Emotiva A-700 vs outlaw model 5000 vs adcom GFA-7607

[Denis Fontaine]

Hello everybody!

First of all, here is the list of my current setup so that you can help me better.

- 1 Denon avr 3313
- 6 JM-Lab bookshel fChorus 705
- 1 JM-lab center Chorus 700
- 2 Paradigm PDR-100 subwoofer
- 1 Sony PS4.

I ran into a little problem with my reciever.. if i crank the volume to loud, my receiver clips and shutdown to prevent damage..wich is a good thing, but a bit frustrating when it happen in the middle of an awesome action scene. I want to prevent that and improve the quality of sound at the same time.

I went to my local hi-fi dealer and i can't afford any of his amps. He proposed me an older model in his second hand section. It's an adcom GFA-7607 for 899 $ canadian dollars ( about 660$us) I can't find much information about this amp wich was made in 2004 i think. Frankly, i lack knowledge about amps in general. I dont want to buy something that could blow up my speaker or not power them enough.

i narrow down my choice to 2 amps beside the one my local dealer proposed me.

1- The Outlaw 5000 for 599$us (https://www.outlawaudio.com/products/5000.html) The downside is that it's only a 5 channels. I could run 2 speaker from my receiver..but i worry about the damping factor difference.

2- The Emotiva A-700for 599$us (https://emotiva.com/products/amplifiers/700) This one seems perfect since it's a 7 channel and the damping factor is much higher than the outlaw but i thinks it's a bit less powerfull than the outlaw all channel driven

3- The adcom GFA-7607 for 660$us wich i dont know much about... except that it's older and secnod hand. But it's available right now.. no shipping cost and no costums to deal with.

I dont know wich to choose between the power rating vs damping factor and all the rest of the specs that i dont know what it means!

Please help!

Tkanks

 

[lovinthehd]

Damping factor article you might want to read http://www.audioholics.com/audio-amplifier/damping-factor-effects-on-system-response

Consider it takes a doubling of amp power to gain merely 3dB spl, so small power rating differences among amps aren't very meaningful.

 

[Denis Fontaine]

Damping factor article you might want to read http://www.audioholics.com/audio-amplifier/damping-factor-effects-on-system-response

Consider it takes a doubling of amp power to gain merely 3dB spl, so small power rating differences among amps aren't very meaningful.

Thanks, so.. it's a bit too technical for me but from what i understand is that i should not care much about the damping factor( i will read it again tonight to try understand more). Also, the difference of watts Per channel all driven betwen the outlaw and emotiva will not be big enough to see a difference? Fore shure i will see a difference between my denon receiver vs any of the outlaw and emotiva since i think i dont get much more than 40-50 watts maybe ( like gene says.. the power rating on those receiver are always boost up ). So if i can't look at damping factor or watts ( frankly, i dont need my system to go louder than it already is haha..) what can help determine wich amp is better for me?

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

What's the return policy from your dealer? If he allows a return at no cost, you could try the Adcom amp.

I am curious to know the volume (dB using SPL meter) and distance you were listening to when the AVR-3313 clipped.

I have a Denon AVR-3311 that I used to power a pair of $3K USD Focal 826v towers in my previous 18x20x10 room. Absolutely no problem.

 

[Denis Fontaine]

Hi, unfortunatly, i dont have an spl meter, i'm in a relative small room. about 12 feet wide and 16 feet deep by 8-9 feet high wich makes my spearker quite close.. especially my surround speaker wich are about 5 feet for the sides and 3.5 feet for the rears. about 11feet for the front speakers.

i admit it was fairly loud but not enough to be annoying.. My receiver has enough air flow so i dont think it can be from getting too hot?

I notice that i had to crank up the volume about 70% to 80% on the receiver to get the volume i wanted. Of course i can listen lower than that.. but where is the fun in that.... HAHAH just kidding but i love to have a bit of punch !

What's the return policy from your dealer? If he allows a return at no cost, you could try the Adcom amp.

I am curious to know the volume (dB using SPL meter) and distance you were listening to when the AVR-3313 clipped.

I have a Denon AVR-3311 that I used to power a pair of $3K USD Focal towers (I think 826v) in my previous 18x20x10 room. Absolutely no problem.

