Severe Quality Issues at NHT and Aperion (50% Defective)

B

Byron Flagg

Enthusiast
First, I need someone to tell me I'm not crazy and there is actually a home theater speaker company that can deliver functional speakers more than half the time.

Second, I desperately and urgently need some guidance as to what to do next.

So this starts back in May of last year when I ordered three NHT C-3 bookshelf speakers to renovate my home theater with a matched LCR set. Of the initial shipment of three speakers, two of them were grossly defective. By grossly defective I mean that on one of the speakers, the aluminum mid tweeter dome was deeply dented in a location it could not possibly have been dented after assembly; under the tweeter protector.

IMG_1073.jpg


A representative at NHT insists that it must have been damaged after shipment by pressing the plastic tweeter protector into the dome... except that the tweeter protector is very rigid (it would probably snap if bent in that far) and the dent in the tweeter dome in no way matches the shape of the protector. In fact the dent is perpendicular to the nearest protector strut. The other defective speaker exhibited a terrible buzz from the mid tweeter that I heard immediately upon sending the first burst of pink noise to the speaker while setting channel levels. NHT accepted both speakers back and sent two replacement speakers.

Of the two replacement speakers sent, one of them had a stripped wall mounting lug on the back side. The other speaker appeared to be OK so I let NHT know about the stripped lug and moved on.

BIG MISTAKE. Recently the same speaker with the stripped mounting lug has begun to exhibit a subtle but definite buzz in at frequencies ranging from 160 - 260Hz. So in total I had then received five speakers from NHT, three of which were functionally defective in easily identifiable ways. With the latest developing buzz being the last straw, I contacted NHT and asked them to accept the return of all three speakers for a full refund as I had lost confidence in the quality control of the C-3 line and didn't want to wait for more failures. They have since refused to accept the speakers back, citing their 30 day return period. They have offered to provide me whatever components I need to repair the defective speaker, assuming I can figure out which component is defective.

So that is only half of the mind numbing story. So then I decide to dump the NHT speakers and go with Aperion Verus II Grand Towers and Center instead. So I order the towers shortly before Christmas and receive them just after. I get the speakers all unpacked and set up (no easy task) and again as soon as I run pink noise to them to set channel levels, I know something is terribly wrong. The tweeter on the one of the towers is completely non functional.

Aperion Verus II Grand Tower Defective 2016-12-29.JPG


So I contact Aperion and their rep asks me to take the tweeter out of the tower and test it directly to see if it works, which it does, so the problem is in the wiring or the crossover. So they agree to send a replacement while I haul the defective speaker back to a FedEx facility for return. So more waiting, while my home theater sits completely unusable now for weeks.

Today my replacement Aperion Verus II Grand Tower arrives and I excitedly take it into my home theater to unbox and set it up. As soon as I pick up the box I hear a strange clunking sound from inside; something I didn't hear from any of the other Aperion boxes. But I figure that one of the feet must have come loose from the packaging or something. But no. I get the speaker unboxed and sure enough there is something loose rattling around inside the speaker. Peering in the bass ports on the back I find that actually there are TWO somethings loose rattling around inside the speaker; two cardboard tubes, one immediately inside each of the rear ports. Both of which have adhesive on one end, but both floating around loose inside the speaker. I assume that these are components of the bass tuning enclosure. AND this after the rep at Aperion promised they would test the replacement speaker prior to shipping to make sure it was good to go. What do you think the chances are they tested a speaker with two tubes floating around inside?

IMG_0090.jpg


IMG_0089.jpg


So now I'm completely freaking out. I've just spent thousands upon thousands of dollars in "high end" speakers from two reputable speaker companies who have now sent me a total of nine speakers, four of which have been grossly defective right out of the box. It has also cost me hours of work and weeks of waiting while my home theater sits dark and lonely.

A couple things worth mentioning before I ask you all for advice:

All of the packaging of all of these speakers appeared normally worn from travel but utterly free of any real damage. The NHT C-3s were double boxed and the inner boxes were immaculate.

