What to do???

[csr]

Love my music, love my movies, been hooking up speakers/components for years, but still ignorant to the best way. Spent lots, do not want to do this wrong. Electrician by trade, suggestions would be very much appreciated.
Equipment = 1/ Pioneer Elite SC-67. 2/Four Cerwin Vega CV-1800 amps. 3/ Yamaha Natural sound EQ. 4/ All speakers full tower cabinets, two double 15" CV's, two single CV 15's, four double CV 12's, two single CV twelves, two 15" CV powered subs, One 21" CV powered sub. 5/One Epson 5030UB projector w/ 133" screen. 6/Various components such as blue ray, Stanton turntable, DVD, CD.
Can I have Movies as surround and music as all out on?
I, in my limited mind, have thought of 2 ways for hookup but need advise from someone who knows.
Method 1- Feed lead amp from only the preamp section of receiver, Front Sp terminals, then daisy chain all amps, they are equal, feed speaker pairs out of each amp distributing them equally.
Or
Method 2 - Turn Off Receiver Amp, which then only preamp section of receiver is on, feed each CV-1800 separately out of preamp terminals labelled front, front height, surround, surround back etc.
With either method, feed 21" SW out of own terminal, split 2nd SW terminal and go to the 2 - 12"SW's.
Am I doing this right???????? Thank you

 

[agarwalro]

To get proper surround sound, you have to use Method 2.

 

[csr]

So if I use Method 2, and then listen to the turntable, will All speakers be on, or only certain ones?????
Thanks

 

[agarwalro]

Yes, you have to use all channel stereo mode. This mode copies front L to all left and front R to all right side speakers.

 

[csr]

Thank you very much. This is the way I will do it. Tore it all apart last night and starting again.
One more question, if you don't mind. I have a Yamaha natural sound EQ . Should I just leave it out???
There is only one set of RCA in and one set out, so I can't figure out where in the system it could go other than in between the receiver preamp outputs and the amps, and if that's the case, I have multiple preamp outs,and multiple amps, but only one equalizer.
With 4 amps, and 4 preout terminals, is it safe to say either buy 3 more EQ's or pull the one I have out?????
Or is there another way???
Thanks again!!!

 

[agarwalro]

The Pioneer receiver has built in setup and EQ functions, so you don't need to use the Yamaha EQ. It pretty much makes the external EQ redundant. If anything the Pioneer's EQ system is so superior to the Yamaha that you will only hurt the sound quality by trying to manually add EQ.

The Pioneer will EQ all speakers you connect to the pre outs (in your case, meaning Pioneer pre-out to external amp input and amp powers the speakers). You will need to run the auto setup process. This will detect the speakers, set the distance and level match all of them.

 

[csr]

Ohhh thank you so much!! I will remove it altogether and use it in a cheaper system elsewhere. This system is in my shop/doghouse. I wish my main small town electronics store salesman would have advised me of this. Guess I should have researched first.
Thanks again.
I guess I do have one more question, with 5 sets of preout terminals on the Pioneer, and only 4 amps, which set of preout terminals should I drop?? Or do I blow some more cash and get a fifth amp?? I was thinking either dropping surround or surround back, but the online manual is 130 pages, I have searched it, and can't find the answer.
Or is there another way??
Thanks again, you've been awesome.

 

[markw]

To keep things in step, I'd get another amp so you have one for each speaker.

In the meantime, I'd run the two surrounds off the receivers internal amps for now and take one of the external amps out for now. When you get another one to match the other four, put 'em both back in.

 

[csr]

Alrighty. Thank-you for the helpful tips and advise.

 

[agarwalro]

with 5 sets of preout terminals on the Pioneer, and only 4 amps, which set of preout terminals should I drop??

Equipment = 1/ Pioneer Elite SC-67. 2/Four Cerwin Vega CV-1800 amps. 3/ Yamaha Natural sound EQ. 4/ All speakers full tower cabinets, two double 15" CV's, two single CV 15's, four double CV 12's, two single CV twelves, two 15" CV powered subs, One 21" CV powered sub.

Can you provide the details (model numbers) of the speakers and subs and I can recommend a connection scheme.

 

[csr]

Yes I will, thanks.
Please check back in a day, I am not there right now. Will try and write them all down tomorrow.

