Best overall speaker setup right now? (Atmos vs DTS:X vs 7.1 vs 5.1)

[prophecy0]

All,

I'm currently working on finishing out my basement theater and I'm hoping to get some input on speaker placement. I currently have 3x Ascend Acoustics 340SEs and 2x 170SEs, paired with a single SVS Ultra sub. My plan was to just stay at 5.1 and add another sub in the near future... but then I figured I might as well add rears for 7.1. Then I started reading more and more about Atmos and now I'm tempted to add ceiling speakers. There are a few "gotchas" though:

1) If I go the Atmos route I'll need to spend another $500+ on speakers and an additional $1500+ on a receiver to power the additional speakers.

2) My finished height in the theater room is going to be around 7.25 ft. I feel like this may be too low for in-ceiling speakers.

3) There are a ton of obstructions in my ceiling area (pipes, ductwork, etc). so finding places to mount in-ceiling speakers may be an issue.

4) Due to the room layout, my surround (side) speakers have to be placed fairly high in the room. It will take some very creative thinking to get them at ear level and still preserve walking space.

5) DTS:X may become a worthwhile competitor, and DTS recommends a different speaker layout.


Here are pictures of the room in question:

Overview of the layout (the back of the theater room is open to the rest of the basement. I know it's not ideal for sound quality but bear with me here):


View looking forward from behind seating position:


View looking backward from near seating position:



So, given the room layout and low ceilings, what is the best "future proof" speaker layout to go with? My cheapest / simplest option is to add a pair of the Ascend Acoustics HTM-200s to the angled soffit in the back and just do 7.1. This would not require a receiver upgrade.

The next cheapest option is to target 5.1.2 with in-ceiling speakers. The most expensive (and tempting) option is to somehow make four in-ceiling speakers fit above the seating area and spring for a nice receiver to take advantage of 5.1.4. I'm still concerned about my surround speakers not being at/near ear level.

For simplicity's sake I am leaning toward just going 7.1 and hoping that DTS:X takes off in the near future, since DTS:X will supposedly take true advantage of object-based sound and utilize whatever speaker placement you have to its best ability. On the other hand, I read impressions of Mad Max and other similar movies in Atmos and my mouth starts salivating.

What does everyone think? What's the best overall speaker arrangement going forward?

 

[prophecy0]

After much deliberation I am leaning toward the attached layout (7.1.2). I feel like this will give me the most flexibility with the different formats. I have figured out a way to make the Auro format work (two front heights and two side heights), but it will require me to recess two bookshelf speakers into the right wall which I'd rather not do. I can also do 5.1.4 instead of 7.1.2... I'm really conflicted on this one but I feel like 7.1.2 will give the most flexibility to work with DTS:X and (potentially) Auro 3D.

Thoughts?

 

[KenM10759]

My first question is why is the main listening position (a.k.a. sofa) placed so far back from the screen? Moving it forward a few feet would give you much better positioning of the rear and surround speakers as related to the listening position, it seems.

 

[TheWarrior]

Before we get to that, how far are those studs off the cinder block wall? If they're close, what is keeping them from vibrating against the wall?

 

[prophecy0]

My first question is why is the main listening position (a.k.a. sofa) placed so far back from the screen? Moving it forward a few feet would give you much better positioning of the rear and surround speakers as related to the listening position, it seems.

Great question. Originally I was going to place a sectional in the room, so I wanted to give plenty of room from the screen for all listeners. I recently decided that a sectional would dominate too much of the room, so I changed to a sofa... but I've already ordered/received a 120" screen. The ~13ft seating distance gives roughly the THX recommended viewing angle. I can move up to a 12ft viewing distance and be just over the THX recommended viewing angle.

The seating is also so far back to allow room for additional seating up front via bean bags and etc. Also, there is an electrical panel on the left that would interfere with speaker placement if I move much closer. All of that said, if you have a good recommended layout that I could accomplish by moving a bit closer I am glad to hear it.

Before we get to that, how far are those studs off the cinder block wall? If they're close, what is keeping them from vibrating against the wall?

