Mid-bass subwoofer performance

[Houston1906]

I have been researching subwoofers for several months and I am finally at the point of making a purchase. For the most part, I am pretty much sold on the SVS PB-1000. One thing I have been seeing quite a bit is that the PB-1000 is a little lacking in the mid-bass range. Is the PB-1000 truly lacking in mid-bass, or would it provide solid performance across the board for movies and music?

I am also coming from an Infinity sub that has performed pretty well for me over the years. I figured the SVS would be a huge step up.

 

[everettT]

Based on measurements, it fine in the mid bass. How large is your room?

 

[Houston1906]

Based on measurements, it fine in the mid bass. How large is your room?

Thanks for the info! HT setup is in a bonus room (22x18x8).

 

[everettT]

Thanks for the info! HT setup is in a bonus room (22x18x8).

That's a good sized room, you might consider two.

 

[Houston1906]

That's a good sized room, you might consider two.

I've been thinking of going dual. May very likely add a second down the road.

 

[everettT]

Just a note: you had mentioned your previous sub worked well but expecting a huge upgrade is relative. Can you swing another $200?

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-3mk5HP.html

 

[Houston1906]

Just a note: you had mentioned your previous sub worked well but expecting a huge upgrade is relative. Can you swing another $200?

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-3mk5HP.html

That HSU VTF-3 is quite nice, but with shipping, that takes me well over the $500 price point of the SVS. Is the HSU THAT much better?

 

[everettT]

Yes it is. The pb1000 is nice but it's still an entry level sub from svs.

 

[shadyJ]

If your current sub is the Infinity Primus PS312, than I would not think the PB1000 will do better in mid bass. The PB1000's forte is deep bass for the price, and also its relatively small size. I would guess the VTF3 mk5 fully triples the output of the PB1000 in the mid bass region.

 

[Houston1906]

If your current sub is the Infinity Primus PS312, than I would not think the PB1000 will do better in mid bass. The PB1000's forte is deep bass for the price, and also its relatively small size. I would guess the VTF3 mk5 fully triples the output of the PB1000 in the mid bass region.

I'm working with the model prior to the Primus line. It's a decent little sub (8") for what it is, but I am well past time to upgrade. I upgraded everything else first.

 

[afterlife2]

You could do 2 of these, but not sure about the midbass quality. Read It was good for music though: http://www.harmanaudio.com/infinity/REFERENCE+SUB+R12.html?dwvar_REFERENCE SUB R12_color=Black-Z#start=1

 

[everettT]

I stand by the HSU being the cheapest and most impact capable upgrade.

 

[Houston1906]

I stand by the HSU being the cheapest and most impact capable upgrade.

What about the new VTF-1 MK3 or the VTF-2? Would those be good options as well? Just trying to stay around the $500 budget.

 

[everettT]

What about the new VTF-1 MK3 or the VTF-2? Would those be good options as well? Just trying to stay around the $500 budget.

I'd probably take the vtf2 over the pb1000. If it were me I'd wait another couple months and upgrade instead of just buying something minimal, but that's just my thoughts.

 

[shadyJ]

It looks to me like the PB1000 is tuned slightly deeper than the VTF1, so you get a bit more deep bass, but the VTF1 will have more mid bass output, but that is just a guess.

 

[Auditor55]

I have been researching subwoofers for several months and I am finally at the point of making a purchase. For the most part, I am pretty much sold on the SVS PB-1000. One thing I have been seeing quite a bit is that the PB-1000 is a little lacking in the mid-bass range. Is the PB-1000 truly lacking in mid-bass, or would it provide solid performance across the board for movies and music?

I am also coming from an Infinity sub that has performed pretty well for me over the years. I figured the SVS would be a huge step up.

What do you consider to be mid-bass? Some people have different views on mid-bass.

 

[shadyJ]

What do you consider to be mid-bass? Some people have different views on mid-bass.

This is true, there doesn't seem to be an agreed on 'standard' for what constitutes mid-bass, deep bass, and upper bass. Here are a couple different charts from a google search:

Personally I would veer to the lower chart, where 50 to 100 Hz make up mid bass. That 'sounds' right to my ears.

 

[everettT]

If we are referring to subwoofer mid bass Id think most of us cover 60/120 give or take 10hz. . If the op had asked about midrange that would have indicated the upper limits of most subs and since it was about subs I probably way overreached in assuming he was speaking about subs.

 

[TLS Guy]

I don't really think it is the job of the sub to produce mid bass. Generally the sub is called on to produce the last 1.5 to 2 octaves, with a roll off on the top end of 24 db per octave. This means frequencies below 60 to 80 Hz. Mid bass starts above the sub operating range generally, unless it is combined with very small speakers requiring a higher crossover.

The midbass is produced by the other speakers, especially the right and left mains. Now a lot of speakers are weak in the wind here due to inadequate baffle step compensation. This is especially true with designs that do not drop the impedance below the BSC point so as not to embarrass lower end receivers.

This leads to a couple of issues. People tend to either turn the sub up too high, select subs with high Q that are warm or frankly on the boomy side and often both. This masks but does not solve the issue.

The demands of BSC increase power demands and cone excursion of smaller woofers. This is why in my integrated design BSC is handed to a couple of the bass drivers.

 

[TLS Guy]

If we are referring to subwoofer mid bass Id think most of us cover 60/120 give or take 10hz. . If the op had asked about midrange that would have indicated the upper limits of most subs and since it was about subs I probably way overreached in assuming he was speaking about subs.

Anything below 500 Hz is bass. If you play with a sharp low pass at 500hz, speech is virtually unintelligible. It is clearly bass and that is all when you hear it.

So really everything from 100 Hz to 500 Hz is really midbass, or just plain bass if you like.

The bulk of the power is 100 Hz to 2.5 KHz, especially from 100 Hz to 1.5 KHz. That is about 80% of the power band.

So as I keep saying a sub off loads an amp or receiver hardly at all.

A properly balanced speaker that has a well balanced response to 50 to 60 Hz does not sound bass deficient and most would assume there is a sub in use. The problem is finding properly balanced speakers. Adding a sub is all too frequently a work around, and really only essential if you want to shake the floor.