Thanks again

 

[csr]

Ok, so sorry it took so long.
Front 2 are CV XLS-215
Front Height 2 are CV XLS-15
Front Wide 2 are CV XLS-12
Surround 2 are CV VS120
Surround Back 4 are 2 are XLS-120. 2 are CV VS150
That's 12 Cerwin Vega's
4 Cerwin Vega Amps, another one coming
So I will have to double up one amp(4speakers), I thought back 4 surround??
Feed each amp from Pioneer Elite SC-67 Pre-outs, 5 preouts and 5 amps. No Center speaker but I did run wire for one.
Thanks so much for your help, any advise from knowledgable persons appreciated!!!

 

[csr]

Oh, and the subs are 3 of them. Darn I didn't get #'s.
I know they are All Cerwin Vega, there are 2 15" ones, and one 21" one(194lbs). All powered.
I was gonna run the 21 on its own preout subW and off the 2nd preout subW I was going to split it at the receiver. I ran RG6 to all subs.
Thanks again!!!

 

[csr]

Ok, so sorry it took so long.
Front 2 are CV XLS-215
Front Height 2 are CV XLS-15
Front Wide 2 are CV XLS-12
Surround 2 are CV VS120
Surround Back 4 are 2 are XLS-120. 2 are CV VS150
That's 12 Cerwin Vega's
4 Cerwin Vega Amps, another one coming
So I will have to double up one amp(4speakers), I thought back 4 surround??
Feed each amp from Pioneer Elite SC-67 Pre-outs, 5 preouts and 5 amps. No Center speaker but I did run wire for one.
Thanks so much for your help, any advise from knowledgable persons appreciated!!!

 

[JohnnieB]

BASS I've been following this thread simply because of the sheer size of this system. I used to run CV, and I for one loved em'. This thing is a beast. Some photos would be great.

 

[csr]

Hi, still patiently waiting for a possible setup configuration if your around Agarwalro. About a week ago I provided all details and model #'s as you requested.
Did add 2 more XLS-215's, so now there are 12 cabinets, 3 subs, 4 amps(5th amp coming). Will list again,
2 ---- VS-120
4 ---- XLS-12
2 ---- VS-150
4 ---- XLS-215 (added 2 from original)
2 ---- 15" CV Powered subs
1 ---- 21" powered sub
4 ---- CV-1800 amps
1 ---- pioneer Elite SC-67

My previous questions:
1/ Have to double up, 4 speakers on 1 amp. Which 4 do I pick.
2/ which speakers would work best where? The preouts are Front,Front wide, Front height, surround and surround back.
Shop/doghouse listening area is
60 wide
100' long
Ceiling projector 15 feet from one end in center.( Surround back 4 are up in mezzanine, and shelves built for front height.

Blew a SL on this system, know placement and hookup will be everything, don't wanna screw it up now. Thanks for the help.

JohnnieB -- yes will try and get some pics. Hope to have it all working by end of weekend.

 

[agarwalro]

First thing, and sorry for not mentioning it before, the Pioneer pre-outs are RCA and the CV1800 inputs are TRS or XLR. You will need this cable x number of channels you are sending to the amps, 6ft Premier Series XLR Male to RCA Male 16AWG Cable (Gold Plated) - Monoprice.com

Front 2 are CV XLS-215
Front Height 2 are CV XLS-15
Front Wide 2 are CV XLS-12
Surround 2 are CV VS120

Up till here things are perfect.

Surround Back 4 are 2 are XLS-120. 2 are CV VS150
So I will have to double up one amp(4speakers), I thought back 4 surround??

This is the right choice, but, now things are murky. It is preferable if the 4 back surrounds are identical to that you have timber (critical) and level matched (not importance since this can be managed from the CV amp). IMO, don't bother, just do without till the 5th amp arrives. That said...

The CV1800 amp is rated to 2 Ohm loads, the XLS120 and VS150 speakers are efficient and should not be a tough load, especially since they are surrounds anyway. It will be fine if you connect the speakers in parallel, just be careful with the levels on this amp to make sure it is not clipping.

