Time for an upgrade and need some advice!

[NtegraDryvr]

Hi all, so a couple years back I got a deal on some Deftech BP8060st towers and 8080CS center channel. I am in a large open floor space that the living room, kitchen, halls, etc share so I decided to go with two HSU VTF-15h Mk2's. All of this is being ran off of a Denon 2112ci which is very out of date.

Considering:
Deftech is offering the 9080x towers with built in atmos tops for $2800 and including a 9080 center channel for free. I would get these and move my 8060st's to back left and right surrounds.

Looking at the AVR-x3500h for $800 and running it as is OR possibly pairing it up with maybe an Outlaw 5000 amp for $650.

1. Is my plan of getting the new towers and moving my current towers to the back for surrounds a good one? (My 8080cs center channel can be placed as needed or used in another room with a different crappy speaker set)

2. The receiver and amp would put me around $1450 together. Am I better off going with a more expensive and powerful receiver and running it as is? Should I run the 3500 by itself? Will the Outlaw amp be a decent improvement? I know more power is always better, but in the case of these def techs how much power is required to take advantage of them?

100% of our media consumption is from my 36TB HTPC playing 4k MKV's and on occasion FLAC files. 100% of my gaming is done on PC with first person shooters.

TIA!

 

[shadyJ]

Your plan of using your present tower speakers is doable. There is no reason why that wouldn't work.

I like the idea of an outboard amplifier. The reason is that it takes a load off of your AVR's amp thereby prolonging its lifetime and long-term reliability. It also will have more headroom than the AVR amp in case you like to crank the volume.

 

[KEW]

Looking at the AVR-x3500h for $800 and running it as is OR possibly pairing it up with maybe an Outlaw 5000 amp for $650.

I would not buy the 3500 for $800.
Instead, get last year's 3400 for $600 or last year's 4400 for $900!
https://www.amazon.com/Denon-AVRX3400H-Channel-Network-Receiver/dp/B072Z9ZGSZ/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1539915466&sr=8-4&keywords=denon+avr-x3500h
https://www.amazon.com/Denon-AVRX4400H-Channel-Network-Receiver/dp/B072Z6VT1C/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1539915670&sr=8-3&keywords=denon+avr-x4400h&dpID=41vzsVt4nrL&preST=_SX300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

Most years, the differences between models is not so significant. Many of us wait for the new model to be released so we can take advantage of the discount on last years model. Your timing is good!

If you go with the Outlaw (which I think is a fine idea), wait - Outlaw usually has a Black Friday sale!

 

[NtegraDryvr]

That's great advice. Being the rookie I am. Do I need to care about this new IMAX experience stuff?

My main concerns are having audyssey xt32 and atmos support for certain.

If I get the 4400h like you suggest and its rated at 125w 2ch is it even worth it to get the outlaw 5000 at 120w all channels?

 

[mtrycrafts]

That's great advice. Being the rookie I am. Do I need to care about this new IMAX experience stuff?

...

Only if you have an IMAX size screen.

 

[everettT]

Just curious if you have auditioned any other speakers? And if you can accommodate in ceiling for the atmos.

 

[NtegraDryvr]

I could one day do atmos speakers but that is significantly more cost. I realize the 9080x tops are kinda gimmicky but I hear they are better than the previous model.

I had planned to go with the 9080x's simply because of the free center and figured it would pair well with my 8060s once they moved to the rear.

 

[everettT]

I could one day do atmos speakers but that is significantly more cost. I realize the 9080x tops are kinda gimmicky but I hear they are better than the previous model.

I had planned to go with the 9080x's simply because of the free center and figured it would pair well with my 8060s once they moved to the rear.

Did you hear a difference? Just wondering if it's more of a lateral move for you.

 

[NtegraDryvr]

I haven't tried them to be honest. I have a hard time testing out equipment in some other environment other than my own and taking away any meaningful opinion. I don't have any surrounds at the moment at all so I figured pairing the 9080x's with my 8060st's would be a good match since they are similar.

 

[NtegraDryvr]

Thanks for the advise all. Just picked up a magnolia demo room model of the x4400h for $550. Also ordered the $2800 worth of 9080x with 9080 center channel. I'll give it a try like that for now until black Friday. Think an amp would make a noticable difference on this particular setup?

 

[Audiosaur]

The 4400 is a good choice!

My experience with bouncy atmos speakers was disappointing. There's just not enough signal that gets to the MLP to make an appreciable difference. IMHO, for the price you paid in speakers, I'd look to something like philharmonic BMRs and a good sub.

 

[NtegraDryvr]

So I'm a little confused here. I previously had an old 2112ci denon at like 90w 2ch. This one is more powerful but I'm picking up distortion at high volume with some flac files.... could this demo unit have been over driven or something or is it more likely in my head?

Actually I'm thinking it might be just the left channel... going to have to do some more troubleshooting. Are these receivers able to be damaged and what's the likelihood?

 

[-Jim-]

Hi,

How loud is it when you hear distortion? Your new 9080x towers are pretty efficient. Max Sensitivity (1 watt @ 1 meter): 92 dB so the Denon AVR-X4400H shouldn't have any trouble lighting them up from any source. ( I have a 4400) Your "old" Deftech BP8060st have the same value, so they two should be fine.

