Hello needing advice before purchase

[nschillin]

First let me say hello as I am new to the forum.

I have paradigm studio 100(V3) with matching center I currently am using Yamaha rxz1 receiver and Oppo 105 for movies and music played on a Samsung un65hu8550 LED all being protected by panamax 5500 power conditioner, I am also using two paradigm sw2200(V2). My question is Outlaw has a shopping combo to buy 7140 amp 975 processor and Oppo 203 for $1849 is there a better deal on something else like this that I am not aware of my goals are to make my speakers sound like when I bought them my current amp does not make them come alive. I was already planning on buying the Oppo 203 for the 4K any thoughts would be appreciated so that I do not make a mistake purchasing.

 

[everettT]

If you don't need any of the new object based audio formats, it's a nice setup. Power wise your Yamaha is fairly close the outlaw.

 

[nschillin]

I was thinking of bi-amping two of the channels to both L/R do you think it would be better to go with Emotiva XPA Gen 3 or Monolith both can be had at a reasonable price?

 

[everettT]

I was thinking of bi-amping two of the channels to both L/R do you think it would be better to go with Emotiva XPA Gen 3 or Monolith both can be had at a reasonable price?

I'm of the opinion that biamping passively in most cases yields little if any. As for the two amps, I liked the audioholics review, and on the spec side really performed better than the advertised factory listed. This and the cost factor makes it a great value

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

The monolith seems like a real good value. I wouldn't waste any time or cable to bi/amping/wiring.

 

[Bucknekked]

First let me say hello as I am new to the forum.

I have paradigm studio 100(V3) with matching center I currently am using Yamaha rxz1 receiver and Oppo 105 for movies and music played on a Samsung un65hu8550 LED all being protected by panamax 5500 power conditioner, I am also using two paradigm sw2200(V2). My question is Outlaw has a shopping combo to buy 7140 amp 975 processor and Oppo 203 for $1849 is there a better deal on something else like this that I am not aware of my goals are to make my speakers sound like when I bought them my current amp does not make them come alive. I was already planning on buying the Oppo 203 for the 4K any thoughts would be appreciated so that I do not make a mistake purchasing.

welcome, welcome to the forum. Its great to see people ask questions BEFORE the purchase. Way better outcomes are possible.

Biamping = no benefit.

It think the other stuff got covered. Welcome and enjoy all the good info available here.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

This is worth a read:
When to Add a Power Amplifier to an A/V Receiver
Tip: your Paradigm speakers have minimal impedance of 2.5ohm (less than 4) and 89db sensitivity (so less than 90) - this might help you to decide if you need an amp or not.

After that whole bunch of good writeups here:
http://www.audioholics.com/home-theater-setup/allContents

 

[MrBoat]

Has anything else changed since you first got your speakers? A move, perhaps? How big of a room etc?

 

[lovinthehd]

What is your power conditioner protecting you from? You could buy better components without spending money on more than a surge protector in the form of a power strip.

I also wonder what has changed as to why you think your speakers aren't performing as well as they used to....different room first came to mind.

 

[Verdinut]

This is worth a read:
When to Add a Power Amplifier to an A/V Receiver
Tip: your Paradigm speakers have minimal impedance of 2.5ohm (less than 4) and 89db sensitivity (so less than 90) - this might help you to decide if you need an amp or not.

After that whole bunch of good writeups here:
http://www.audioholics.com/home-theater-setup/allContents

I don't know much about those Paradigm speakers, but if their impedance dips to 2.5 ohms below 250 Hz, then it might be a good idea to actively bi-amp the L & R front speakers with good pro amps, for instance, which will easily handle the low impedance and with electronic crossovers. However, if the impedance dip is above 250 Hz, I wouldn't see the necessity to spend on additional electronics.

 

[Verdinut]

Well, I've just perused a Stereophile review of the Paradigm Studios V3. The impedance dip is right at 100 Hz or so. They demand an amplifier which can provide sufficient current. This means a strong reliable power supply, either linear or of the switching type.

It seems obvious that the Yamaha RX-Z1 receiver is unable to adequately drive those loudspeakers. If it has preamp-outs, then the solution would be to drive them with a more powerful external amp. You have to make sure that the new amp will be able to handle the low impedance load.

If the OP doesn't want to spend an outrageous sum for the external amps, my suggestion would be to go for a good pro audio amp, such as a QSC, which is available at an affordable price. For instance, the RMX850a would be good and the DCA 1222 is even better but more expensive. This DCA Series amp can drive an impedance of 1.6 ohms. Those amps have variable speed fans; if you're sitting too close, there is a possibility that you might hear it. This also depends on what type of music and how loud someone listens to it etc.

 

[TLS Guy]

Well, I've just perused a Stereophile review of the Paradigm Studios V3. The impedance dip is right at 100 Hz or so. They demand an amplifier which can provide sufficient current. This means a strong reliable power supply, either linear or of the switching type.

You have to be very suspicious of a speaker with an impedance curve like that. There are three woofers with a low low pass point around 200 Hz. I don't know what the DC resistance of the speakers is, but it is quite likely higher than 2.5 ohms. If a speaker's impedance drops below the DC resistance of the drivers, then the crossover is resonating. In addition the phase angles are also very negative in that region of the impedance dip. There is also a significant rise in the response.

My strong suspicion is that the crossover is in resonance. From and audio point this is a very bad thing. I would not be at all happy if I designed a speaker with an impedance curve like that.

