fuzz092888

fuzz092888

Audioholic Warlord
I stumbled onto this thread today and the guy clearly is a terrific woodworker but has zereo idea what he's doing. He basically built a random cabinet based on a picture of the Aperion Versus Grand Towers with no modeling, no thought the crossover except to use a generic PE crossover (which is even worse because he was going to use a 3 way crossover for something like a 6 way speaker), and no idea about what types of airspaces or alignments any of the drivers need or even if they would work best together.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1507413/80-speaker-towers-kerfed-out-of-one-mdf-sheet-9-spkr-setup
 
T

templemaners

Senior Audioholic
I saw the same thread on AVS and cringed. Hopefully he dials it back some (6 way?!? :eek:) and goes with a more established design so he doesn't get discouraged with his results on how he's proceeding currently.

He certainly seems to be able to handle the cabinet work side of speaker building. Imagine if he got set loose on a pair of curved side Statement towers or something like that.

Definitely has a lot to learn, that's for sure.
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
A pair of minidsp's and 6 channels of amping could make it work with some hard core crossover work. Seriously that is awesome work though.
 
ImcLoud

ImcLoud

Audioholic Ninja
That cabinetry is top notch, The gentleman that built the cabinets in my house was good, but I can promise you if I asked him to build me 2 of them towers judging by what he charged for some kitchen cabinets it would be 40 million dollars.... Very nice work... You guys are rite, kind of wish {for his own sake and the outcome of his project} that he went with a proven design. He can always remake the baffle {and double or triple it up while hes at it} and throw in a pair of subs, then insulate it between that and a pair of decent drivers with a nice tweeter and a crossover that matches {that someone else already did the leg work with...

Still can't take it away from the woodwork side, really nice, I want to see how he finishes them and what he does next, maybe an 8 way subwoofer tower with 1-21", 1-18, 1-15, 1 13.5, 1-12, 1-10, 1-8, and 1- 6.5" have the 21 doing the 18hz and under, 18 doing under 22hz, 15 under 30hz, and so on and so on.... lol
 
darien87

darien87

Audioholic Spartan
That's funny. I can't believe there are people out there that think you can just throw some speakers in a box and have it sound good. "As long as they fit it will work right?"
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
That cabinetry is top notch, The gentleman that built the cabinets in my house was good, but I can promise you if I asked him to build me 2 of them towers judging by what he charged for some kitchen cabinets it would be 40 million dollars.... Very nice work... You guys are rite, kind of wish {for his own sake and the outcome of his project} that he went with a proven design. He can always remake the baffle {and double or triple it up while hes at it} and throw in a pair of subs, then insulate it between that and a pair of decent drivers with a nice tweeter and a crossover that matches {that someone else already did the leg work with...

Still can't take it away from the woodwork side, really nice, I want to see how he finishes them and what he does next, maybe an 8 way subwoofer tower with 1-21", 1-18, 1-15, 1 13.5, 1-12, 1-10, 1-8, and 1- 6.5" have the 21 doing the 18hz and under, 18 doing under 22hz, 15 under 30hz, and so on and so on.... lol

The important point to remember in all of this is that skill in woodwork is distinct and separate from skill in speaker design. People who are specialists and not "all-rounders" should stick to their specialties, and not imagine that they are good at other things just because they are great at one thing.

I know someone who is a great specialist, who wishes he were more well-rounded. The thing is, he makes a boatload of money in his specialty, and can afford to hire people to deal with everything else. And that is exactly what he should do, instead of trying to do some of the things he is ill-suited to do.
 
ImcLoud

ImcLoud

Audioholic Ninja
The important point to remember in all of this is that skill in woodwork is distinct and separate from skill in speaker design. People who are specialists and not "all-rounders" should stick to their specialties, and not imagine that they are good at other things just because they are great at one thing.

I know someone who is a great specialist, who wishes he were more well-rounded. The thing is, he makes a boatload of money in his specialty, and can afford to hire people to deal with everything else. And that is exactly what he should do, instead of trying to do some of the things he is ill-suited to do.
I specialize in High Efficiency Heating and cooling systems, but with the internet and asking others for advice I have done world class irrigation systems, designed and built {contracted} houses worthy of AM monthly, done surgery on my dog {he lived}, cut my kids hair {they lived}, cleared and excavated many many many land lots, installed a dt466 engine in one of my service vehicles, installed surveillance systems, shopped for groceries {twice}, ect...

