x4300h need amp?

[Foxrox]

2X Polk LSiM 703
1X Polk LSiM 706c
2X Polk LSiM 702
4X Polk 700-LS

Room 15'-6" X 29' X 9'
Listening distance 10'
Yes I have sub (PSA 15V) so I can set all speakers to small.
I like my movies and music pretty loud.

Can Denon x4300h power all 9 channels without help?

If no, would a budget 2ch amp like one of the Crowns on Amazon for LR be enough of a boost? I'd really rather not drop another grand.

Secondary question: If the x4300h will do it alone, will it put a lot of stress on it, e.i. shorten the life? I will have good air flow and fans to keep it cool.

Tertiary question: Would a 2ch amp for LR improve the sound quality of stereo music?

I read the Audioholics article about how to decide if you need an extra amp, and I was right on the edge. I'm hoping someone with more knowledge/experience can be more specific with regard to my specific setup.

Thanks!

 

[agarwalro]

For 2.0 or 2.1 you'd be okay with the AVR by itself.

For anything more, I'd recommend offloading LCR to an external amp while letting the AVR handle the rest. This is mainly to ensure the AVR doesn't run out of power reserves when you crank it. This protects the speaker from distortion originating in a clipping amp. The audio benefits are questionable if the AVR isn't being driven to clipping in the first place.

The forum favorite seems to be the Monoprice Monolith 5 or 7.

 

[lovinthehd]

Hard to know if you really need an external amp; after calibrating the avr are you playing movies at reference level (0 on the relative scale) ? Are you running into sound quality issues at the levels you're listening now? Music isn't recorded to the standards movies usually are, so harder to determine there.

I've used the Crown XLS amps for several years and am quite happy with them, altho not using them currently with my Denon 4520, even when I was running 9 ch recently (now back to 7) as I am not listening at the levels I used to when I used external amps (Crowns and others in the past) for use on my mains. An external amp can help reduce the load on the avr which can extend longevity, altho supplemental cooling should aid there somewhat in any case.

As was said, in 2 channel mode your avr should have plenty of power, tho (and keep in mind to gain merely 3dB spl it takes a doubling of power). Additional power doesn't translate to sound quality unless you were running into clipping or distortion issues...

 

[Audiosaur]

I was running 5.2.4 with my 4300 and it was doing fine on its own. But to HD's point, offloading the mains to help with longevity was important to me. I picked up a used Crown and just feel better that I'll now never run into a power problem. The sound was no different.

 

[Verdinut]

Since you like to play your music pretty loud, the answer depends on the following factors:

1. Dimensions of your listening room
2. Distance between left and right front speakers and listening position
3. Are you familiar with Sound Pressure Levels which are calculated in Decibels?

I did a quick calculation of the probable SPL level at a listening distance of 10 feet, and I obtained a possible peak level of 105dB only with the left and right front channels being driven at 125 watts each, which is quite loud.

With the above requested info, we should be in a position to tell you if external power amplification would be preferable.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I don’t think you need anything else.

But if you decide to try an amp, I would just get the $300 Crown XLS Amp for the FR/FL.

 

[yepimonfire]

I’d actually use the amp to power the center speaker first and foremost. It’s the most demanding channel, as over 60% of the soundtrack is mixed into it.

If you can get an amp to power the front lcr, the remaining channels should do just fine.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[PENG]

I’d actually use the amp to power the center speaker first and foremost. It’s the most demanding channel, as over 60% of the soundtrack is mixed into it.

I thought that's just hearsay because I have taken a lot of measurements and found no evidence, using my BR movies, that the center channel is the most demanding channel. It may have higher average in terms of usage but not peaks, to say that with more certainty I would have to take more measurements.

 

[PENG]

2X Polk LSiM 703
1X Polk LSiM 706c
2X Polk LSiM 702
4X Polk 700-LS

Room 15'-6" X 29' X 9'
Listening distance 10'
Yes I have sub (PSA 15V) so I can set all speakers to small.
I like my movies and music pretty loud.

Can Denon x4300h power all 9 channels without help?

If no, would a budget 2ch amp like one of the Crowns on Amazon for LR be enough of a boost? I'd really rather not drop another grand.

Secondary question: If the x4300h will do it alone, will it put a lot of stress on it, e.i. shorten the life? I will have good air flow and fans to keep it cool.

Tertiary question: Would a 2ch amp for LR improve the sound quality of stereo music?

I read the Audioholics article about how to decide if you need an extra amp, and I was right on the edge. I'm hoping someone with more knowledge/experience can be more specific with regard to my specific setup.

Thanks!