What's the return policy from your dealer? If he allows a return at no cost, you could try the Adcom amp.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Another thing - the Focal 705 is rated for up to 100W. You may be at risk of blowing the tweeters if you keep up the volume. So probably the Denon is doing you a huge favor by shutting off. Otherwise, the speakers might have been fried.

So you could try more power, like 200W, which is 100W over the recommended power (double the power = 3dB louder), but you are putting your speakers at risk of damage.

If you want to play a lot louder, you will have to get new speakers. But is this HEALTHY for you?

 

[lovinthehd]

Thanks, so.. it's a bit too technical for me but from what i understand is that i should not care much about the damping factor( i will read it again tonight to try understand more). Also, the difference of watts Per channel all driven betwen the outlaw and emotiva will not be big enough to see a difference? Fore shure i will see a difference between my denon receiver vs any of the outlaw and emotiva since i think i dont get much more than 40-50 watts maybe ( like gene says.. the power rating on those receiver are always boost up ). So if i can't look at damping factor or watts ( frankly, i dont need my system to go louder than it already is haha..) what can help determine wich amp is better for me?

Yes, most ss amps are fine on their damping factor. Don't know if amp sections same, but here's the bench test for the 3312 https://www.soundandvision.com/content/denon-avr-3312ci-av-receiver-ht-labs-measures

More powerful amps provide more spl and headroom, sound quality shouldn't be a factor between your Denon's amps and an external amp. You might also think about getting something like a Crown XLS1502 (or two).

 

[lovinthehd]

Hi, unfortunatly, i dont have an spl meter, i'm in a relative small room. about 12 feet wide and 16 feet deep by 8-9 feet high wich makes my spearker quite close.. especially my surround speaker wich are about 5 feet for the sides and 3.5 feet for the rears. about 11feet for the front speakers.

i admit it was fairly loud but not enough to be annoying.. My receiver has enough air flow so i dont think it can be from getting too hot?

I notice that i had to crank up the volume about 70% to 80% on the receiver to get the volume i wanted. Of course i can listen lower than that.. but where is the fun in that.... HAHAH just kidding but i love to have a bit of punch !

70 to 80% translates to what on the calibrated master volume readings when you're running into trouble? The dB scale isn't a percentage thing, it's logarithmic. If you calibrated with Audyssey the actual master volume reading would be helpful information.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Hi, unfortunatly, i dont have an spl meter, i'm in a relative small room. about 12 feet wide and 16 feet deep by 8-9 feet high wich makes my spearker quite close.. especially my surround speaker wich are about 5 feet for the sides and 3.5 feet for the rears. about 11feet for the front speakers.

i admit it was fairly loud but not enough to be annoying.. My receiver has enough air flow so i dont think it can be from getting too hot?

I notice that i had to crank up the volume about 70% to 80% on the receiver to get the volume i wanted. Of course i can listen lower than that.. but where is the fun in that.... HAHAH just kidding but i love to have a bit of punch !

Get 2 x 120mm or 150mm USB fans and hook them atop your Denon. Yes, it could be the HEAT that is causing the AVR to shut off!

My Denon 3311 SHUT off once when it got too hot during a party. But I fixed that with 3 x 120mm USB fans.

 

[Denis Fontaine]

haha...well.. i definilty do not want to blow my speakers.. the emotiva is rated a 80 watts per channel all driven.... but considering what you guys are telling me, i guess i dont need an amp? just get use to listen at lower volume? hahaha

Another thing - the Focal 705 is rated for up to 100W. You may be at risk of blowing the tweeters if you keep up the volume. So probably the Denon is doing you a huge favor by shutting off. Otherwise, the speakers might have been fried.

So you could try more power, like 200W, which is 100W over the recommended power (double the power = 3dB louder), but you are putting your speakers at risk of damage.

Another thing - the Focal 705 is rated for up to 100W. You may be at risk of blowing the tweeters if you keep up the volume. So probably the Denon is doing you a huge favor by shutting off. Otherwise, the speakers might have been fried.

