4 uls-15 mk2’s vs 4 pb-2000’s

[Reckel]

What’s your avr?
FWIW, IMO if your going to put 4 subs in there(and it can even go a long ways for a single sub), you might consider a umik -1, REW and a minidsp. 3k is a lot of money to plunk down and still not know what kind of response you’re getting. Multi subs as a rule CAN go a long ways to help smooth out the room, but(I’ll be the bread crumbs in the butter here) it’s often overstated, and without much regard to proper setup. Different distances to the LP, and room boundaries require careful phase integration. imo, this is tricky. Being open to other parts of the house inherently allow for a smoother response, but the LP’s relationship to boundaries, and the sub’s relationship to boundaries mean that it’s not plunk n play.
More coffee...

Yamaha 860, I’ll run room correction then go back in with spl meter n adjust to 75db on speakers except side surrounds are 74 n all four subs summed together I have at 78db. For some reason the Yamaha sets the speakers to 78db but I cut them down to 75. Hell none of my subs gain knobs are even set halfway

 

[Reckel]

I think, ultimately you may have to flip a coin or something.
FWIW, the SVS PB2000 is roughly the same size as the VTF-2 and the VTF-3 is substantially larger.
Just to try to cover all angles:
1) describe where/how you feel the BIC's fail you. Are they boomy? Never loud enough. Try putting them close to you just to see how that changes your perspective.
2) In what area are you located? I ask because if you happen to be down the street from Rythmik, for example, you could pick up the subs ... and return, if needed, so you don't have to pay shipping costs. Eliminating the shipping cost penalty for an in home trial/return (and just saving shipping costs, or getting a discount from SVS) is good reason to choose any of these brands over another. It is a long shot, but it would suck to later find out you missed out!

PS - Sorry you got hurt, I hope you are still able to move subs around (or have suitable labor/kids on-hand)

I find these are very handy things to have for moving subs (and anything else that is heavy) I originally bought mine to move a piano around (one under each side-only need to lift one end at a time), but once you have them, they are very useful. I leave them under my subs until I know I have determined the final resting place. I have not experienced any unwanted vibrations or sounds from having them under the sub.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/WEN-1000-lbs-Capacity-12-in-x-18-in-Hardwood-Furniture-Dolly-2-Pack-721218/304665740?cm_mmc=Shopping|G|Base|D22|22-8_LADDERS|Generic|PLA|71700000032189356|58700003830574769|92700037522295284&gclid=CjwKCAjwmdDeBRA8EiwAXlarFrz5GDUF1AEL9ySt0d98pZkJP0JZOp7iAvO-tOuJMmNqRqbNPPSlHhoCjlQQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Another good option (especially on carpet) is these sliders. The nice thing about them is you can leave them permanently under the subs. They will work well enough for moving across the room to take the place of the above dolly's so you don't need both:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/WEN-1000-lbs-Capacity-12-in-x-18-in-Hardwood-Furniture-Dolly-2-Pack-721218/304665740?cm_mmc=Shopping|G|Base|D22|22-8_LADDERS|Generic|PLA|71700000032189356|58700003830574769|92700037522295284&gclid=CjwKCAjwmdDeBRA8EiwAXlarFrz5GDUF1AEL9ySt0d98pZkJP0JZOp7iAvO-tOuJMmNqRqbNPPSlHhoCjlQQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

I've also seen them in black (if you keep permanently under subs) just look around at Lowe's Harbor Freight, Wal-mart, etc.

Btw thx for the condolences about work, I forgot to tell you. It’s one aspect of my job

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Yamaha 860, I’ll run room correction then go back in with spl meter n adjust to 75db on speakers except side surrounds are 74 n all four subs summed together I have at 78db. For some reason the Yamaha sets the speakers to 78db but I cut them down to 75. Hell none of my subs gain knobs are even set halfway

The problem is, it’s not as simple as using an spl meter. You’d really need to run sweeps with REW to know the FR and deal with it accord. Level matching is very smart of you to do, but not a complete setup process. The down side of that though, is something we all know(you too) as the rabbit hole! Ignorance can be bliss, but I’d hate to see you dropping that much coin and just making a run for it.

