JL Audio Fathom F113 v2 vs Outlaw Audio Ultra-X13

[vatsan]

I was wondering purely from a performance perspective how the JL Audio Fathom F113 v2 stacked up against the Outlaw Audio Ultra-X13.


I looked for F113 v2 measurements but could not find any. Has Audioholics reviewed / measured the F113? Could you please post the link if you have seen any measurement results?

Thanks!

 

[lovinthehd]

How about the value factyor with JL pricing? You can easily have two Outlaw subs, maybe three, for the price of the JL...

Why just these two subs for consideration?

 

[shadyJ]

How about the value factyor with JL pricing? You can easily have two Outlaw subs, maybe three, for the price of the JL...

Why just these two subs for consideration?

Agreed, these aren't really comparable, two very different subs with different applications.

 

[vatsan]

The Outlaw measured very well and costs about 1500$. The F113 v2 is significantly more expensive at about 4000$. My question is related to what value is one getting with the JL for the extra $$. Is the measured / audible performance significantly better compared to the Outlaw (extension, distortion etc). Or is one paying a premium for the equalization capability and appearance?

The sub designs are different ported vs sealed and slightly different driver areas, with and without equalization capabilities.

shadyJ - sincere question - trying to understand - why do you say they are for different applications? Per the Audioholics review the Outlaw was great for music and HT. I've read the same for the JL also.

 

[lovinthehd]

I'd say they're both fine subs. JL has a small and good looking form factor, if those things are high on your list of good sub attributes....

I think you're overthinking it a bit.

 

[shadyJ]

The Outlaw measured very well and costs about 1500$. The F113 v2 is significantly more expensive at about 4000$. My question is related to what value is one getting with the JL for the extra $$. Is the measured / audible performance significantly better compared to the Outlaw (extension, distortion etc). Or is one paying a premium for the equalization capability and appearance?

The sub designs are different ported vs sealed and slightly different driver areas, with and without equalization capabilities.

shadyJ - sincere question - trying to understand - why do you say they are for different applications? Per the Audioholics review the Outlaw was great for music and HT. I've read the same for the JL also.

Regarding performance, the Outlaw will definitely have an advantage in deep bass output. The F113 v2 isn't going to be able to do what the Outlaw does at 30 Hz and below, because the large ported cabinet gives the Outlaw a big advantage there. I would guess that the F113 v2 probably has an output advantage at 40 Hz and above, but probably not a big advantage.

For the JL Audio sub, you are paying an awful lot for the high-end enclosure, appearance, and features like the ARRO EQ. If you just want raw performance for you dollars, I would say the Outlaw is easily a better value.

When I say they have different applications, by that I mean the situations they are intended for rather than the playback content that they are intended for. The Outlaw is a large sub with a nice finish but not a premium finish. The F113 v2 is designed much more with a 'spouse approval factor' in mind, living room friendly, so it looks pretty swank. The manufacturers of these subs probably don't regard the other as direct competition, since few people will be deciding between these two.

 

[KEW]

I'll say it more succinctly:
If you don't need the compact form factor, don't buy the JL Audio.

It definitely puts out prodigious bass for its size, and I know of nothing that can compete with it on that count, but as soon as you lose the "for its size" qualifier, it becomes ridiculously over-priced!

 

[shadyJ]

I'll say it more succinctly:
If you don't need the compact form factor, don't buy the JL Audio.

It definitely puts out prodigious bass for its size, and I know of nothing that can compete with it on that count, but as soon as you lose the "for its size" qualifier, it becomes ridiculously over-priced!

Even considering size, there is still may be some much higher value subs, like the SVS SB16 Ultra would probably give it a real run for its money. Hell, I bet the Hsu ULS-15 mk2 probably wouldn't be far behind it in performance, or the sealed 15"s from Rythmik. Hell you could almost get four ULS-15s for the street price of a F113.

 

[vatsan]

Thanks guys. I schmoozed the wife and got a pair of XTZ 3x12.

If anyone's interested XTZ is offering 30% off of all purchases at the moment.

So I got a great deal on the pair of 3x12s I think.

 

[lovinthehd]

...and now for something completely different ! Congrats.

 

[shadyJ]

Thanks guys. I schmoozed the wife and got a pair of XTZ 3x12.

If anyone's interested XTZ is offering 30% off of all purchases at the moment.

So I got a great deal on the pair of 3x12s I think.

Wow that is a killer deal. Those are VERY good subwoofers. I know the engineer! The only problem is you need to be ready for the weight. 175 lbs, so you will need a good dolly. That is a lot, even for two adult men. It will not be a simple task to move them into place, so think about the logistics before they arrive. Anyway those subs will far outperform the Outlaw or JL Audio subs. As a matter of fact, last I heard, XTZ was actually making some changes to them so they could qualify for THX certification.

 

[vatsan]

Thanks for the heads up shadyJ. The XTZ website mentioned that their Cinema lineup was THX certified. But I could not tell if the 3x12s specifically were or were not.

KEW and shadyJ- Thanks for discussion on the form factor and value proposition. I realized I was focusing on the wrong problem. Needed to work on the wife!

 

[KEW]

As a matter of fact, last I heard, XTZ was actually making some changes to them so they could qualify for THX certification.

I'm surprised that they don't already qualify.
Surely they outperform some of the THX certified subs being sold!
What type of issues would need to be addressed to attain THX?

 

[shadyJ]

I'm surprised that they don't already qualify.
Surely they outperform some of the THX certified subs being sold!
What type of issues would need to be addressed to attain THX?

THX isn't just about raw performance, it also has to do with the way that the unit behaves within the entire system. THX wants tight control over every aspect so the end performance is always predictable. The performance targets aren't just a flat response and high output vs dynamic range. From what I was told, XTZ made some changes to get their drivers within THX component certification compliance.

 

[KEW]

THX isn't just about raw performance, it also has to do with the way that the unit behaves within the entire system. THX wants tight control over every aspect so the end performance is always predictable. The performance targets aren't just a flat response and high output vs dynamic range. From what I was told, XTZ made some changes to get their drivers within THX component certification compliance.

That is pretty much what I was thinking, but was hoping for some specific examples of what these might be.
I mean, I expect the end result of the XTZ easily outclasses the Outlaw, so it is interesting that THX also focuses on the building blocks used to reach the end results. I could understand that they might want the unit to reach a certain efficiency, or perhaps incorporate certain safety features; but it would be really interesting if they are constraining design options!

 

[shadyJ]

That is pretty much what I was thinking, but was hoping for some specific examples of what these might be.

THX keeps specifics to themselves. I know only a few things. One of which is that the sub must have an extended response out to something like 300 Hz. The THX controller onboard processors requires that to have precise control over the whole system. Keep in mind THX was originally intended to be a system-wide spec, not just individual components like subs, speakers, and amps. It encompassed nearly anything that could affect the listening and viewing experience.