Will list again,
2 ---- VS-120
4 ---- XLS-12
2 ---- VS-150
4 ---- XLS-215 (added 2 from original)
2 ---- 15" CV Powered subs
1 ---- 21" powered sub

My previous questions:
1/ Have to double up, 4 speakers on 1 amp. Which 4 do I pick.
2/ which speakers would work best where? The preouts are Front,Front wide, Front height, surround and surround back.

1 got answered above and for 2, I want to think this through. There are so that I am 1000% sure before I suggest something.

 

[agarwalro]

Feed each amp from Pioneer Elite SC-67 Pre-outs, 5 preouts and 5 amps.

Something wrong here. Your 10 amps channels will get one pre-out per channel. That is the only way the Pio will identify each speaker as an independent channel. So,

Front Right - Amp1 Channel 1
Front Left - Amp1 Channel 2
Front L Wide - Amp 2 Channel 1
Front R Wide - Amp 2 Channel 2
Surround R - Amp 3 Channel 1 (connect 2 surrounds set amp to Parallel using switch at back)
Surround L - Amp 4 Channel 1 (connect 2 surrounds set amp to Parallel using switch at back)
Rear Surround L - Amp 5 Channel 1
Rear Surround R - Amp 5 Channel 2
Center - Amp 6 Channel 1 (if this existed)

2 ---- VS-120
4 ---- XLS-12
2 ---- VS-150
4 ---- XLS-215 (added 2 from original)
2 ---- 15" CV Powered subs
1 ---- 21" powered sub

After reading specs and researching speakers online, I would recommend using the speakers to channels as follows,
XLS-215 Front L, R and Wide L, R (because you want the full front stage to be timber matched, so L Wide to L Main to Center to R Main to R Wide)
VS-150 Front Height
XLS-12 Side Surrounds (be cause you want both pairs to be timber matched)
VS-120 Rear Surrounds

Now even though the Pio has 2 sub outs, they are mono.

Further, the 15 are not as capable as the 21. I would recommend you stack the two 15's to bring the combined output closer to the 21. Now you effectively have 2 similar capability subwoofer. On the first 15 use the Link Out (switch at 'Master') and connect it to the IN L in of the second 15 (Link Out switch at 'Slave') using this cable, 3ft Premier Series XLR Male to XLR Female 16AWG Cable (Gold Plated) [Microphone & Interconnect] - Monoprice.com.

Since the Pio will equalize the three (albeit, effectively two subs with the 15's stacked) as only one sub, I recommend you keep them at the mid point of the left and right walls (parallel to the seating) or mid point of front and back wall (under center of screen and center of back wall). This gives the most even bass across multiple listening positions. You might have to try both to decide which one works best for you.

 

[csr]

THANK YOU Very much Agarwalro, I didn't know what timbre matching was, but researched it on this site and sounds good.
Seen your caption/cartoon and couldn't stop laughing. Ya, went a little overboard but oh well, if I upset wife and she says "Go to your shop", I can just reply "Aw gee, do I have to"
Did some measuring tonight, just about have it the way you said.
West wall (Front) ----60' wide ---- 1 set of XLS-215's in each corner (angled to room center)
1 set of XLS-12's on shelves above the 215's (angled to room center) will change to VS-150's.
Side walls (front wide & surround) ----- Front Wide --- 2nd set of XLS-215's ( 40' back from corner 215's )
----- Surround ----- 1 set of VS-120 ( 60' back from side wall 215's ) will change to XLS-12's.
Back Mezzanine ( surround back ) -----1 set of VS-150, 1 set of XLS-12 ( 20' back from side wall surrounds, but up on mezzanine,
will swap 150's with 12's .
Because of mezzanine, it's a work area below, tools, bike lift etc, had no place but front center for the 21", which is lucky and exactly where you said. The 15's are halfway down each sidewall, because of shelves, I can't stack, and because of Mezzanine, they can't go at back.
I ran 10, 12, & 14 gauge from amp locations individually to each speaker, ran RG-6 to each sub, I should have checked first if it's better to run one sub off another (the 2 15" subs). Because I did this without asking, I will never know if stacking them will be better than splitting single at amp. Therefore, is the difference Huge, or minimal. All other recommendations are much appreciated and being acted upon.
Thanks again.
Will try and figure out how to get a picture on here.