I would need to measure to be sure, but I think the contractor told me they start an inch off the wall at the bottom but get closer (maybe even touching) near the top as the cinder block wall isn't 100% plumb. I've spent hours worrying about soundproofing the room but ultimately decided it wasn't worth a ton of effort due to all of the obstructions in the ceiling, and due to the fact that there is a stairwell right beside it. There would have just been too many compromises.


Also... I'm being fickle and leaning back toward doing 5.1.4. I re-examined the ceiling obstructions and I think I can fit four ceiling speakers just fine. If DTS:X lives up to its promises it should adjust for ceiling speakers as well as any other kind of layout, right?

 

[TheWarrior]

I would need to measure to be sure, but I think the contractor told me they start an inch off the wall at the bottom but get closer (maybe even touching) near the top as the cinder block wall isn't 100% plumb. I've spent hours worrying about soundproofing the room but ultimately decided it wasn't worth a ton of effort due to all of the obstructions in the ceiling, and due to the fact that there is a stairwell right beside it. There would have just been too many compromises.


Also... I'm being fickle and leaning back toward doing 5.1.4. I re-examined the ceiling obstructions and I think I can fit four ceiling speakers just fine. If DTS:X lives up to its promises it should adjust for ceiling speakers as well as any other kind of layout, right?

Then you might want to squeeze some caulk or pads in between there! Its not about sound proofing, its about those studs vibrating from subwoofers, creating their own sound track. Just something I noticed, that I'm willing to bet you will hear with any sfx heavy movies!

Your speakers are very respectable. Given your budget, I would recommend a second sub long before adding Atmos. Even distribution of bass will prove far more beneficial! And its the holidays, so you better believe SVS will be doing sales!

 

[prophecy0]

Thanks for the advice! I checked again and the studs are fully separated from the wall all the way to the ceiling.

I agree I need a second sub. I'm pre-wiring to add another one down the road. In the meantime, I can't help myself - I'm going to do a 5.1.4 Atmos layout.

 

[KenM10759]

I also have ceilings with low height, just about the same as yours. My seating position is also similar, and after reading through the Atmos installation manual I do think we're better off going with Atmos-enabled (ceiling reflective) speakers rather than in-ceiling Atmos speakers.

Of course it's your choice, and if the speakers you choose have tweeters that can be aimed you should be OK. I'd want timbre matching KEF Ci160RR (to match my KEF R500/R200C/R100 setup) if I go in ceiling and my listening position never changes. However, because I may move to the 1st floor apartment in my two-family house someday, I'm going to audition the KEF R50 Atmos-enabled speakers before I make a decision. I just wish I could do the audition before this 50% off sale ends! Ain't happening.

YMMV

 

[Stampede]

My order of preference if it matters:
1) Second sub makes a huge difference
2) 7.1 with wired options for a 7.2.4 later. I didnt see you mention what Amp you have so dont know if this is possible.

Neva tried or heard Atmos reflective speakers before, but I really have my doubts about it. Your ceiling are low, but I think the in ceilings may still work. I use the monitor audio 265idc with wide dispersion on 8 feet high ceiling.
When seated it is very difficult to localise the 4 speakers, which is great for Atmos. Standing up thou, you can tell if you are under the speaker.

Just from my experience, hope I didnt make your choice more difficult.

 

[TheWarrior]

Thanks for the advice! I checked again and the studs are fully separated from the wall all the way to the ceiling.

I agree I need a second sub. I'm pre-wiring to add another one down the road. In the meantime, I can't help myself - I'm going to do a 5.1.4 Atmos layout.

Whatever makes you happy! Just know that we all have found even bass distribution to make the biggest impact.

I still maintain that the studs on the left side with the electrical panel need some padding high up on the wall. Zooming in on my retina display makes it appear you've got a 1/4"max spacing. Adequately pressurizing this space with subwoofers will have those unladen studs (non load bearing) vibrating.

One additional construction side note: your left surround is painfully close to your homes electrical center. Ensure the speaker cable runs parallel to any electrical wire, spaced by at least 16", and makes a perfect perpendicular cross anywhere you must have speaker and electrical cross. Failure to do this may create audible interference!