Looking for advice - cheapish subwoofer for use at desk

[cheesebrough]

Hello, i'm looking for a subwoofer to use along with my audioengine a2 speakers, i really like the sound but missing a little bass on some tracks, i've been trying to read up on subwoofers but i feel like i haven't learned enough to make a decision i feel comfortable with.

I read that room size and layout is important, so i've made a rough sketch of my room with some measurements if that helps, floor is wooden btw (excuse my poor paint skills)

The subwoofer will only be used at the desk with my computer, mostly for listening to music, sometimes movies but music is the main purpose. I don't play super loud since i'm always right in front of the speakers.

Looking for a subwoofer that:
-Preferably costs max ~350$, but cheaper = better. If i won't notice a big difference between a 150$ sub and a 350$ for my use i'd prefer the 150$ ofc. Basically if there is a great bang for my buck option in the 100-350$ range that's what i'd like to get
-Preferably doesn't rumble(heard an argon subwoofer in a local hi-fi store and it had a really noticeable rumble even when not playing very loud and i would like to avoid that)
-Doesn't need a seperate amplifier, since i don't use any for my speakers because they are powered(or is it active? not really sure what the difference is)

I don't mind buying a used subwoofer if i can find one. One thing to note is that i live in Denmark so while a lot of american brands are possible to import, it would be easier with a European or international brand.

 

[agarwalro]

A space saver sub, not recommended unless you must:
https://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-sub-1000l-10-100-watt-low-profile-powered-subwoofer--300-639

Recommended budget sub:
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=9723

Recommended sub:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0071UQ8FS

 

[WaynePflughaupt]

One thing is for sure, whatever sub you get it has to operate all the way up to 200-250. I used a sub with those speakers once, that had 125 Hz as its highest setting. Since there was no bass management for the speakers, I took measurements to determine where to set the sub crossover. The little woofers rolled out at least an octave above the sub’s highest setting (125 Hz), leaving a big hole in system response.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[yepimonfire]

Edited after looking at the response curve of the A2.

You will definitely need a sub capable of flat response to at least 150hz. Unfortunately, a good deal of subs, especially budget subs, start crapping out above 80-100hz. Iirc the BIC PL-200II performs fairly well up to about 200hz, and can be had for around $300 on eBay.

Is there no way to return or sell the A2? They’re really not that great for the price. A pair of JBL lsr 305s would outperform them by a mile, the Lsr 308 would dig deep enough to not need a sub for music either.

 

[cheesebrough]

Edited after looking at the response curve of the A2.

You will definitely need a sub capable of flat response to at least 150hz. Unfortunately, a good deal of subs, especially budget subs, start crapping out above 80-100hz. Iirc the BIC PL-200II performs fairly well up to about 200hz, and can be had for around $300 on eBay.

Is there no way to return or sell the A2? They’re really not that great for the price. A pair of JBL lsr 305s would outperform them by a mile, the Lsr 308 would dig deep enough to not need a sub for music either.

Selling or returning the a2s is not really an option i'm afraid, they were given to me for free by a relative because he had them laying around and not getting used.
That being said i'm not necessarily planning to keep them forever, but if possible i'd like to work out a good solution using these.

The size of them is also great cus desk space is a little tight as it is (only drew monitor and speakers on my desk but in reality it's somewhat tight because of a second monitor. Looking at pictures of the Lsr 308 i don't think i even could fit them.

I could get the lsr 305s and then use the audioengines for my TV instead because the TV is lacking any kind of speakers right now. Would i need a sub with 305 you think? My budget is not really there for getting a new set of speakers + a sub atm.

If i could get away with just using the lsr 305 and no sub that would be a great option though, i don't have huge demands for bass, but the audioengine a2s feels lacking atm.

Regarding the BIC PL-200II you recommended i did find a seller on ebay willing to ship to denmark for what seems to be a decent price so that's certainly something i'll be considering.

Recommended sub:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0071UQ8FS

Had a look at the specs on this one with what Pflughaupt said in mind about the getting a sub that goes to 200-250 hz, as far as i can see this one goes to 150, so that makes me a little hesitant to get this, which otherwise had a very attractive price tag.

 

[WaynePflughaupt]

Had a look at the specs on this one with what Pflughaupt said in mind about the getting a sub that goes to 200-250 hz, as far as i can see this one goes to 150, so that makes me a little hesitant to get this, which otherwise had a very attractive price tag.

