wrong.

Others will have different experiences.

I’ve been a huge fan of Denon/Marantz for long time. Owned many of their products. For the longest time, I really thought I would be a fan of Denon/Marantz forever.

But, hey, who knows? Maybe you’ll have better luck. Everyone is different.
 
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PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Why I think Sony ES is more reliable than Denon/Marantz?

Personal experience. Intuition. Gut instinct. :D

I could be wrong.

Others will have different experiences.

I’ve been a huge fan of Denon/Marantz for long time. Owned many of their products. For the longest time, I really thought I would be a fan of Denon/Marantz forever.

But, hey, who knows? Maybe you’ll have better luck. Everyone is different.
I have had some Sony before, they seemed to have gone through some ups and downs over the years. Their older ES products were great, but the slightly newer STR-DAXES series were very average except the DA5ES, my 43 lbs DA4ES (year 2001) had a regular Bando transformer in it that made audible hum if within a few inches, instead of the custom wound ES transformers found in their earlier ES models. Then they seemed to have gotten better again a few years later, and now apparently even the lower STR-DN series are getting some rave reviews. So based on my experience and online research, Sony AVRs could be a very good alternative to Yamaha but one needs to research their target models to the nth degree, including some auditioning, search for bench test results and peek at their innards.
 
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PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Because his fancy Denon pre-pro bit it and Denon/Marantz (same company for a while now) couldn't fix it. :), he was quite the Denon fan before that; he's been a Yamaha fan since getting a Yamaha pre-pro and now repeats info mcode has been providing for a while about reliability stats reported by part of the industry; the stats aren't conclusive IMO, even those provided by an insider like mcode (who works for an unnamed and mysterious installer that pitches in on design/consulting work with various consumer audio gear).

Also note he is specifying Sony's ES line, their upper end line. Sony kind of went their own way for room eq and volume calibration, which some people knocked them for as it wasn't perceived as being very good, and Sony was having some focus issues for a while when they fell from grace somewhat due to bonehead corporate expansion in general. One of my more durable avrs has been an inexpensive Sony, but it lacks some of the bells and whistles, too (like hdmi). I've got a couple of Denons that have been just fine; also have an Onkyo and have had the famous hdmi/network board issues with the Onkyo (fixed by Onkyo) as well as a failed Pioneer (and Onkyo/Pioneer are now combined as far as such products go). Yamaha does likely retain the lead in reliability, and hasn't changed hands or used contracted production facilities; others haven't had as deep pockets from a stable parent organization to help out, and Yamaha does actually go thru hdmi certification whereas others don't. That said, I've never had (nor really wanted) a Yamaha.

That's my take at least.
That's a nice summary, as usual, you are very observant.:)
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
I have had some Sony before, they seemed to have gone through some ups and downs over the years. Their older ES products were great, but the slightly newer STR-DAXES series were very average except the DA5ES, my 43 lbs DA4ES (year 2001) had a regular Bando transformer in it that made audible hum if within a few inches, instead of the custom wound ES transformers found in their earlier ES models. Then they seemed to have gotten better again a few years later, and now apparently even the lower STR-DN series are getting some rave reviews. So based on my experience and online research, Sony AVRs could be a very good alternative to Yamaha but one needs to research their target models to the nth degree, including some auditioning, search for bench test results and peek at their innards.
I think the "problem" with Sony is that their AVRs are usually even more expensive than Yamaha.

I can see people buying Denon/Marantz because they must have Audyssey XT32 or because Denon often has big sales.

I can see people buying Yamaha because they may have the #1 reliability and HDMI-compatibility and they also have moderate sales (not as big as Denon, but better than Sony).

I can see people buying Sony if they already own Sony TVs, projectors, PlayStations, and BD players and want to keep the same brand. Otherwise, unless people can find a big sale on Sony, which I don't often see, Sony is kind of like the "middle child". :D

And if I'm buying a Sony, I would only buy the ES models and get the 5YR warranty. :D
 
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clugo633

Audioholic Intern
I was able to get the 3100es for $1100 so I went with it.

Let’s see how it goes.


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lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Good luck. Seems a bit pricey for the feature set, tho.
 

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