Can you change your source material to a BluRay disk or even a CD? Some folks rip tunes to Flac Files, and don't do a good job of it, and the end product suffers. For great sound you must have good source material.

 

[NtegraDryvr]

Hi,

How loud is it when you hear distortion? Your new 9080x towers are pretty efficient. Max Sensitivity (1 watt @ 1 meter): 92 dB so the Denon AVR-X4400H shouldn't have any trouble lighting them up from any source. ( I have a 4400) Your "old" Deftech BP8060st have the same value, so they two should be fine.

Can you change your source material to a BluRay disk or even a CD? Some folks rip tunes to Flac Files, and don't do a good job of it, and the end product suffers. For great sound you must have good source material.

I haven't recieved my 9080s yet so I'm still on the 8060s. Music gets plenty loud at -7db obviously lol. However movies are fairly pathetic at the same volume.

Maybe there is a setting I'm missing but I need to plug in my old 2112ci and try to confirm. I guess the extra power between the 2 may just not be enough to notice.

 

[everettT]

I haven't recieved my 9080s yet so I'm still on the 8060s. Music gets plenty loud at -7db obviously lol. However movies are fairly pathetic at the same volume.

Maybe there is a setting I'm missing but I need to plug in my old 2112ci and try to confirm. I guess the extra power between the 2 may just not be enough to notice.

If your listening habits are the same, and there was no distortion before, the power would be irrelevant. Differences in versions of Audyssey will have an effect, but without eq, should be identical.

 

[PENG]

I haven't recieved my 9080s yet so I'm still on the 8060s. Music gets plenty loud at -7db obviously lol. However movies are fairly pathetic at the same volume.

Maybe there is a setting I'm missing but I need to plug in my old 2112ci and try to confirm. I guess the extra power between the 2 may just not be enough to notice.

You are correct, the extra power between the two will not be noticeable. Adding the Outlaw 5000 will not make a noticeable difference either because as you know, you need 2 times the power to gain 3 dB of sound pressure and it is generally believed that you need 8-10 dB more spl to perceive twice as loud. Adding an Outlaw 5000 will mainly help if you have 4 ohm speakers.

If you hear distortions at -7, it is likely your source flac file. Try some high resolution files, not that 192/24 is necessary or better, but there is better chance they were made from better quality recordings.

Also, make sure you don't have Eco mode turned on. Add a couple of ACInfinity fans to help cool the unit instead. Eco mode limits the rail voltage and that will definitely limit power output if you had the volume as high as -7.

 

[NtegraDryvr]

You are correct, the extra power between the two will not be noticeable. Adding the Outlaw 5000 will not make a noticeable difference either because as you know, you need 2 times the power to gain 3 dB of sound pressure and it is generally believed that you need 8-10 dB more spl to perceive twice as loud. Adding an Outlaw 5000 will mainly help if you have 4 ohm speakers.

If you hear distortions at -7, it is likely your source flac file. Try some high resolution files, not that 192/24 is necessary or better, but there is better chance they were made from better quality recordings.

Also, make sure you don't have Eco mode turned on. Add a couple of ACInfinity fans to help cool the unit instead. Eco mode limits the rail voltage and that will definitely limit power output if you had the volume as high as -7.

This is exactly what I wanted to know! I had wondered about Eco mode and others were saying to leave it on as it increases power as you need it and should extend the life of the amp? Sounds to me like I need to invest in an Emotiva XPA-5 Gen 3 to make a difference since it is 250w / 5ch, right?

I'm starting to wonder if it was distortion I heard at all or some kind of interference possibly. A few things to note. My left speaker which has a "sub" is only 6" roughly away from a couch/chair and one of my subs is only 1" to the right of it but the sub is forward facing.

Could this be a power issue?
The following items are all on the same breaker.
I have an APC H10 that powers both HSU VTF-15H's, Receiver, Xbox 1, Harmony Remote, 65" Samsung, Both Deftech 8060 Towers, and the 8080 center channel.

Likely on the same breaker but NOT on the APC unit is my HTPC that consists of 6 HDD's, over clocked 1080ti, 6700k, 12 fans, & many accessories.

I have never blown the breaker, but I have managed to over load/trip the APC unit 1 time when the subs hit at the end of the silent scene in Star Wars The Last Jedi.

 

[snakeeyes]

Are the distortions from one particular speaker? I damaged one of my speakers with only a 140w/ch AVR and had to replace it. It may be worth isolating each speaker and seeing if one particular speaker is distorting.

 

[NtegraDryvr]

Are the distortions from one particular speaker? I damaged one of my speakers with only a 140w/ch AVR and had to replace it. It may be worth isolating each speaker and seeing if one particular speaker is distorting.

I thought of this as well and just need to find the time soon. I haven't blown any speakers before so I'm not sure what to look for. Would it really take close to 0db for it to become noticeable but sound fine otherwise everywhere else?

 

[snakeeyes]

I thought of this as well and just need to find the time soon. I haven't blown any speakers before so I'm not sure what to look for. Would it really take close to 0db for it to become noticeable but sound fine otherwise everywhere else?

Well when you start using the term “distortion” for all sources such as even cds, on your speakers at high volume, you might want to double check to see if just one speakers is having issues. I was using a bookshelf for a center so pretty sure an action movie cranked up too loud was the problem.