Ready to pull the trigger

[Ras777]

I have a maximum budget of $2500. I want as much quality bass as possible (70% movies 30% music). I am familiar with all the usual suspects HSU, SVS, PSA, RA, Rythmik, XTZ, etc. Should I go with one monster like the XTZ cinema series 3x12? Or two lesser subs?

HT 21x19x8
Marantz SR6007
Emotiva XPA-3
Aperion Grand Towers
Aperion Grand Center
Aperion Satellites

 

[shadyJ]

I would go with two good subs - providing you have the freedom of placement to take advantage of the frequency response smoothing benefit potential of multiple subs. At $2500, you can just about get three decent subs- consider a triple Hsu ULS-15 setup, I think that is deliverable for less than 2500. You can stack them up to make one super sub or you can place them separately for very smooth frequency response around the room plus big SPLs.

 

[Ras777]

ShadyJ,

My room is pretty square 21x19. Do you really think I would do better with three subs? Also, without sounding too selfish I am really concerned with the two center seats where my wife and I sit. On occasion, we will have friends over to watch a movie. In all honesty, they would never appreciate or even notice the difference. What if I went with two VTF 15H MK2 or two SVS PB 2000? This would keep me under budget. Or maybe two Rythmik FV 15HP which would put me close to budget. Also in regards to having three subs I could always add a third maybe six to nine months from now if I was unhappy with the frequency response in my room. My biggest concern right now is making the wrong decision. I am looking for the most bang for the buck.

 

[herbu]

Or maybe two Rythmik FV 15HP which would put me close to budget

I can tell you 2 FV15HPs would make a fine addition. They will sound great with music and normal bass, and absolutely blow you away on action movies. If you could carry one around, you could use it as a leaf blower to blast all the leaves/sticks out of your yard. It will shake your windows, rattle your ice tea and vibrate your LaZboys. Two is the way to go, not for more volume, but for balancing any room nulls.

I wouldn't hesitate to get 2 more of them if starting a new room.

 

[shadyJ]

I don't know how much better three subs would be over two. Remember that to get the frequency response smoothing of multiple subs, you need to be able to place them where they balance out the response best, and that isn't always where it is most convenient. Two VTF15h mk2s or Rythmik FV15HPs would have a considerable performance advantage over the PB2000s. To get close to them you would have to step up to the PB12 Pluses and to match them you would need PB13s. The FV15HPs will dig a bit deeper than the VTF15hs, however, if you want with the VTF15hs, you would have enough left over in budget to get a miniDSP and UMIK mic with which you can calibrate the subs. You have a lot of good choices in your budget. One thing you can do with three subs, if you have the freedom of placement, corner load one, put another on the side-wall, and use one right behind the seat for near-field punch.

 

[tyhjaarpa]

I would go with 2 of VTF15HMK2 or FV15HP personally. Getting 2 good subs is better than getting 3 lesser ones imo. And 2 subs should procude really even bass as well in your situation.

 

[Ras777]

This is turning into a tougher decision then I originally thought. Right now I am leaning toward the Rythmik FV 15HP and the HSU VTF 15 MK2. SVS is out because I would need two PB13 Ultra's and at $3600 it's out of my budget. That leaves the PSA's V1500 and Reaction Audio's Echo 15 both under budget. How do these compare to my first choices?

I also read Gene's review on both HSU and Rythmik but they were old reviews. In regards to Rythmik he stated that it was hard and confusing to set up correctly. Has this been rectified by Rythmik? And when will Gene review VTF 15 with the more powerful amp?

In addition, having a little money left over over to purchase a mini DSP and UMIK mic for calibration makes good sense. Which begs the question...can a person with limited knowledge in this area do this calibration correctly? I read Gene's article and it seemed a bit intimidating.

Any further advice or opinions would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Auditor55]

This is turning into a tougher decision then I originally thought. Right now I am leaning toward the Rythmik FV 15HP and the HSU VTF 15 MK2. SVS is out because I would need two PB13 Ultra's and at $3600 it's out of my budget. That leaves the PSA's V1500 and Reaction Audio's Echo 15 both under budget. How do these compare to my first choices?

