War on Terror

[Sheep]

rable rable rable rable rable rable rable rable rable rable.

Thats all I'm reading.

Do we really need ANOTHER war thread?

SheepStar

 

[Matt34]

rable rable rable rable rable rable rable rable rable rable.

Thats all I'm reading.

Do we really need ANOTHER war thread?

SheepStar

No we certainly don't.................unless it's the war on male pattern baldness.

 

[masak_aer]

For me...it's just so sickening that we, the citizens, are just being played fooled by the politicians with all their greeds and propaganda. These are all politics, whoever in the power is the right ones. They can stab each other whenever they have a chance BUT they can be the best friends of the best when they face a common enemy...and we, my friends, are just pawns for their plays.
Come to think of it, if everybody thinks the way you do..HiFi...what's the left of this world?? Are all those people evil? I've seen I think much much more that what you have. I don't say I don't hate the terrorists, I hate them as much you do perhaps even more. I've seen what they've done, with my own eyes!! But to say wipe all the people with the same race out....just because they share the same land...the same religions...how pathetic of you...The middle-eastern countrymen was in fact one of the most civilized people in the world long before America was even known and discovered. Where do you think early Europeans/Americans learnt about all the maths, sciences if not from the people you considered barbarians? hehehehe...
I like the way you put it, Furry...at least we can bring some facts to the table...Do you know...the Christians have and had done terrible things in the past and at present? Christians aka the church had in fact long time ago beheaded hundreds and thousands of people just because they were accused of witches and many petty crimes. Are Christians better than the rest of the world?
Sheep, i hate politics as well...but at least i do try to voice my opinions and try to help others and myself understand what the world is like...I don't want to be ignorant to my surroundings.



I may sound mad, I may sound stupid..but I learn from my mistakes...

 

[highfihoney]

ancient history lessons do not apply no matter how badly you want them to, the plain truth in 2006 is that as a whole the country of afghanastan is nothing more than a band of thugs that contribute nothing helpfull to the world.

 

[furrycute]

How much have the political "conservatives" of this country contributed to the welfare of mankind in these last 6 years?

 

[masak_aer]

When Clinton lied, nobody died (yet he got impeached)...When Bush lied...how many have died? You asked about what have the middle-eastern people contributed to mankind...when facts are laid down in front of you...you twist your words saying that ancient history doesn't count?? How smart..! History is part of the world, part of your being in this world.
Is that how you solve the problems of terrorism? By more killings? Massacres? What is the different between you and the "thugs"...they also love the people who help them and kill those who hate them? Hehehe...with the way you approach it..the cycle would go on and on and on...Thanks to all the people who have the same way of thinking like you.




PS: Anyway...i hope nobody takes this personally...i still love HiFi and all others..

 

[Matt34]

When Clinton lied, nobody died (yet he got impeached)...When Bush lied...how many have died? You asked about what have the middle-eastern people contributed to mankind...when facts are laid down in front of you...you twist your words saying that ancient history doesn't count?? How smart..! History is part of the world, part of your being in this world.
Is that how you solve the problems of terrorism? By more killings? Massacres? What is the different between you and the "thugs"...they also love the people who help them and kill those who hate them? Hehehe...with the way you approach it..the cycle would go on and on and on...Thanks to all the people who have the same way of thinking like you.




PS: Anyway...i hope nobody takes this personally...i still love HiFi and all others..

What did Bush lie about?

 

[Tomorrow]

When Clinton lied, nobody died (yet he got impeached)...When Bush lied...how many have died? You asked about what have the middle-eastern people contributed to mankind...when facts are laid down in front of you...you twist your words saying that ancient history doesn't count?? How smart..! History is part of the world, part of your being in this world.
Is that how you solve the problems of terrorism? By more killings? Massacres? What is the different between you and the "thugs"...they also love the people who help them and kill those who hate them? Hehehe...with the way you approach it..the cycle would go on and on and on...Thanks to all the people who have the same way of thinking like you.

PS: Anyway...i hope nobody takes this personally...i still love HiFi and all others..