At the same time as ordering the speakers from NHT and Aperion, I also ordered subwoofers from Rythmik and HSU. It would seem to me that subwoofers are far more likely to get damaged in transit due to their size and weight, but both of the subwoofers seem to be in perfect condition.

I mean, this situation seems to be essentially impossible. There is no way NHT and Aperion are staying in business while shipping 50% defective product. In my work as an AV engineer, I have specified, purchased, installed and used somewhere in the range of one million dollars in pro audio, video, and lighting equipment and I honestly can't remember the last time I received a piece of defective equipment directly from the manufacturer. Of that million dollars in equipment, at least $100,000 of that is speakers and I have NEVER received a defective speaker from the likes of Meyer, QSC, Fulcrum, EAW, etc. In my current work in the medical device manufacturing industry, we talk in quality terms such as six sigma, meaning 3.4 failures per MILLION products. I know that speakers aren't exactly medical devices, but good grief!

Someone please tell me that I'm dreaming and that the world of home theater audio really isn't this crappy. Or else tell me that the whole internet direct concept is actually a huge prank that everyone else knows about except me and that all I need to do is buy from a "real" speaker manufacturer like Paradigm or RBH.

So after the whole debacle with NHT I swore that I would learn from my mistake and that if I received a defective speaker from Aperion, I wouldn't mess around, I would just return the entire set while I still could and move on to another manufacturer. Well after burning through NHT and now Aperion, the only other one that really caught my eye is SVS with the Ultra Tower and Center.

So now I put it out to all you good people of the Audioholics world to help me decide what to do next.

If I'm looking for a tower and center set for around $1000 per unit, should I go with SVS? Or is internet direct the devil and I should go back to buying reliable speakers from brick and mortar companies like BOSE?
 

Attachments

Last edited:
S

shadyJ

Speaker of the House
Staff member
All this stuff is made in China. That isn't necessarily a bad thing as there are different levels of quality control you can have from China. The trick is getting something that has a high level of quality control. It could be that you just got unlucky. By the laws of statistics, someone somewhere is bound to have more than their fair share of duds and that someone could be you. I would just stick with Aperion if they are willing to help you make this thing right. After all, by the laws of statistics, what are the odds that you will get three dud speakers in a row? Very unlikely, unless it is the local shipping branch that is doing the damage. If the local shipping Fedex or UPS is really tough on your packages, than it doesn't matter who you order from, it all stands a higher chance of being damaged.
 
rojo

rojo

Audioholic Samurai
If you'd prefer an alternative that isn't mass produced in China, I recommend Philharmonic Audio and Salk Sound. The Philharmonic Slims Towers and MTM center would run about $3000, and would offer ribbon tweeters, the refined sound of revered crossover god Dennis Murphy, and the artisan cabinetry of Jim Salk. The Salk Songbirds and Song Center run about $2400, also featuring a crossover design by Dennis Murphy.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Sad to hear that. I ordered a pair of speakers from NHT and one had a bad tweeter, so I saw 50% as well, but that was a single instance and I didn't give it that much thought.

If you want to make sure not to have a repeat, you can order a pair of Philharmonic Slims for $200 more than the Ultra towers:
http://philharmonicaudio.com/slims.html

These are neutral and accurate speakers (which I assume you want being in the pro audio industry). If you research the quality of the components, Dennis Murphy's "pedigree", and factor in the cabinets built by Jim Salk, this is a lot more speaker than you can touch anywhere else for $2200! Also entirely built in the US by either Jim Salk (cabinet) or Dennis Murphy (Assembly and crossover)...and Murphy tests each one before it goes out the door (ask him for a plot of the frequency responses if you like)!

And you'll be emailing/talking directly with Dennis about your speakers and no cardboard porting in these!
If anything is wrong, blame Dennis! There is no one else to point fingers at!!!:cool:

If you've never heard of Dennis or Philharmonic Audio, do a little research on Dennis Murphy and/or email him at info@philharmonicaudio.com

Edit: So I type slow and Rojo doesn't...
 