My recommendation is based on memory for a good number of years back, so I could be wrong about exactly how high the sub needs to operate. Yepimonfire’s recommendation of 150 Hz is based on a frequency response graph he says he saw, so that should be a reliable figure.


Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[yepimonfire]

Selling or returning the a2s is not really an option i'm afraid, they were given to me for free by a relative because he had them laying around and not getting used.
That being said i'm not necessarily planning to keep them forever, but if possible i'd like to work out a good solution using these.

The size of them is also great cus desk space is a little tight as it is (only drew monitor and speakers on my desk but in reality it's somewhat tight because of a second monitor. Looking at pictures of the Lsr 308 i don't think i even could fit them.

I could get the lsr 305s and then use the audioengines for my TV instead because the TV is lacking any kind of speakers right now. Would i need a sub with 305 you think? My budget is not really there for getting a new set of speakers + a sub atm.

If i could get away with just using the lsr 305 and no sub that would be a great option though, i don't have huge demands for bass, but the audioengine a2s feels lacking atm.

Regarding the BIC PL-200II you recommended i did find a seller on ebay willing to ship to denmark for what seems to be a decent price so that's certainly something i'll be considering.



Had a look at the specs on this one with what Pflughaupt said in mind about the getting a sub that goes to 200-250 hz, as far as i can see this one goes to 150, so that makes me a little hesitant to get this, which otherwise had a very attractive price tag.

Don’t know what you have access to or what your desk space is like, but there are many speakers that would do much better. If you could fit a pair of R-15 powered monitors you could get away with no sub and they’re not terribly inexpensive. I get an in room response of 48hz -3dB. With optimal room gain in a sealed room with a concrete subfloor, my buddy gets 38hz. This should be more than enough for all forms of music except electronic or organ music. I cannot hear any difference in bass by switching back and forth between direct (no sub) and stereo with a crossover of 80hz with music.

IMO in most cases subs really shouldn’t be operating above 80hz, localization aside, the design of subwoofer drivers just doesn’t jive with the physics of reproducing accurate sound above 100hz. I’ve yet to see a capable (10” or greater with an fs of 35hz or lower) sub reproduce 150hz+ without going into breakup modes, displaying significant IM distortion, or producing a nonlinear response.

If you end up replacing the speakers with sealed powered monitors, you could easily EQ them with equalizer apo using a shelf filter to extend the response, since this is in a desktop setup, headroom shouldn’t be an issue. You might also try plugging the a2s ports with a sock and bumping 80hz, 70hz, and 60hz by 3dB, 6dB, and 9dB respectively using a Q of 2.4.

Another option might be a jbl arena sub 100. The box is tuned to 40hz, and the woofer appears to have a higher resonant frequency, while I haven’t measured it myself, theoretically this should translate to better performance in the upper bass region.


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[tyhjaarpa]

As you are from Europe I think this might be your best bet: http://www.bkelec.com/HiFi/Sub_Woofers/Gemini.htm I have their top of line sealed subs and I have liked them a lot. They have stronger subs as well but those will go over your budget a bit.

edit: Also pair of these could solve your problem https://www.amazon.co.uk/Behringer-B2030A-Reference-Studio-Monitor/dp/B000Q6EHA2/ or the bigger B2031A if you can find a good deal on them to stay within budget.

 

[cheesebrough]

Thank you all for the great advice, i should be able to make a decision with all this information.

Based on your advice i've narrowed down my search, to just looking for a new set of speakers that i can use on my desk, and get away with not buying a sub. Because it has the benefit of freeing up the A2s that i can then use for my TV(where i don't have as many requirements in regard to sound because i only use the tv 2 hours a week or so).

I've been looking at all of the speakers that you guys recommended
- https://www.amazon.co.uk/Behringer-B2030A-Reference-Studio-Monitor/dp/B000Q6EHA2/
- Klipsch R-15
- JBL LSR305

But find it hard to choose. Initially i had hoped i could find any of them in a retail store so i could see and hear them, however i wasn't able to find any that has them in their store, only webshops sadly.

The price seems to be roughly the same, looks don't really matter to me.
Size seems to be roughly the same as well. One thing that i'm wondering about is that 2 of the recommended speakers are monitors, where as one of them, the Klipsch, is a bookshelf speaker.

I've tried researching what the main difference is, and my understanding of it is that the studio monitors are more neutral since they are made for producing, where as a bookshelf speaker is more colored?
At the same time i've read that studio monitors can be more exhausting to listen to over extended periods of time, but i've also read others saying that that is a myth.