Hmmm. It seems like the Muslims, in Muslim countries, in this case Afghanistan and Iraq, currently and historically have butchered MANY more poeple than have all the other invasions, combined. That is NOT a peaceful civilization as you would portray...innocents being rampaged upon by oil greedy Westerners. Your historical view is just a little off center.

 

[chicagomd]

What did Bush lie about?

Sweet mother of God, please tell me you joking. (The below are cut and pasted from bushwatch.org/bushlies.htm )

How about in the State of the Union address:
"By the year 2042, the entire [social security] system would be exhausted and bankrupt."-GWB

In what the BBC calls "highly unusual," a State of the Union Speech was interrupted by a chorus of "No's," booing, and heckles from some of the members of Congress in attendance. This happened immediately after the above Bush lie. As Shields mentioned on the PBS wrap-up, and as Brooks concurred, if adjustments are not made, by 2042, as they have been made before, 3/4 of the funds promised would still be available. The entire system would neither be exhausted nor bankrupt. -- Politex, 02.03.05

How about WMDs:
..."You remember when [Secretary of State] Colin Powell stood up in front of the world, and he said Iraq has got laboratories, mobile labs to build biological weapons....They're illegal. They're against the United Nations resolutions, and we've so far discovered two.* And we'll find more weapons as time goes on, But for those who say we haven't found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they're wrong. We found them." -WP, "Bush: 'We Found' Banned Weapons. President Cites Trailers in Iraq as Proof, " May 31, 2003

*At the time of this statement, no such weapons were found, and no such weapons have been found to this day. On this point as well as the use of the captured trailers as biolabs, the WP said this in the above article: "U.S. authorities have to date made no claim of a confirmed finding of an actual nuclear, biological or chemical weapon. In the interview, Bush said weapons had been found, but in elaborating, he mentioned only the trailers"

Check out www.bushlies.net/pages/10/index.htm[/url] for more recent examples. All the quotes are referenced so you can look up the source material FOR YOURSELF.

If people in this country, including the news media, spent more time fact checking and using their brain rather than just vomiting up what the RNC and the DNC cram down their throats, we would all me a lot less divided about a lot of issues. Now I grant you that the websites I directed you to have a very liberal slant, but look up the information yourself before passing judgement.

 

[annunaki]

Would we still be having these discussions if there were no religions?

Let's face it, the real reason these extremists hate the west is becuase we do not believe the same way they do. Much the same way they were persecuted centuries ago by some of our ancestors. All for what? Because they believe their god is the right god. People are different. Why can't some of these zealots understand that? Oh yeah, because they have been brainwashed by their own kind. Since when does anyone normal think it is okay to kill another just because they believe something different. The last time I checked, the main people killing in the name of (insert the diety you wish) were all way too involved with their OWN view of what their holy book or divinity said, rather than their book's actual meanings.

If there were no religions, would we then be simply kill each other because of race, because of sex, because of eye color? Where would it end. The sooner our species can except that well will have differences, AND LIVE with them the better. We may then actually begin to solve real problems and work collectively.



We the PEOPLE of the United States need to start realizing that Party lines DO NOT MATTER ANYMORE. The current new breed of politician is whatever they need to be to get in office. Politicians DO NOT CARE about the people anymore, nor do they represent US. They are only content with growing their own power. The thing that sucks, is that some people in this country do not seem to care. They are so lazy they would rather just hand away their money and freedoms to the government so they have one less thing to worry about. If we get rid of government control in so many of the programs out there and WE get to keep more tax dollars. WE can then afford private health care like our grandparents did, not to mention many other thing. We went to war over a 5% tax on tea. Now we pay OUR government in upwards of 25%-35% of OUR hard earned money. Because society has been lazy, the government has snatched away some of our freedom and lots of our cash. We like idiot keep voting in the same old people. Though it may never happen, we should vote for those who cannot afford huge advertising campaigns, vote for those who truly want what is best for the People. Screw voting for Republican or Democrat, because as we are seeing, there is not much difference.

 

[WndrBr3d]

Hmmm. It seems like the Muslims, in Muslim countries, in this case Afghanistan and Iraq, currently and historically have butchered MANY more people than have all the other invasions, combined.

Lest we forget the entire continent of Africa and the daily mass genocide happening over there.