Thank you for providing info about your room and listening habits. Based on that, you are correct about being on the edge, so as others have suggested, it is a good idea to get a 2 or 3 channel amp. One of those 200 WPC Monolith amp will be ideal, but then the sweet spot for the Monolith appears to be the 5X200 Watt one, highly recommended. Until then, a quick safety precaution is in fact a fan to suck from the top of blow from behind.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Since you set all your speakers to small, which is good, and set the XO to 80-100Hz, then most of the big power requirement will come from the Subwoofer, not the speakers.

Your bookshelf speakers are rated for 20W - 200W, sensitivity is 87dB/2.83v/m (Stereophile).

For 5 speakers placed 2FT from corners of the room and close to walls, listening from 10FT, 12.5W of amp would produce a combined total volume of 101dB. 6.25 watts would produce a volume of 98dB.

For 11 speakers placed 4 FT from walls, but > 2FT from corners, 6.25 watts would produce a total combined volume of 99dB.

The X4300 can output 92 Watts x all 7 Ch driven, which won't happen in real life.

92 watts + 7 speakers 4FT from walls, 10FT distance would produce 108dB total combined volume from 7 speakers.

https://www.soundandvision.com/content/denon-avr-x4200w-av-receiver-review-test-bench

http://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html

Pull out your SPL meter and measure how loud you listen.

If you listen to a total combined volume of less than 100dB, don't worry about it.

 

[Verdinut]

I thought that's just hearsay because I have taken a lot of measurements and found no evidence, using my BR movies, that the center channel is the most demanding channel. It may have higher average in terms of usage but not peaks, to say that with more certainty I would have to take more measurements.

I entirely agree with you. As a starting point, there is obviously no evidence when the center channel speaker is set to small as in most system settings.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

The Center speaker is mainly for dialogue, which doesn’t require the most power. The deep bass requires the most power.

 

[PENG]

The Center speaker is mainly for dialogue, which doesn’t require the most power. The deep bass requires the most power.

Exactly, that's why I thought on average the center may in fact get more contents because of the dialogue. That obviously does not apply to movies that don't have much dialogue. My comment was also based on the center being set to small, as Verdinut pointed out. To summarize, the center channel may get more "average use" for dialogue abundant movies but certainly not the most stressed, the left/right channels most likely get stressed more.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Exactly, that's why I thought on average the center may in fact get more contents because of the dialogue. That obviously does not apply to movies that don't have much dialogue. My comment was also based on the center being set to small, as Verdinut pointed out. To summarize, the center channel may get more "average use" for dialogue abundant movies but certainly not the most stressed, the left/right channels most likely get stressed more.

I agree. I think the FR & FL usually get the most stress, follow by the Center.

But I suppose it depends on the mixing. Someone could potentially put more heavy duty material to the Center. I mean the Center could get both the dialogue and the action scenes.

Of course, the subwoofers get more stress than any speakers, especially if you set all speakers to Small.

I wouldn't take any chances so I set all speakers to small and let the subwoofers do all the heavy lifting.

 

[PENG]

I agree. I think the FR & FL usually get the most stress, follow by the Center.

But I suppose it depends on the mixing. Someone could potentially put more heavy duty material to the Center. I mean the Center could get both the dialogue and the action scenes.

Of course, the subwoofers get more stress than any speakers, especially if you set all speakers to Small.

I wouldn't take any chances so I set all speakers to small and let the subwoofers do all the heavy lifting.

Agree also, nothing is absolute, we are talking typical, in general, most of the time, but there are exceptions, all sorts of exceptions. Even subwoofers, there are exceptions, yours may be stressed but not mine, because I just want them play at the levels intended, not more.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Even subwoofers, there are exceptions, yours may be stressed but not mine, because I just want them play at the levels intended, not more.

Whatcha talk bout Willis?

+6dB is exactly what’s intended for the subs.

 

[agarwalro]

I agree. I think the FR & FL usually get the most stress, follow by the Center.

This expectation cannot be applied to multi-channel music either.

 

[Pogre]

I'd live with it for a couple of weeks and see how it does. If you run into clipping, distortion or excessive heat grab an amp. I'm hesitant to recommend because I'd get at least a 5ch amp. Well... I actually got a 7 channel amp, so there you go.

 

[PENG]

This expectation cannot be applied to multi-channel music either.

Now you got me curious enough to want to take some measurements. I have enough mch sacds for the job.

 

[Audiosaur]

Now you got me curious enough to want to take some measurements. I have enough mch sacds for the job.

I'll be curious of your findings. It won't change my use of the Crown for L/R either way, though. My listening habits are > 90% 2.2 ch music so I want that power to the mains.