I also read Gene's review on both HSU and Rythmik but they were old reviews. In regards to Rythmik he stated that it was hard and confusing to set up correctly. Has this been rectified by Rythmik? And when will Gene review VTF 15 with the more powerful amp?

In addition, having a little money left over over to purchase a mini DSP and UMIK mic for calibration makes good sense. Which begs the question...can a person with limited knowledge in this area do this calibration correctly? I read Gene's article and it seemed a bit intimidating.

Any further advice or opinions would be greatly appreciated.

It shouldn't be that tough since the performance of those subs are comparable. No need to nit pik.

 

[3db]

This is turning into a tougher decision then I originally thought. Right now I am leaning toward the Rythmik FV 15HP and the HSU VTF 15 MK2. SVS is out because I would need two PB13 Ultra's and at $3600 it's out of my budget. That leaves the PSA's V1500 and Reaction Audio's Echo 15 both under budget. How do these compare to my first choices?

I also read Gene's review on both HSU and Rythmik but they were old reviews. In regards to Rythmik he stated that it was hard and confusing to set up correctly. Has this been rectified by Rythmik? And when will Gene review VTF 15 with the more powerful amp?

In addition, having a little money left over over to purchase a mini DSP and UMIK mic for calibration makes good sense. Which begs the question...can a person with limited knowledge in this area do this calibration correctly? I read Gene's article and it seemed a bit intimidating.

Any further advice or opinions would be greatly appreciated.

Rythmik has awesome customer service and are willing to walk you through the set up. The Rythmik's flexability in its control may have been confusing because very few subs offered this level of control at that time.

Here's another review of the Rythmik with some explanation of the controls

 

[Ras777]

Interesting review. Not sure how scientific it was but it was entertaining, to say the least.

 

[shadyJ]

This is turning into a tougher decision then I originally thought. Right now I am leaning toward the Rythmik FV 15HP and the HSU VTF 15 MK2. SVS is out because I would need two PB13 Ultra's and at $3600 it's out of my budget. That leaves the PSA's V1500 and Reaction Audio's Echo 15 both under budget. How do these compare to my first choices?

I also read Gene's review on both HSU and Rythmik but they were old reviews. In regards to Rythmik he stated that it was hard and confusing to set up correctly. Has this been rectified by Rythmik? And when will Gene review VTF 15 with the more powerful amp?

In addition, having a little money left over over to purchase a mini DSP and UMIK mic for calibration makes good sense. Which begs the question...can a person with limited knowledge in this area do this calibration correctly? I read Gene's article and it seemed a bit intimidating.

Any further advice or opinions would be greatly appreciated.

Gene didn't write review the VTF15h or FV15HP, that was Paul Apollonio who wrote those reviews for Audioholics. With respect to the Rythmik amp, it is not that complicated. You can always ask questions about what does what if you get it, it is simple once you understand. With respect to the VTF15h mk2, its upgrade is more than just a more powerful amp, in fact, the driver is the most significant upgrade in the mk2. It is a big step up from the original. Regarding the V1500 and Echo 15, the Echo 15 looks to be fairly powerful. The V1500 looks to have lots of upper bass but is otherwise outclassed by these others. Personally I think the Echo 15 looks the nicest out of all these subs, and the V1500 is very ugly without the grill. I wouldn't be surprised if the Echo 15 had the most output, but it would probably only be a slim lead over the FV15HP and the VTF15h mk2. The FV15HP will dig the deepest without a doubt. One thing you might consider is three VTF3 mk5s. Compared to these others, the VTF3 mk5 gives up a tad of output below 20 Hz, but keeps up with all of them above that point. You can get three of them for less than 2600 shipped, which isn't a whole lot more than two of any of the others. That would give you a significant performance advantage over any of these others. Use two for addressing nulls, and put one behind your seat for near-field punch.