Stalin alone killed MILLIONS of his own people (we're talking 30-50 MILLION).

Uneducated and poorly researched statements like yours only spread this culture of anti intellectualism.

 

[Tomorrow]

Sweet mother of God, please tell me you joking. (The below are cut and pasted from bushwatch.org/bushlies.htm )

How about in the State of the Union address:
"By the year 2042, the entire [social security] system would be exhausted and bankrupt."-GWB

In what the BBC calls "highly unusual," a State of the Union Speech was interrupted by a chorus of "No's," booing, and heckles from some of the members of Congress in attendance. This happened immediately after the above Bush lie. As Shields mentioned on the PBS wrap-up, and as Brooks concurred, if adjustments are not made, by 2042, as they have been made before, 3/4 of the funds promised would still be available. The entire system would neither be exhausted nor bankrupt. -- Politex, 02.03.05

How about WMDs:
..."You remember when [Secretary of State] Colin Powell stood up in front of the world, and he said Iraq has got laboratories, mobile labs to build biological weapons....They're illegal. They're against the United Nations resolutions, and we've so far discovered two.* And we'll find more weapons as time goes on, But for those who say we haven't found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they're wrong. We found them." -WP, "Bush: 'We Found' Banned Weapons. President Cites Trailers in Iraq as Proof, " May 31, 2003

*At the time of this statement, no such weapons were found, and no such weapons have been found to this day. On this point as well as the use of the captured trailers as biolabs, the WP said this in the above article: "U.S. authorities have to date made no claim of a confirmed finding of an actual nuclear, biological or chemical weapon. In the interview, Bush said weapons had been found, but in elaborating, he mentioned only the trailers"

Check out www.bushlies.net/pages/10/index.htm[/url] for more recent examples. All the quotes are referenced so you can look up the source material FOR YOURSELF.

If people in this country, including the news media, spent more time fact checking and using their brain rather than just vomiting up what the RNC and the DNC cram down their throats, we would all me a lot less divided about a lot of issues. Now I grant you that the websites I directed you to have a very liberal slant, but look up the information yourself before passing judgement.

Some time, somewhere along the line, it is my fervent hope that all you biased ("he did"..."yeah but he did") liberals and conservatives come to realize the ALL politicians lie. Bleeting that one is better or worse than another is like trying to compare horse manure to cow manure. They both stink. And to prefer one over the other is an ego-game. (He lies about things that I lie about...he's biased about the same things I'm biased about, therefore I like him {and attack the other guy on internet forums } .)

To excuse or belabor the malfeasance of one demigod over another is ridiculous. Everyone seems to have lost the hard-fought lessons won in the '60s in this country. Governance ethics and the the value of the Constitution have hit rock bottom...along with our own ability to evaluate ourselves and find ways that WE can improve the world instead of complaining about others.

PS: By the way, as I understand it, by virtue of the nature of being a "God", there can be no Mother of God, sweet or otherwise.

 

[Tomorrow]

Lest we forget the entire continent of Africa and the daily mass genocide happening over there.

Stalin alone killed MILLIONS of his own people (we're talking 30-50 MILLION).

Uneducated and poorly researched statements like yours only spread this culture of anti intellectualism.

I don't understand the uncalled-for slam. How does Stalin and the African wars have anything to do with Muslims slaughtering Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan...which was the point of my post?

EDIT: Now, on the other hand, if your statement reflects educated, well-researched commentary, then I'm delighted spread the culture of anti-intellectualism.

 

[nibhaz]

PS: By the way, as I understand it, by virtue of the nature of being a "God", there can be no Mother of God, sweet or otherwise.

That really depends on your view point of the holy trinity, and Mary's roll in said matter, semantically speaking.

 

[Tomorrow]

That really depends on your view point of the holy trinity, and Mary's roll in said matter, semantically speaking.

LOL. Yes...we have The Father...The Son...and The Holy Ghost. (I was raised Catholic and I never quite got the Holy Ghost part.) But no Mary, or otherwise "Mother of God". Do you think if there was one that she was (ahem) favoring all three at once?

 

[furrycute]

Politicians have always been self serving. They are the nastiest coniving SOBs of human society. But let's face it, you can't live without them.