 

[Denis Fontaine]

I'm at work right now, when i get home in 2hrs i will try to make it clip and used at least an spl meter from my iphone...better than nothing i guess. also, is making my amp clip like that on purpuse or by acccident.. can i damage it??
Dont want to blow the receiver trying to solve the problem! hehehe

P.S thank you guys, i reallly appreciate the help and forgive my english, it's not my first language!

70 to 80% translates to what on the calibrated master volume readings when you're running into trouble? The dB scale isn't a percentage thing, it's logarithmic. If you calibrated with Audyssey the actual master volume reading would be helpful information.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

haha...well.. i definilty do not want to blow my speakers.. the emotiva is rated a 80 watts per channel all driven.... but considering what you guys are telling me, i guess i dont need an amp? just get use to listen at lower volume? hahaha

Try some fans first. See if heat is the problem.

 

[mpitogo2000]

I own a Marantz SR7009 and while it's not exactly the same as your Denon it is from the same company and the basic designs are the same. Mine runs hot especially with all 9 channels pumping out volume. I purchased this for cooling and hopefully longer life.

http://www.acinfinity.com/component-fan-systems/aircom-s8-receiver-and-av-component-cooling-blower-system-17-inch/

 

[Pogre]

I own a Marantz SR7009 and while it's not exactly the same as your Denon it is from the same company and the basic designs are the same. Mine runs hot especially with all 9 channels pumping out volume. I purchased this for cooling and hopefully longer life.

http://www.acinfinity.com/component-fan-systems/aircom-s8-receiver-and-av-component-cooling-blower-system-17-inch/

I had this same idea only with a laptop cooling pad.

 

[mpitogo2000]

@Porge didn't think about laptop cooling pad.

I went for the AirCom for three reasons 1) looked decent 2) option to exhaust to the back and 3) has the smart temp function which turns the fan on at 85°.

The S8 unit I have has 4 speed settings and much like other reviewers speed 1 and 2 are ok but 3 and 4 can get a loud but I guess would be ok in enclosed cabinets. The with my system on the speed typically on at 1 and I've never seen it ramp up to 2.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I own a Marantz SR7009 and while it's not exactly the same as your Denon it is from the same company and the basic designs are the same. Mine runs hot especially with all 9 channels pumping out volume. I purchased this for cooling and hopefully longer life.

http://www.acinfinity.com/component-fan-systems/aircom-s8-receiver-and-av-component-cooling-blower-system-17-inch/

Looks much better (and doesn't cost that much more) than putting 3 x 120 mm fans atop the AVR.

Have you measured the Before-vs-After temperature of the AVR using this cooling? Or at least the temp of the AVR after a few hours while using this cooling?

 

[mpitogo2000]

I have not except by feel.. after one all channel driven heavy listening session I touched the top panel and it was hot enough to fry some eggs. I was shock it did not fry itself and shutoff. Now the top panel is very cool. I would assume 85 enough to trigger the fan on but less than 87 the next speed step.

@Denis Fontaine you should try cooling the Denon first. My older Denon AVR4802R never ran as hot as this newer stuff.

 

[Pogre]

@Porge didn't think about laptop cooling pad.

I went for the AirCom for three reasons 1) looked decent 2) option to exhaust to the back and 3) has the smart temp function which turns the fan on at 85°.

The S8 unit I have has 4 speed settings and much like other reviewers speed 1 and 2 are ok but 3 and 4 can get a loud but I guess would be ok in enclosed cabinets. The with my system on the speed typically on at 1 and I've never seen it ramp up to 2.

Oh yes, it looks a lot nicer than a cheap laptop cooling pad. Blends nicely with most systems. If I had a heat issue I'd consider one of those for sure. The features you're talking about are pretty cool too.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I have not except by feel.. after one all channel driven heavy listening session I touched the top panel and it was hot enough to fry some eggs. I was shock it did not fry itself and shutoff. Now the top panel is very cool. I would assume 85 enough to trigger the fan on but less than 87 the next speed step.

@Denis Fontaine you should try cooling the Denon first. My older Denon AVR4802R never ran as hot as this newer stuff.

Definitely a great invention and should be recommended to everyone buying AVR, especially Onkyo.

I am thinking of buying them for my Denon 3311 and 3312.