Might a Better Phone Stage Be the Answer for Me?

[Mark Ricotta]

Hi All. . . I first wish to thank everyone for their support and information when I was purchasing my system about a year ago. I ended up with a pair of GoldenEar Triton 5 speakers and Rotel RA-1570 integrated amp. I added that equipment to my already owned Pioneer Model PL-550 turntable with Denon DL-110 cartridge along with my Oppo BDP-105D. Also I use a Music Fidelity V-LPS phono stage.

I get a nice, neutral, clean sound with this setup. But I like loud rock music once in awhile, louder than my setup can cleanly produce (as far as I know) principally when I use my turntable. I play a lot of 120 and 180 gram LPs. I have to turn my volume on the Rotel up to 66 to get a volume level that is pleasing (when using the turntable. . .especially for rock music, which I listen to 50% of the time). Any higher on volume and distortion starts creeping in. (The Triton Fives have a recommended amplification of 15-400 watts.)

My question may reveal a bit of lack of knowledge, but you guys help me all the time and I appreciate it.

So I'm thinking replacing the V-LPS phono stage with the Pro-Ject Tube Box II, thinking the gain is higher than the V-LPS and will give me the increased volume, but still maintaining an extremely low distortion floor. If you think a new phono stage is the answer, what might you recommend under $750? The Pro-Ject, which uses two tubes?

Basically, I'd like increased volume when I play LPs. Any other suggestions? The Rotel, I believe, allows me to connect a power amplifier. Might that be a better solution? If soo, I think I'd go for a 250-300 watt power amplifier, but then I'm looking at about $2,500-$3,000...more than I can afford right now. (The Rotel is rated at 120 watts.)

Thank you all once again. I really value and appreciate your suggestions.

I've attached a photo of my listening area for your evaluation with request to my questions.

Respectfully,

Mark

 

[Swerd]

Your Denon DL-110 cartridge has a low output, 1.6 mV, for an moving magnet cartridge. This is lower than the 3.0 mV input sensitivity of your present Music Fidelity phono pre-amp. That might explain the lack of volume you described with LPs.

Instead of a different phono pre-amp, replace your cartridge with a moving magnet cartridge with greater output, such as the Shure M97 (4 mV) http://www.needledoctor.com/Shure-M97XE?sc=2&category=380

Another well-regarded cartridge would be the Ortofon 2M Red (5.5 mV) http://www.needledoctor.com/Ortofon-2M-Red-Phono-Cartridge?sc=2&category=378

 

[lovinthehd]

You could also just try the phono input on your Rotel, it has closer sensitivity than your external unit.

 

[TLS Guy]

View attachment 19298 Hi All. . . I first wish to thank everyone for their support and information when I was purchasing my system about a year ago. I ended up with a pair of GoldenEar Triton 5 speakers and Rotel RA-1570 integrated amp. I added that equipment to my already owned Pioneer Model PL-550 turntable with Denon DL-110 cartridge along with my Oppo BDP-105D. Also I use a Music Fidelity V-LPS phono stage.

I get a nice, neutral, clean sound with this setup. But I like loud rock music once in awhile, louder than my setup can cleanly produce (as far as I know) principally when I use my turntable. I play a lot of 120 and 180 gram LPs. I have to turn my volume on the Rotel up to 66 to get a volume level that is pleasing (when using the turntable. . .especially for rock music, which I listen to 50% of the time). Any higher on volume and distortion starts creeping in. (The Triton Fives have a recommended amplification of 15-400 watts.)

My question may reveal a bit of lack of knowledge, but you guys help me all the time and I appreciate it.

So I'm thinking replacing the V-LPS phono stage with the Pro-Ject Tube Box II, thinking the gain is higher than the V-LPS and will give me the increased volume, but still maintaining an extremely low distortion floor. If you think a new phono stage is the answer, what might you recommend under $750? The Pro-Ject, which uses two tubes?

Basically, I'd like increased volume when I play LPs. Any other suggestions? The Rotel, I believe, allows me to connect a power amplifier. Might that be a better solution? If soo, I think I'd go for a 250-300 watt power amplifier, but then I'm looking at about $2,500-$3,000...more than I can afford right now. (The Rotel is rated at 120 watts.)

Thank you all once again. I really value and appreciate your suggestions.

I've attached a photo of my listening area for your evaluation with request to my questions.

Respectfully,

Mark

Swerd Is right. Your problem is the phono cartridge. This cartridge is a "so called" high output moving coil. These cartridges, are designed to just have enough output to get by plugging them into a moving magnet input stage.

The problem is that their output is not really high enough. It is about a quarter to a third of what it should be.

I'm really no fan of moving coil cartridges, but if you are, get a moving coil cartridge designed for a moving coil phono preamp and get that as well.

Otherwise change the cartridge for a good moving magnet of somewhat better quality, like this Ortofon 2M Black.

That cartridge has an output of 5 mv as against your Denon that is 1.6mv.

The bottom line is that those so called high output moving coil cartridges are a thoroughly bad idea.

 

[class a]

Had a Tube Box II and wasn't crazy about it. The top end tended to roll off a bit to much for my taste. Also the Tube Box II is really a tube buffer not a real tube phono. If you want a real tube phono I would go w/a Parks Audio Tube Budgie. Goes very well w/Ortofon carts. Also Parks Audio will help you with your settings. If you want to move up to MC add the Parks Audio Cinimag SUT. It's the same SUT used in the $2000 Rogue Ares phono. Both boxes will put you under $750. If you want solid state look up Lounge Audio and if you want to go MC add their Copla active SUT. Both boxes will put you about $200 below your $750 budget.

 

[KEW]

You could also just try the phono input on your Rotel, it has closer sensitivity than your external unit.

Swerd and TLSguy have your real answer, but if you already own the Rotel, there is no reason not to try this. If nothing else, it might be a decent stop-gap while you are picking out your cartridge!