Do I need a new amp/receiver?

[Hengchan]

At the moment my main query is this: Should i get an amp/receiver with a dedicated sub out? Would this improve performance of the sub + speakers compared to the high level route i am using at the moment?


This is basically my noob first setup:
SMSL SA-50 (2 channel amp),

Wharfedale diamond 220 bookshelves,

Definitive Pro sub 800.

Due to the amp not having a sub out i have wired the AMP speaker outs to the high level input on the sub - then the high level output on the sub to the speakers.
I have then set the low pass crossover to about 80 or so.

I think it sounds quite nice - however i've never experienced a proper sound system!! So maybe i am missing out on something important.


Any other advice - i.e. "your set up is a POS" - are more than welcome too
Also, if i have posted in the wrong area please do tell me!

 

[cel4145]

If you are not running the SMSL near it's limits where turning it up doesn't really get louder without distortion, then I would wait until you feel ready to upgrade speakers or sub. If you are pushing the limits of the SMSL, then a more powerful receiver would help with dynamics.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

You don't need new receiver. you need new sub

 

[lovinthehd]

While I think the DT subs aren't really subs, yours according to the manual does apparently apply a high pass filter for your speakers, 6dB/octave at 80hz, when you connect the speakers thru the high-level output terminals on your almost-but-not-quite-a-subwoofer. Many avrs give you more bass management choices than this sub does, tho (and its more involved than just offering a pre-out).

 

[Hengchan]

Thanks for the responses.

So the DT subs are terrible huh! So it would be a case of getting a proper AVR and a proper sub.

How does an actual sub differ from this DT one?

 

[lovinthehd]

DT tends to exaggerate the lower extension figure, in this case the DT "specs" say it has a frequency response from 20-150 Hz but doesn't specify how that's measured; if it were a measurement of +/- 3dB that would be quite acceptable but it isn't (it' more than 10dB down at 20 hz) http://www.soundandvision.com/content/test-bench-definitive-technology-procinema-800-home-theater-speaker-system#rQJY7HVrfjAbTody.97

Then again such performance would be a lot to expect from such an 8" driver

 

[cel4145]

^^

This. Def Tech subs are not so much terrible as just not a great price/performance deal, and you can't expect a lot from a small 8" subwoofer.

If this is a computer desktop setup where the sub is a few feet away and you are just listening to music, then the sub is probably doing fine filling in for your bookshelves down through the 40hz range and is certainly helping those Wharfedales out a lot. If you are hoping to fill a room with sound at higher volumes and/or want good low end extension for movie watching, then a bigger badass sub is called for

 

[Hengchan]

Gotcha.

Yeah you are spot on cel4145, I have a PC desktop set up just like you describe. So I don't listen particularly loud.

So assuming I eventually wanted to update my sub, I think a receiver would be the first requirement right?
You can probably assume from the sub/speakers my desired price range is around 150 pounds. Are marantz or denon a good place to start?

Cheers

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Again, start with sub first. It will provide you more improvements per dollar (even continuing using crossover in sub) than new avr.
@Hengchan Where in world are you? I suspect europe for some reason - not many people in US would get Wharfdale speakers or even heard about them.

 

[Hengchan]

Yes I am in the UK.

Ah ok. The issue I'm seeing with doing sub first is the limited ports on the amp? From looking around not many subs have both high level input and outputs.

Though very possible I've just missed many good subs which indeed do have it.. . Any recommendations or thoughts?

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Yes I am in the UK.

Ah ok. The issue I'm seeing with doing sub first is the limited ports on the amp? From looking around not many subs have both high level input and outputs.

Though very possible I've just missed many good subs which indeed do have it.. . Any recommendations or thoughts?

you're in luck:
Best sub in UK is BK elec: http://www.bkelec.com/HiFi/Sub_Woofers.htm
I'd suggest to talk to them and maybe ask for PASSIVE Monoligh FF or DF sub with external IS300-A amp which includes low level input and output.

Alternatively Karma-AV in UK is distributor for SVS subs. Older PB12NDS has the inputs you need.
Same for current PB1000 and PB2000

No idea for local pricing.

 

[Hengchan]

OK, very interesting, thanks.

 

[lovinthehd]

Yes I am in the UK.

Ah ok. The issue I'm seeing with doing sub first is the limited ports on the amp? From looking around not many subs have both high level input and outputs.

Though very possible I've just missed many good subs which indeed do have it.. . Any recommendations or thoughts?

It's not just that the sub you have has high level input and output, but also that it applies a high pass filter to that high level output (i.e. it creates an actual crossover in combination with its low pass filter). Not all sub amps with high level outputs provide a high pass filter (which is a nice feature when you don't have such with your amp).

The 2ch integrated amps that may have a sub pre-out likely won't have a high pass filter for the speaker output. Better for bass management to have the high pass filter for your speakers so as not to duplicate frequencies being sent to sub & speakers.