I have heard those speakers. My Minneapolis dealer had them for a while, but they could not stand the competition from their other brands. I thought they sounded awful. The were fizzy on the top end with the bass not well controlled at all. It was very muddy and really obscured any detail the speaker might have had. I would put my money on that design being incompetent and the crossover resonating.

I suspect the OP has gradually realized those speakers are not as good as he first thought. I highly doubt an amp change will solve his problem.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

http://www.stereophile.com/content/paradigm-reference-studio100-v3-loudspeaker-measurements

 

[Verdinut]

You have to be very suspicious of a speaker with an impedance curve like that. There are three woofers with a low low pass point around 200 Hz. I don't know what the DC resistance of the speakers is, but it is quite likely higher than 2.5 ohms. If a speaker's impedance drops below the DC resistance of the drivers, then the crossover is resonating. In addition the phase angles are also very negative in that region of the impedance dip. There is also a significant rise in the response.

My strong suspicion is that the crossover is in resonance. From and audio point this is a very bad thing. I would not be at all happy if I designed a speaker with an impedance curve like that.

I have heard those speakers. My Minneapolis dealer had them for a while, but they could not stand the competition from their other brands. I thought they sounded awful. The were fizzy on the top end with the bass not well controlled at all. It was very muddy and really obscured any detail the speaker might have had. I would put my money on that design being incompetent and the crossover resonating.

I suspect the OP has gradually realized those speakers are not as good as he first thought. I highly doubt an amp change will solve his problem.

I agree with you with regard to the impedance curve. You and I know how to build good passive crossovers, but not all speaker manufacturers have the skilled people to design a filter which shows a more linear impedance curve, or they don't want to spend the required time to obtain a decent result.

Have a look at the photo of my Avatar. This the curve of an MTM speaker which I built several years ago. Not many professional speaker manufacturers can come with as good impedance and phase angle curves.

It is always of outmost importance to listen carefully to a lot of speakers, and even preferable to be able to borrow some to hear at home with electronics at hand, before deciding on which one to purchase.

 

[Verdinut]

You have to be very suspicious of a speaker with an impedance curve like that. There are three woofers with a low low pass point around 200 Hz. I don't know what the DC resistance of the speakers is, but it is quite likely higher than 2.5 ohms. If a speaker's impedance drops below the DC resistance of the drivers, then the crossover is resonating. In addition the phase angles are also very negative in that region of the impedance dip. There is also a significant rise in the response.

My strong suspicion is that the crossover is in resonance. From and audio point this is a very bad thing. I would not be at all happy if I designed a speaker with an impedance curve like that.

I have heard those speakers. My Minneapolis dealer had them for a while, but they could not stand the competition from their other brands. I thought they sounded awful. The were fizzy on the top end with the bass not well controlled at all. It was very muddy and really obscured any detail the speaker might have had. I would put my money on that design being incompetent and the crossover resonating.

I suspect the OP has gradually realized those speakers are not as good as he first thought. I highly doubt an amp change will solve his problem.

Either the crossover is resonating as you suspect, either the 3 woofers are connected in parallel which might also explain the low impedance.

 

[shadyJ]

The impedance curve is a bit problematic, but the frequency response isn't that bad. I would prefer a flatter response ideally but that is one that I don't think would sound bad. The most serious problem to me is the spike off-axis right above 10 kHz. However, it's such a narrow spike that it might not be very noticeable.

 

[jcparks]

Haha I love you guys... I have been reading the forum for years and I can sort of follow what you wrote. If the OP is anything close to me however, yall just went way above his head. Basically the crossover from a multimillion dollar speaker designer was not designed correctly and the speakers suffer because of this. You guys are specilating that the OP may just be realizing the short comings of his speakers... Damn Canadians need to invest in better audio physicists...

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[Verdinut]

The impedance curve is a bit problematic, but the frequency response isn't that bad. I would prefer a flatter response ideally but that is one that I don't think would sound bad. The most serious problem to me is the spike off-axis right above 10 kHz. However, it's such a narrow spike that it might not be very noticeable.

Would you be inclined to think that the use of a more powerful external high current amplifier would counteract to a certain extent the badly designed crossover and solve the OP's problem?

 

[Verdinut]

Haha I love you guys... I have been reading the forum for years and I can sort of follow what you wrote. If the OP is anything close to me however, yall just went way above his head. Basically the crossover from a multimillion dollar speaker designer was not designed correctly and the speakers suffer because of this. You guys are specilating that the OP may just be realizing the short comings of his speakers... Damn Canadians need to invest in better audio physicists...

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You don't need to be an audio physicist to properly design a passive crossover.

I am not an engineer either, but I know how to build a smooth crossover, and I am also a Canadian FYI.

Many people and many speaker builders as well, don't realize that even the best transducers in a cabinet won't perform well with badly designed crossovers. These filters are as important as the proper matching of loudspeakers for a smooth frequency response.

 

[jcparks]

I was joking as paradigm, if I remember correctly, is a Canadian company. I was not trying to offend. My post was more pointed to the fact that, as a hobbiest I have spent more then a few hours learning how speakers work, and even assembled a few pre-designed kits. With this know how I am able to follow the posts here, however, while the OP may have a lot of knowledge, there is also good chance he doesn't, and so the technical posts can be somewhat challenging to follow.

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