So what i want to ask is: When i'm just gonna be using the speakers for listening to music at my desk and not the rest of the room. should i have a preference in regard to searching for a studio monitor or a bookshelf speaker? Or doesn't it matter at all?

 

[everettT]

Thank you all for the great advice, i should be able to make a decision with all this information.

Based on your advice i've narrowed down my search, to just looking for a new set of speakers that i can use on my desk, and get away with not buying a sub. Because it has the benefit of freeing up the A2s that i can then use for my TV(where i don't have as many requirements in regard to sound because i only use the tv 2 hours a week or so).

I've been looking at all of the speakers that you guys recommended
- https://www.amazon.co.uk/Behringer-B2030A-Reference-Studio-Monitor/dp/B000Q6EHA2/
- Klipsch R-15
- JBL LSR305

But find it hard to choose. Initially i had hoped i could find any of them in a retail store so i could see and hear them, however i wasn't able to find any that has them in their store, only webshops sadly.

The price seems to be roughly the same, looks don't really matter to me.
Size seems to be roughly the same as well. One thing that i'm wondering about is that 2 of the recommended speakers are monitors, where as one of them, the Klipsch, is a bookshelf speaker.

I've tried researching what the main difference is, and my understanding of it is that the studio monitors are more neutral since they are made for producing, where as a bookshelf speaker is more colored?
At the same time i've read that studio monitors can be more exhausting to listen to over extended periods of time, but i've also read others saying that that is a myth.

So what i want to ask is: When i'm just gonna be using the speakers for listening to music at my desk and not the rest of the room. should i have a preference in regard to searching for a studio monitor or a bookshelf speaker? Or doesn't it matter at all?

The voicing of studio monitors should be flat, as well as bookshelves, but practically it's not the case. Nearfeild listening can take out some of your room issues that affect sound, but not all.

If wanting a small sub, this one would work for your application

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B001RO1L5Q/ref=mp_s_a_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1507283586&sr=8-4&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=velodyne+subwoofer&dpPl=1&dpID=51mMKZ4A+wL&ref=plSrch

 

[tyhjaarpa]

The voicing of studio monitors should be flat, as well as bookshelves, but practically it's not the case. Nearfeild listening can take out some of your room issues that affect sound, but not all.

If wanting a small sub, this one would work for your application

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B001RO1L5Q/ref=mp_s_a_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1507283586&sr=8-4&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=velodyne+subwoofer&dpPl=1&dpID=51mMKZ4A+wL&ref=plSrch

I think the Gemini I linked is better deal as it is a lot cheaper and very capable sub as well.

Thank you all for the great advice, i should be able to make a decision with all this information.

Based on your advice i've narrowed down my search, to just looking for a new set of speakers that i can use on my desk, and get away with not buying a sub. Because it has the benefit of freeing up the A2s that i can then use for my TV(where i don't have as many requirements in regard to sound because i only use the tv 2 hours a week or so).

I've been looking at all of the speakers that you guys recommended
- https://www.amazon.co.uk/Behringer-B2030A-Reference-Studio-Monitor/dp/B000Q6EHA2/
- Klipsch R-15
- JBL LSR305

But find it hard to choose. Initially i had hoped i could find any of them in a retail store so i could see and hear them, however i wasn't able to find any that has them in their store, only webshops sadly.

The price seems to be roughly the same, looks don't really matter to me.
Size seems to be roughly the same as well. One thing that i'm wondering about is that 2 of the recommended speakers are monitors, where as one of them, the Klipsch, is a bookshelf speaker.

I've tried researching what the main difference is, and my understanding of it is that the studio monitors are more neutral since they are made for producing, where as a bookshelf speaker is more colored?
At the same time i've read that studio monitors can be more exhausting to listen to over extended periods of time, but i've also read others saying that that is a myth.

So what i want to ask is: When i'm just gonna be using the speakers for listening to music at my desk and not the rest of the room. should i have a preference in regard to searching for a studio monitor or a bookshelf speaker? Or doesn't it matter at all?

I hope you noticed, as I forgot to mention about Behringer listing on amazon that it is for single speaker and you will need 2.

I have heard those and they offer really flat response and at least for me they are not fatiguing. They don't look so good but I really like the flat response they have and they go farily deep.

There is nothing wrong using "studio monitors" for normal listening.

 

[cheesebrough]

I think the Gemini I linked is better deal as it is a lot cheaper and very capable sub as well.


