Onkyo S7705 bass not being handled by subwoofer in direct

[dave431978]

Hi,
I own this pretty basic package. Nothing amazing, pretty stock standard department store stuff.
http://www.eu.onkyo.com/en/products/ht-s7705-118373.html
Had it for over a year now.
Anyhow. One thing i've never been able to work out. Is why the subwoofer won't engage most of the time in the direct setting & handle a majority of the bass channel. Only if it's set to stereo or one of the settings with processing, does the subwoofer stay on all the time & handle the bass. This is not ideal when watching movies. Or even anything if i want to leave it in direct. Subwoofer does not engage at all if i have my PC connected & am listening to music in the direct setting. All the bass seems to come only from the two front speakers. This seems pretty useless. I've tried to ring the people that handle Onkyo here in Australia & they were no help & couldn't really answer my question & i've played with the settings endlessly & tried absolutely everything under the sun.
A friend of mine seems to think it's one of two things. That 1) It's a bass reflex subwoofer & i need to change the subwoofer.
Or 2) the amp can run two subwoofers & two need to be connected in order for sub to handle bass al the time & for it to be engaged all the time.
I thought maybe you guys might be more equipped to answer my question & solve my dilemma.

Cheers,
Dave

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

When "direct" mode is engaged, the avr disables all audio processing including bass management. The idea is that you get the purest playback. Theoretically... if you want the sub on you'll have to use stereo, or pro logic music/movie mode. Not sure how changing the subwoofer would help. What does your friend say about that?

 

[dave431978]

Okay. That's weird. Because my understanding is that most surround systems always have the sub handling the bass channel with films. This is definitely the case when you go see a movie in a theatre. Even the older films (which is almost my entire library) that have only stereo & mono tracks. So front speakers or centre speaker handing everything except bass & then sub handling bass.
I'm not particularly a fan of the audio settings with post processing. They aren't an accurate representation of how the film is mixed. And without the sub there is almost zero bass. It sounds like it's coming out of a TV speaker. It kind of makes the sound system useless really.
My friend says his subwoofer is always on with his Yamaha system. Even in direct.
Sounds like i bought a package with a receiver that doesn't do what i want.

 

[shadyJ]

First of all, your friend doesn't know what he is talking about. You can safely ignore his advice from here on out.

Secondly, the 'direct' mode will only amplify what it is fed. If your computer is only sending it stereo signal, it will only amplify those two channels. You will need to send it an LFE signal in order for it to send a signal to the subwoofer. Is your computer's sound output set to a 5.1 or 2.1 or x.1 type system? If not, the subwoofer will not be working. You need to look into your computer's sound interface configuration and make sure it is set to an "x".1 setup.

 

[dave431978]

I tried playing with the settings relating to LFE when i first bought it & it changed nothing with the output.
Also in the PC's sound settings i had it configured to 5.1 which also didn't change the output in direct. Strangely though from time to time after a restart the PC seemed to throw the settings back to the default stereo. Not after every restart, but it's an intermittent problem which drives me up the wall. Because i'll go in & check the settings every now & then & it's automatically changed it back.
I only use my PC for listening to music whether it be CD or MP3.
I should note though. That IF the AVR is on the stereo setting, there is a one second delay before the light comes on on the subwoofer & engages when there is low frequency. I absolutely hate this. So say for example song comes on. There is a guitar intro, no bass. Then drums & bass kick in. A second later the blue light on the subwoofer comes on & you can hear bass through the sub. It's really crappy. That's possibly what my friend was referring to with the reflex bass thing.
With movies though i only watch them through my bluray player. Strictly physical media. Despite the endless hours of playing with settings, i've been completely unable to get what i want out of it. Just not happy with it.

 

[lovinthehd]

I tried playing with the settings relating to LFE when i first bought it & it changed nothing with the output.
Also in the PC's sound settings i had it configured to 5.1 which also didn't change the output in direct. Strangely though from time to time after a restart the PC seemed to throw the settings back to the default stereo. Not after every restart, but it's an intermittent problem which drives me up the wall. Because i'll go in & check the settings every now & then & it's automatically changed it back.
I only use my PC for listening to music whether it be CD or MP3.
I should note though. That IF the AVR is on the stereo setting, there is a one second delay before the light comes on on the subwoofer & engages when there is low frequency. I absolutely hate this. So say for example song comes on. There is a guitar intro, no bass. Then drums & bass kick in. A second later the blue light on the subwoofer comes on & you can hear bass through the sub. It's really crappy. That's possibly what my friend was referring to with the reflex bass thing.
With movies though i only watch them through my bluray player. Strictly physical media. Despite the endless hours of playing with settings, i've been completely unable to get what i want out of it. Just not happy with it.