 

[Reckel]

What’s your avr?
FWIW, IMO if your going to put 4 subs in there(and it can even go a long ways for a single sub), you might consider a umik -1, REW and a minidsp. 3k is a lot of money to plunk down and still not know what kind of response you’re getting. Multi subs as a rule CAN go a long ways to help smooth out the room, but(I’ll be the bread crumbs in the butter here) it’s often overstated, and without much regard to proper setup. Different distances to the LP, and room boundaries require careful phase integration. imo, this is tricky. Being open to other parts of the house inherently allow for a smoother response, but the LP’s relationship to boundaries, and the sub’s relationship to boundaries mean that it’s not plunk n play.
More coffee...

Yea I was thinking about the umik-1 n rew but I have no idea how to use rew. Honestly when watching a movie the bass sounds dam good at all seats but the middle (money seat) one to right of that n the one in front of that in first row sound great. Which I would assume is because of the solid wall there. My two seats near the opening sound dam good but it’s different from the other three n that’s cuz there’s no boundary on that side, which I’ll probably never be able to fix unless I build a wall which I’m not doing

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Yea I was thinking about the umik-1 n rew but I have no idea how to use rew. Honestly when watching a movie the bass sounds dam good at all seats but the middle (money seat) one to right of that n the one in front of that in first row sound great. Which I would assume is because of the solid wall there. My two seats near the opening sound dam good but it’s different from the other three n that’s cuz there’s no boundary on that side, which I’ll probably never be able to fix unless I build a wall which I’m not doing

Well, REW isn’t for the faint of heart, but it’s my estimation that you’re qualified to understand it. There are TONS of help files and threads available to guide you through.
You are likely right about why you’re response is different across the seats. That’s kinda why I’m beating the REW/minidsp drum. Bass is an investment, but not only in money! REW/minidsp is powerful. You can actually run an REW sweep and have it generate target filters and load that into the minidsp. Then you don’t have to dive sooo deep and learn about manually eq’ing yourself.(although it’s useful imo)

 

[Reckel]

The problem is, it’s not as simple as using an spl meter. You’d really need to run sweeps with REW to know the FR and deal with it accord. Level matching is very smart of you to do, but not a complete setup process. The down side of that though, is something we all know(you too) as the rabbit hole! Ignorance can be bliss, but I’d hate to see you dropping that much coin and just making a run for it.

I really thought about getting a mic n rew n even minidsp but it’s like dam, I’m always having to get this extra stuff cuz I read something n then I’m not satisfied with what I hear anymore in my room n I want to change something. It just seems like there’s always something I’ve gotta have n this is where the wife gets irritated

 

[Reckel]

Well, REW isn’t for the faint of heart, but it’s my estimation that you’re qualified to understand it. There are TONS of help files and threads available to guide you through.
You are likely right about why you’re response is different across the seats. That’s kinda why I’m beating the REW/minidsp drum. Bass is an investment, but not only in money! REW/minidsp is powerful. You can actually run an REW sweep and have it generate target filters and load that into the minidsp. Then you don’t have to dive sooo deep and learn about manually eq’ing yourself.(although it’s useful imo)

The rew/minidsp would help that much man? You think it would change the response to being better with no boundary on the one side? If it does I would definitely buy the mic n minidsp but if it wouldn’t change anything cuz of no wall on the one side, I would think it’d be kinda a waste of money or am I wrong?

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I really thought about getting a mic n rew n even minidsp but it’s like dam, I’m always having to get this extra stuff cuz I read something n then I’m not satisfied with what I hear anymore in my room n I want to change something. It just seems like there’s always something I’ve gotta have n this is where the wife gets irritated

I here that. I get that too. The cost of entry sometimes isn’t as bad as all the extra peripherals! And yeah, not knowing is sometimes better(ie:rabbit hole).

 

[Reckel]

I here that. I get that too. The cost of entry sometimes isn’t as bad as all the extra peripherals! And yeah, not knowing is sometimes better(ie:rabbit hole).