So although speaker design is an art, if he would just do a little research ask a few questions and make some easy decisions his project would come much much further, but to hire someone to design and install the speakers for his "budget" HT build, I would say that is stretching it a little... He just should have done a little more planning, there are so many plans for speakers on the net he could have picked one he liked the reviews and design of and made the enclosure how ever he wanted, sure maybe his enclosure would have differed a little bit, but they probably would still sound listenable... He is aiming towards a speaker that sure will make noise, but thats about it, and when it comes to that, I am only guessing because I can't even make the cabinets this guy is doing, never mind design a speaker from the ground up. He would probably be better off buying a set of fluance towers and making his own cabinets for them... even a bad plan is better than no plan...



How funny would it be if these things ended up sounding amazing and this guy turns out to be some kind of savant, the speaker design sells for millions and we all end up with a set badged "Polk", all other speakers slowly get phased out and people are selling their Sonus Faber setups and replacing them with these things... They sound so good, people pass out the first time they hear them, there are parties in the street, we all know his name and the results from his speakers is world wide, peace, starvation ends because food grows fast when you play his speakers, we no longer need middle eastern fuel because we can now grow corn in the deserts at a phenomenal rate, we burn all other speakers in joy, BUT then it happens, the generation after us, born to the "listeners" {as we will be labeled} turns into a race of mutant monsters, with huge ears and wings with a 10ft wingspan, and they are hunting us and destroying all human life, the only thing that changes them back to human is playing the old speakers, BUT they have all been destroyed, they are gone, except for one set of, yes you guessed it.... B&W CM5's, Russel Crow leads a task force to find the cm5's that were fabled to be last seen in a NY basement apartment, just rumors and stories of the old speakers to go on, he pillages through NY at an exhausting rate, to accidentally stumble upon the B&Ws after spending a torrid night with an asian prostitute named PEG LEE, she was brought to the US at a young age to help construct the world changing speakers, she and millions of others stolen from their beds to work as slaves constructing these monstrous 6 way speakers that are leading to the end of the world as we know it... Having found the cm5's Russel Crow takes them and the remnants of a sony boombox to the center of the city and from the tallest building he presses play, the only cassette he could find starts to play.... "Alright Stop, collaborate and listen, Ice is back with my brand new invention, something grabs a hold of me tightly, then I flow like a harpoon, daily and nightly, will it stop YO, I don't know turn off the lights and Ill glow........

The monster youth starts to retreat to the mountain regions of the world, and the humans start to destroy the speakers, except for that pair of cm5's that saved the world, we slowly start to change the mutants back to human with the cm5's and an old sony boombox...
 
Last edited:
mattsk8

mattsk8

Full Audioholic
I would be nervous about the kerf depth as well. He has what looks like ~1/16" of MDF left at the bottom of the kerfs. I would try to coat the insides of the cabinets, maybe w/ fiberglass or something like that for fear of cracking eventually.

Its a tough way to learn, glad I found you guys before I jumped into speaker building on that level all by my lonesome!
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Warlord
LOL! I just read that thread. A classic case of a guy who, in this case has a wood shop and plenty of woodworking skill, but thinks he can do the rest with a Parts Express catalog and an imagination.

It seems like he isn't really asking for advice, but is intent on showing off his cabinet build. Am I wrong?

I usually stay away from the AVS DIY forum. I find the signal-to-noise ratio is kind of low there :rolleyes:.
 
fuzz092888

fuzz092888

Audioholic Warlord
LOL! I just read that thread. A classic case of a guy who, in this case has a wood shop and plenty of woodworking skill, but thinks he can do the rest with a Parts Express catalog and an imagination.

It seems like he isn't really asking for advice, but is intent on showing off his cabinet build. Am I wrong?

I usually stay away from the AVS DIY forum. I find the signal-to-noise ratio is kind of low there :rolleyes:.
It doesn't appear you're wrong the guy got some good suggestions and blew by them without even a response. Some just don't want to learn but that's a lot of time effort and money to waste on a project that looks doomed from the start to mediocrity at best.
 
Rickster71

Rickster71

Audioholic Spartan
It doesn't appear you're wrong the guy got some good suggestions and blew by them without even a response. Some just don't want to learn but that's a lot of time effort and money to waste on a project that looks doomed from the start to mediocrity at best.