It's just lately those conservatives have gotten way out of hand. Someone needs to slap them back to reality in the next election.

Getting a BJ is one thing, no one dies. Starting a war on false petenses resulting in the deaths of thousands of our own countrymen, the deaths of hundreds of thousands of citizens of another country, that's just inexecusable.

How can one live with oneself when all these people died in the name of money to be made on conquered oil by those giant oil companies?

 

[nibhaz]

Sweet mother of God, please tell me you joking. (The below are cut and pasted from bushwatch.org/bushlies.htm )

How about in the State of the Union address:
"By the year 2042, the entire [social security] system would be exhausted and bankrupt."-GWB

In what the BBC calls "highly unusual," a State of the Union Speech was interrupted by a chorus of "No's," booing, and heckles from some of the members of Congress in attendance. This happened immediately after the above Bush lie. As Shields mentioned on the PBS wrap-up, and as Brooks concurred, if adjustments are not made, by 2042, as they have been made before, 3/4 of the funds promised would still be available. The entire system would neither be exhausted nor bankrupt. -- Politex, 02.03.05

It's good that you get your information from a source which obviously has an agenda, no reason what so ever to question there use or interpretation of the "facts." Why don’t you actually try reading the Congressional Budget Offices reports on social security.

By to 2019 the benefits paid out will exceed incoming revenue. (In the business world we call this Bankrupt) Starting in 2019 the OASDI Trust Fund Ratio will begin to fall and will reach zero in 2052. “At that point, from a trust fund perspective, some revenues will come from interest earnings on Treasury bonds held by the trust funds (and, beginning in 2033, from redemption of those bonds). In effect, cash will be transferred from the government's general fund to Social Security--just as it would be after the trust funds are exhausted in the scheduled-benefits scenario. To generate the real financial resources to support those transfers, the government will have to either run a surplus in the rest of the budget or borrow from the public.-CBO” (Read as increased national debit passed on to future generations.)

Your source is correct in stating that 80% percent of benefits could be paid, but is not 80%, 20% short of what the people are entitled to by law. I would say that a program that cannot meet its lawful obligations is broken. Of course this is of little concern for those fortunate enough to save for their own retirement, but what about the little guy? Social Security benefits at the full rate are barely enough for the less fortunate now take away 20% and tell them it’s not broken. But being a doctor and the income that affords you, I can understand why this situation does not trouble you.

http://www.cbo.gov/publications/collections/socialsecurity.cfm#pt2

How about WMDs:
..."You remember when [Secretary of State] Colin Powell stood up in front of the world, and he said Iraq has got laboratories, mobile labs to build biological weapons....They're illegal. They're against the United Nations resolutions, and we've so far discovered two.* And we'll find more weapons as time goes on, But for those who say we haven't found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they're wrong. We found them." -WP, "Bush: 'We Found' Banned Weapons. President Cites Trailers in Iraq as Proof, " May 31, 2003

*At the time of this statement, no such weapons were found, and no such weapons have been found to this day. On this point as well as the use of the captured trailers as biolabs, the WP said this in the above article: "U.S. authorities have to date made no claim of a confirmed finding of an actual nuclear, biological or chemical weapon. In the interview, Bush said weapons had been found, but in elaborating, he mentioned only the trailers"

"Allegations of public untruthfulness by Presidents -- often on important matters of state -- have been levelled at most Presidents. President Reagan faced accusations about his truthfulness regarding Iran-Contra. President Bush confronted similar charges, with The New York Times characterizing his statements on the subject as "incredible." President Johnson faced a "credibility gap" regarding his statements about the Viet Nam war. President Kennedy lied about the Bay of Pigs, and President Eisenhower lied about Gary Powers and the U2 incident. And many have suggested that Presidents Wilson and Franklin Roosevelt were less than fully candid about the prospective involvement of the United States in World Wars I and II. All of these alleged misstatements related to public policy. They denied the public and Congress an opportunity to exercise their democratic prerogative to affect those policies.