If ur telling me that it really will help, I don’t have any objections on buying those two things, they’re really not that expensive

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

The rew/minidsp would help that much man? You think it would change the response to being better with no boundary on the one side? If it does I would definitely buy the mic n minidsp but if it wouldn’t change anything cuz of no wall on the one side, I would think it’d be kinda a waste of money or am I wrong?

I can say from my own experiences, and from watching/reading others. Absolutely yes.
I have 3 subs and wouldn’t be without one. Before I got the minidsp, I used a behringer feedback destroy which is sooooooooooooooo archaic in comparison. But it worked. I know @lovinthehd is also a fan and can possibly share some insight.

The thing is you can EQ/level/time etc each sub separately, and then as a group(Gene did this but it’s normally recommended to only EQ as a group). It’s very powerful.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

If it would help ease your mind vs just taking my advice, do some searching in the googletron and spend some time learning/observing results. Like I said, I wouldn’t be without one.
I have 3 subs, all under varying height ceilings, and open to a humongous airspace. I can’t pressurize all of it, my my response is pretty damn good down to about 14hz.

 

[Reckel]

If it would help ease your mind vs just taking my advice, do some searching in the googletron and spend some time learning/observing results. Like I said, I wouldn’t be without one.
I have 3 subs, all under varying height ceilings, and open to a humongous airspace. I can’t pressurize all of it, my my response is pretty damn good down to about 14hz.

That’s awesome. I believe you man n trust me I’ve read a lot where people recommend but since my side opens up I didn’t know if things could be dealt with or not. Does gene ever chime in here? Thought it was a video I saw of him talking about how impressed he was with the minidsp, maybe I had read something. Like I said I’ve read plenty of other people that speak highly of it. Just buy the regular minidsp or the hd one?

 

[Reckel]

That’s awesome. I believe you man n trust me I’ve read a lot where people recommend but since my side opens up I didn’t know if things could be dealt with or not. Does gene ever chime in here? Thought it was a video I saw of him talking about how impressed he was with the minidsp, maybe I had read something. Like I said I’ve read plenty of other people that speak highly of it. Just buy the regular minidsp or the hd one?

Well now I gotta decide on frickin subs, I’m dragging my feet.

 

[Reckel]

Well now I gotta decide on frickin subs, I’m dragging my feet.

Is it tough to get the hang of it or understand?

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Yeah @gene does drop in once in awhile. You know, like when he takes off his cape and sits down for awhile. Lol

Minidsp can be tricky but like I said, there are lots of resources, and guys available to help. While I’m not an expert with it. I’ve managed a great in room response. My room is also open to one side, BUT not so much the area where my subs are. At one time my PC’s were behind me which IS open at the right rear. While room gain there wasn’t the best ever, my response was smooth.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Oh yeah, HD version.

 

[snakeeyes]

It may be difficult to get a a pair of FV18 down the stairs to that basement.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

It may be difficult to get a a pair of FV18 down the stairs to that basement.

Lol.
That might be true, but he only has to do it once! I’ve hauled refrigerators down smaller stairs than that!

 

[kini]

Four VTF-3s would have about the same amount of deep bass output as two FV18s from 16 Hz to 25 Hz, but at 30 Hz and above, four VTF-3s would have a very substantial output advantage. They would also likely make for a flatter frequency response as well. Not that two FV18s wouldn't be a great system, but you would be getting more bang for your buck with four VTF-3s- if you have room for them.

a pai of the redesigned FV18s with the paper cone would out perform 4 VTF3s throughout the frequency range and dominate them thoroughly under 25hz. At a recent get together a single one stood up well to a Cap 2400 in a very large room.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

a pai of the redesigned FV18s with the paper cone would out perform 4 VTF3s throughout the frequency range and dominate them thoroughly under 25hz. At a recent get together a single one stood up well to a Cap 2400 in a very large room.

Pretty sure I read about the same gtg. 7000cuft iirc. I was very impressed and it’s one of the reasons I brought it back up here.