Ah yes, the power of denial.
Stronger than the force of gravity.:D
 
fuzz092888

fuzz092888

Audioholic Warlord
Ah yes, the power of denial.
Stronger than the force of gravity.:D
I kinda wish someone would model this up to show him what he's going to be getting. Although if he knows this little about speaker design and doesn't care, I doubt showing him an estimated FR graph would change much. :rolleyes:
 
ImcLoud

ImcLoud

Audioholic Ninja
He probably doesn't care how they sound, I had a pile of speakers {junk, I throw in a storage container at my office building, stuff tenants have left behind} my nephew asked if he could have them and I said sure, he took them all and made this god awful frankenstein speaker, a super tweeter bolted to the top of bookshelf speaker screwed to the front of an old cerwin vega 3 way that someone took the small drivers out of... the first time I went to my sisters house he couldnt wait for me to hear it, it was like listening to the factory radio in a 1932 studebaker, but he loved it... still has it powers it with a battery charger and an alpine car amplifier..
 
fuzz092888

fuzz092888

Audioholic Warlord
He probably doesn't care how they sound, I had a pile of speakers {junk, I throw in a storage container at my office building, stuff tenants have left behind} my nephew asked if he could have them and I said sure, he took them all and made this god awful frankenstein speaker, a super tweeter bolted to the top of bookshelf speaker screwed to the front of an old cerwin vega 3 way that someone took the small drivers out of... the first time I went to my sisters house he couldnt wait for me to hear it, it was like listening to the factory radio in a 1932 studebaker, but he loved it... still has it powers it with a battery charger and an alpine car amplifier..
Ah, the power of psychoacoustics and the human mind. :rolleyes:

Pretty much anything will sound good if you've never heard anything better, not to mention the obvious pride he had in his work which made how they sounded even less of a factor. Still, if he loved how they sounded, good for him :D
 
ImcLoud

ImcLoud

Audioholic Ninja
Ah, the power of psychoacoustics and the human mind. :rolleyes:

Pretty much anything will sound good if you've never heard anything better, not to mention the obvious pride he had in his work which made how they sounded even less of a factor. Still, if he loved how they sounded, good for him :D
EXACTLY- I told him they sounded good, I can tell you they were LOUD, lol I did give him a hand making it a little better, he had them all just plugged in, I showed him how to plug just once speaker in {the cerwin} and remove the xover in the small bookshelf and not use 2 tweeters, so he went back to a 3 way, dissabled the bookshelf tweeter, plugged the tweeter and bookshelf into the cerwins crossover, it sounded much better and his exact words were "wow now its really loud..."
 
fuzz092888

fuzz092888

Audioholic Warlord
EXACTLY- I told him they sounded good, I can tell you they were LOUD, lol I did give him a hand making it a little better, he had them all just plugged in, I showed him how to plug just once speaker in {the cerwin} and remove the xover in the small bookshelf and not use 2 tweeters, so he went back to a 3 way, dissabled the bookshelf tweeter, plugged the tweeter and bookshelf into the cerwins crossover, it sounded much better and his exact words were "wow now its really loud..."
That's all some guys want. :) I know over on AVS, the subwoofer conversations get out of control over there. Those guys are talking about being able to hit 140+db no matter what room their in with gjallerhorns and all sorts of insane driver configurations. They're basically running SPL competitions, just in their homes and not their cars.
 
N

Nestor

Senior Audioholic
It doesn't appear you're wrong the guy got some good suggestions and blew by them without even a response. Some just don't want to learn but that's a lot of time effort and money to waste on a project that looks doomed from the start to mediocrity at best.
I would agree that the AVS thread OP went into the project seriously underestimating the design work involved with the electronics end of things, but I don't think he's dismissing the input of others:

And I do understand now the tweeter position level now.
But for this set up it is too late i could redo the front face and experiment it further.

Also the x-over topic is confusing, i know i am using cheap ones the is clear. I will plan a better set up design on my next project including better drivers.

I just wanted to see if i could do it.
Trust me I am wishing for the best just did not want to scrap it at this piont.

Lets call this practice and learning the basics of DIY 101.
At this point, I'm willing to cut him a little slack. Let's see how he does with future projects, should he post them.
 

Latest posts

newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top