Your expectations may not line up with your current gear's capabilities. Sounds like you have your sub on auto-on, just leave it in the "on" setting full time if you don't want a delay while it detects signal....

Direct varies in implementation, some will allow use of sub on sources that do not have a .1/LFE channel, some will initiate bass management for use in stereo mode...

 

[dave431978]

Mine doesn't have a sub auto-on or "on" setting as far as i can remember.

 

[Tankman]

Not much for me to add here cause the posts above pretty much hits the nail on the head. So I will just kick back in here cause the ole timers are giving out great tips and advice to the OP.
Mike

 

[TLS Guy]

I can't find any useful information on that HTIB package. It does not show on the list of Onkyo's supported products. So there is no manual to download.

Your first mistake was buying an HTIB. You won't get quality performance from an HTIB.

I suspect in Direct mode no signal is sent to the sub.

My best guess is that you need to set the speaker sub crossover and play it in stereo.

The best advice I can give you is to ditch that rig, and build a decent component system piece by piece.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

A point to consider about your friends Yamaha is their "direct" mode is called "straight". That's why his sub works in direct mode.

 

[Mark of Cenla]

In some AVR's in the audio settings one has to tell it to use the sub when in direct mode. Maybe yours will not do that.
The fact that your sub is a "bass-reflex" speaker has nothing to do with your problem. My Sony subs automatically come on when there is a signal, and that takes a few seconds. There is a setting on the back for that. Your sub may have it, and it may not.
Just play your music in whatever mode uses the sub. As suggested above, you may want to upgrade a little at a time. Peace and goodwill.

 

[Reuben Ahing]

I'm on my iPad and wanna sign in.


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[dave431978]

Thanks for all the input guys. Sounds like the receiver is too limited in settings customization & isn't suited to my needs. Perhaps a new stand alone receiver might be my best cause of action. Sounds like the Yamaha's are best for needs with the straight mode.

 

[lovinthehd]

Thanks for all the input guys. Sounds like the receiver is too limited in settings customization & isn't suited to my needs. Perhaps a new stand alone receiver might be my best cause of action. Sounds like the Yamaha's are best for needs with the straight mode.

I doubt it is the receiver causing your delay issue, it's a fairly standard featured receiver (an Onkyo HT-R693) and according to the manual the sub should operate in stereo mode. More likely the sub's sensing circuit causing the bass turn on delay. Now, if you want an avr to operate the sub in "direct" mode (why I don't know) then you'll have to review manuals very carefully....some won't do it or only under certain circumstances.

Why are you trying to use direct mode particularly?

 

[dave431978]

I doubt it is the receiver causing your delay issue, it's a fairly standard featured receiver (an Onkyo HT-R693) and according to the manual the sub should operate in stereo mode. More likely the sub's sensing circuit causing the bass turn on delay. Now, if you want an avr to operate the sub in "direct" mode (why I don't know) then you'll have to review manuals very carefully....some won't do it or only under certain circumstances.

Why are you trying to use direct mode particularly?

Because when watching a bluray with only a stereo or mono track in direct, it sounds about as good as a TV speaker for lack of a better description. Very little bass through the front or centre speakers, even with all the tweaking that can be done. It's nothing like watching a classic film with a stereo or mono track in a theatre. Which sounds a lot bigger. A lot more low end where needed and clearly a sub handling most of the low end stuff. Basically i just want the soundtrack as is without any processing, but have the sub handle some of the low end stuff, that to my ears doesn't sound like it's meant for the front or centre speakers.

 

[lovinthehd]

Because when watching a bluray with only a stereo or mono track in direct, it sounds about as good as a TV speaker for lack of a better description. Very little bass through the front or centre speakers, even with all the tweaking that can be done. It's nothing like watching a classic film with a stereo or mono track in a theatre. Which sounds a lot bigger. A lot more low end where needed and clearly a sub handling most of the low end stuff. Basically i just want the soundtrack as is without any processing, but have the sub handle some of the low end stuff, that to my ears doesn't sound like it's meant for the front or centre speakers.

Having a sub on a mono or stereo track IS processing, or upmixing your 1.0 or 2.0 soundtracks to 5.1. You can limit the amount of the processing, but you'll still end up using some processing when using a sub with bass management on any source that doesn't have a ".1" (LFE) track. Can't help you with mono, never deal with it in terms of bass management, not sure that's an option on any of my avrs. You still have processing to determine correct delays/levels at your seating position, too. Direct is only so meaningful depending on your source....

 

[Mark of Cenla]

With some AVR's one must use some processing to use the sub. There may be no way to get around that with what you have. You must decide which is more important to you, no processing or using the sub.