I hope you noticed, as I forgot to mention about Behringer listing on amazon that it is for single speaker and you will need 2.

I have heard those and they offer really flat response and at least for me they are not fatiguing. They don't look so good but I really like the flat response they have and they go farily deep.

There is nothing wrong using "studio monitors" for normal listening.

Ah, glad to hear that using studio monitors for normal listening isn't an issue.
Do you guys think any of the 3 speakers mentioned in this thread

- Behringer-B2030A
- Klipsch R-15
- JBL LSR305

Would do better than the others without a subwoofer? I might eventually add a subwoofer, and when that time comes i'll certainly look back at this thread for subwoofer suggestions since that was the original purpose of the thread

But until then, it seems like a good option for my budget to just get a pair of speakers that performs better without a sub compared to my audioengine a2s. I've been reading some reviews of all three speakers and they all get great reviews from what i can see, so i think my choice will come down to which of the 3 would do best without a sub.

 

[tyhjaarpa]

Ah, glad to hear that using studio monitors for normal listening isn't an issue.
Do you guys think any of the 3 speakers mentioned in this thread

- Behringer-B2030A
- Klipsch R-15
- JBL LSR305

Would do better than the others without a subwoofer? I might eventually add a subwoofer, and when that time comes i'll certainly look back at this thread for subwoofer suggestions since that was the original purpose of the thread

But until then, it seems like a good option for my budget to just get a pair of speakers that performs better without a sub compared to my audioengine a2s. I've been reading some reviews of all three speakers and they all get great reviews from what i can see, so i think my choice will come down to which of the 3 would do best without a sub.

I have not heard the 2 other, but B2030A has quite good authority on bass in my experience. I would say that the R-15 is weakest on bass by looking the specs. LSR305 has smaller woofer than B2030A but by spec they claim to go lower, but how accurate those manufacturer numbers are is a different story. I would say you cant go wrong with either. For music they both should go low enough how ever.

 

[cheesebrough]

I have not heard the 2 other, but B2030A has quite good authority on bass in my experience. I would say that the R-15 is weakest on bass by looking the specs. LSR305 has smaller woofer than B2030A but by spec they claim to go lower, but how accurate those manufacturer numbers are is a different story. I would say you cant go wrong with either. For music they both should go low enough how ever.

I'm going to keep researching a bit but if there's not a huge difference between the JBL LSR305 and the Behringer B2030A, i'll probably just end up getting the JBLs just because those are available from a european site i've dealt with before and has great costumer support.

Once again thanks to everyone for the elaborate advice

One last thing i would like to ask, do i need any other external equipment (like a DAC forexample) if i decided on the JBLs or the B2030A? I currently use the soundcard in my motherboard which is ASUS Z97-A

 

[tyhjaarpa]

I'm going to keep researching a bit but if there's not a huge difference between the JBL LSR305 and the Behringer B2030A, i'll probably just end up getting the JBLs just because those are available from a european site i've dealt with before and has great costumer support.

Once again thanks to everyone for the elaborate advice

One last thing i would like to ask, do i need any other external equipment (like a DAC forexample) if i decided on the JBLs or the B2030A? I currently use the soundcard in my motherboard which is ASUS Z97-A

I personally have used Amazon quite a lot without any issues and their support is quite good as well. And no, dac is not necessary. It could improve sound quality how ever.

 

[yepimonfire]

I personally have used Amazon quite a lot without any issues and their support is quite good as well. And no, dac is not necessary. It could improve sound quality how ever.

Many onboard audio sections are very noisy and display a lot of jitter ime. Something inexpensive like a fiio dac should work quite well.


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[yepimonfire]

I'm going to keep researching a bit but if there's not a huge difference between the JBL LSR305 and the Behringer B2030A, i'll probably just end up getting the JBLs just because those are available from a european site i've dealt with before and has great costumer support.

Once again thanks to everyone for the elaborate advice

One last thing i would like to ask, do i need any other external equipment (like a DAC forexample) if i decided on the JBLs or the B2030A? I currently use the soundcard in my motherboard which is ASUS Z97-A

The Jbl actually have better bass extension and dispersion control.


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[tyhjaarpa]

The Jbl actually have better bass extension and dispersion control.


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Do you have measurements to support this? As manufacturer specs might not be accurate.

Many onboard audio sections are very noisy and display a lot of jitter ime. Something inexpensive like a fiio dac should work quite well.


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That is true, but some onboards do quite well actually.