 

[Ras777]

ShadyJ

Would it not make more sense to buy the best two possible subs that I can afford now and then if I feel as though its lacking buy a third in a few months? Is there anything else in my price range that I have not considered?

 

[shadyJ]

You could do that, but by the same logic why not by one $2k sub now and if you feel its lacking, buy another in a few months? It isn't about feeling anything is lacking, its about getting the most bang for your buck.

One other sub I would look at in this price range is the new Seaton MFWs I suppose. Or a DIY kit.

 

[Defcon]

You have a healthy budget, I concur with the suggestions to get 2 subs, at $1-1.2k each you have a number of fine options.

May I suggest you also budget for a miniDsp and a calibrated microphone like Umik-1, combine that with REW and you will be able to measure and fine tune the sub response using EQ. There are also good guides on this site.

LFE is extremely dependent on the room and placement and this can make a difference to how good the bass sounds.

 

[mikieboyblue]

If you have two subs how critical is it to tune them using a miniDSP and umik-1 mic or can you do it by ear?

 

[Ras777]

I am definitely considering purchasing a miniDSP and Umik mic. I have read thru Gene's article and watched the video several times. This is some heavy stuff for somebody who has no training in this area. I wish there was some type of step by step tutorial for the uninitiated like myself. After reading Gene's article I feel that purchasing a second or third sub would be a waste of money unless you have the tools and know how to correctly calibrate your system. It's most likely a no-brainer for most members on this forum. Unfortunately, for me, its a bit intimidating to purchase this equipment only to find out the process is above my pay grade.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Any of those active subs would work well.

If you already own an amp that's not in use (like Crown XLS 2000, etc.) you might also consider looking into passive subs and use your own amp. That way you would save money on the amp (if you already own it), especially if you were looking into DSP, etc.

Passive Sub + External DSP + External Amp.

 

[DigitalDawn]

In the majority of rooms you will get the most low-end energy if you place two subs in diagonally opposing corners.

 

[herbu]

Rythmik has awesome customer service and are willing to walk you through the set up.

True. When I got mine, I was a bit overwhelmed by the available adjustments. I followed the recommended settings and was fine. As I read some more, and had some questions, I called Rythmik. They explained the answers and sent me another, even more simple, suggested setup. I've been enjoying mine for a couple years now.

There are still a couple adjustments on the sub that I don't fully understand and don't mess with. But I've never had a problem at my ears, or on a meter, or with Audyssey. I consider it kind of like our dishwasher or washing machine. They have cycles we never use, but they're there if we want them. (BTW, that's the royal "we". I never use either of those. )

FYI, the FV15HP was my first big boy sub. After a while reading here, I decided to get a second sub. I got the SVS PB13U. It cost more. After playing with it on both music and big boom movies, I couldn't really tell a difference between them. Now I use them together. Very effective smoothing out nulls in the room. Even so, either is strong enough alone to thump your chest and shake the room. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend either, and I can't say one is better than the other.

 

[Auditor55]

True. When I got mine, I was a bit overwhelmed by the available adjustments. I followed the recommended settings and was fine. As I read some more, and had some questions, I called Rythmik. They explained the answers and sent me another, even more simple, suggested setup. I've been enjoying mine for a couple years now.

There are still a couple adjustments on the sub that I don't fully understand and don't mess with. But I've never had a problem at my ears, or on a meter, or with Audyssey. I consider it kind of like our dishwasher or washing machine. They have cycles we never use, but they're there if we want them. (BTW, that's the royal "we". I never use either of those. )

FYI, the FV15HP was my first big boy sub. After a while reading here, I decided to get a second sub. I got the SVS PB13U. It cost more. After playing with it on both music and big boom movies, I couldn't really tell a difference between them. Now I use them together. Very effective smoothing out nulls in the room. Even so, either is strong enough alone to thump your chest and shake the room. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend either, and I can't say one is better than the other.

Why didn't you get a second FV15HP since if their performance about is equal, you could have saved $800 ?