In a briefing for journalists reported on October 29, 2003, the director of the National Imagery and Mapping Agency said satellite images showed a heavy flow of traffic from Iraq into Syria just before the American invasion in March 2003. Retired Air Force Lieutenant General James Clapper Jr. said he believed "unquestionably" that illicit weapons material was transported into Syria and perhaps other countries. He said "I think people below the Saddam- Hussein-and-his-sons level saw what was coming and decided the best thing to do was to destroy and disperse. ... I think probably in the few months running up to the onset of the conflict, I think there was probably an intensive effort to disperse into private hands, to bury it, and to move it outside the country's borders."

In an exclusive interview with The Sunday Telegraph published on January 25, 2004, Dr. David Kay, the former head of the Iraq Survey Group, said there was evidence that unspecified materials had been moved to Syria shortly before the start of the war to overthrow Saddam. "We are not talking about a large stockpile of weapons," he said. "But we know from some of the interrogations of former Iraqi officials that a lot of material went to Syria before the war, including some components of Saddam's WMD programme. Precisely what went to Syria, and what has happened to it, is a major issue that needs to be resolved."" - http://www.globalsecurity.org/

 

[nibhaz]

How can one live with oneself when all these people died in the name of money to be made on conquered oil by those giant oil companies?

If this is what you truly believe the sole objective of the War in Iraq is all about then I have two suggestions for you depending on where you live.

1.If you live in the US you need to arm yourself now and begin stockpiling supplies so you are prepared to revolt against the US government.

2.If you live outside the US you need to arm yourself now and begin stockpiling supplies so you are prepared when America comes to secure all of your natural resources.

 

[Tomorrow]

Would we still be having these discussions if there were no religions?

Let's face it, the real reason these extremists hate the west is becuase we do not believe the same way they do. Much the same way they were persecuted centuries ago by some of our ancestors. All for what? Because they believe their god is the right god. People are different. Why can't some of these zealots understand that? Oh yeah, because they have been brainwashed by their own kind. Since when does anyone normal think it is okay to kill another just because they believe something different. The last time I checked, the main people killing in the name of (insert the diety you wish) were all way too involved with their OWN view of what their holy book or divinity said, rather than their book's actual meanings.

If there were no religions, would we then be simply kill each other because of race, because of sex, because of eye color? Where would it end. The sooner our species can except that well will have differences, AND LIVE with them the better. We may then actually begin to solve real problems and work collectively.



We the PEOPLE of the United States need to start realizing that Party lines DO NOT MATTER ANYMORE. The current new breed of politician is whatever they need to be to get in office. Politicians DO NOT CARE about the people anymore, nor do they represent US. They are only content with growing their own power. The thing that sucks, is that some people in this country do not seem to care. They are so lazy they would rather just hand away their money and freedoms to the government so they have one less thing to worry about. If we get rid of government control in so many of the programs out there and WE get to keep more tax dollars. WE can then afford private health care like our grandparents did, not to mention many other thing. We went to war over a 5% tax on tea. Now we pay OUR government in upwards of 25%-35% of OUR hard earned money. Because society has been lazy, the government has snatched away some of our freedom and lots of our cash. We like idiot keep voting in the same old people. Though it may never happen, we should vote for those who cannot afford huge advertising campaigns, vote for those who truly want what is best for the People. Screw voting for Republican or Democrat, because as we are seeing, there is not much difference.

Now you're talkin'!!!

 

[masak_aer]

When i made my comment about Clinton n Bush lied...I never meant that i favored the Democrats or the Republicans. Both have their own shares of faults and mistakes but the extend of their lies are different. As I have mentioned before..these big parties are not in their best terms of friendships. They stab each other at the back...but when they see they see someone else on a different side of the river harrasing them..Holy cow! They can be closer than Pam and Tommy in the f*****g boat. The ongoing War on terror s**t, IMHO, is just a propaganda. Politics in play. We who are the "common" people are being played. Even the news you all see on TV and papers you all read do no reflect the actual reality. They want you to be scared, to support whoever is in power now.

We have all been the victims of slogans, propaganda, lies from all the people in power. What we can do is to do what we all do best: HT discussions.

I'm afraid we all turn greens and purple after all this talk. There seems to be no ending to this thread. It has been fun and i can bet there must be bruises on some politicians' feelings if they read this but what the heck, i'm still looking to get a decent music dvd for my collections. Anybody has any suggestion?