Last edited:
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Then good golly stop buying from the latest brand incarnations with these familiar names :rolleyes:
 
B

Byron Flagg

Enthusiast
Just sayin that Aperion and NHT aren't even faintly on my radar.
So what has your radar been locked onto as the best performing home theater tower and center options for less than $1000 each?
 
KenM10759

KenM10759

Audioholic Samurai
Wow that's really bad and in today's marketplace, unacceptable.

I'm not making a recommendation but will state that between my son and myself we've bought 14 (6 pairs and 2 center) speakers from KEF. About 1/2 came from internet buys, 1/2 came from a brick & mortar dealer (and at the same discounts, BTW.) Not one has had any defects, all sound fine, and all are made in China. I thought one might have oversized holes in the binding posts for banana plug connections, but turns out I was using crappy banana plugs after I checked actual sizes with my machinist tools.

So it can be done and routinely is by all the major, common speaker makers such as B&W, KEF, Revel, Wharfdale, Klipsch, Polk, and so many more. This may be one reason why NHT and Aperion haven't garnered the market share these others have.
 
Good4it

Good4it

Audioholic Chief
I have 2 Aperion Versus II Grand bookshelf speakers and am VERY HAPPY with them both cosmetically and with the sound. I use them as rear speakers with 2 Philharmonitors in front.

I bought both new.
 
Last edited:
B

Byron Flagg

Enthusiast
I've received an update from Steve Benton at Aperion. He concedes that they have had quality issues from one of their contract manufacturers in China that is doing final assembly of driver and cabinet components. Some months ago there was a fire and the facility had to be moved a significant enough distance that all direct labor positions had to be restaffed. Ever since then the quality has been poor with approximately 1 in 20 units being received defective.

Steve indicates that they are discontinuing use of that particular contract manufacturer which is why several of their Verus II product lines are currently on back order.

On Monday Steve is going to get back to me with their game plan which he thinks will involve complete disassembly, inspection, and functional testing of replacement speakers before shipment.

Because the Verus II Grand Towers are such a good match for my application I'm willing to give them a third and final shot at redemption. But from here on out if I run into any issues, I'm packing all three of speakers up and sending them back before the trial period is over. But that would give me no pleasure as I'd be back to the drawing board in my speaker search and most likely having to make trips to some local dealers while my home theater sits empty and sad.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Glad Aperion is forthcoming about this. Not sure when they realized 1 in 20 was bad, but at that point, they should have hired some H.S. kids to come in and carefully unpack and check every speaker from that location before they ship. Budgetwise, this might cost more than letting customers "test" them and returning every 20th speakers they ship, but it is a serious issue if they build a reputation for unreliable quality (especially since this is their flagship product)!
What bothers me is knowing that some buyers will not listen closely enough to detect the problems. That may be hard to believe, but many people will read a review, order the speakers and, as long as it sounds better than the TV speakers, be happy with them "knowing" they were well received by the "expert" reviewers.

I hope everything works out for you. They should be paying you a tech rate for assisting, but I get that that is the easiest course of action for you and , at least, since you are involved in the diagnosis/repair, you will have more confidence it is done right!
 
B

Beave

Audioholic Chief
Byron, I see you listed the NHTs on AVS Forum's classified section. Did you get the "buzz" fixed or are you selling them with that issue still there?
 
B

Byron Flagg

Enthusiast
Byron, I see you listed the NHTs on AVS Forum's classified section. Did you get the "buzz" fixed or are you selling them with that issue still there?
One of the three speakers I originally ordered from NHT appears to be in perfect working order, as is one of the replacement speakers they sent to replace the two I received with gross defects and audible buzz. Of the three I have now, only one of them is exhibiting a very subtle buzz that I'm not sure most people would even notice. I think it is coming from the terminal panel on the back. Ironic timing of your post; I was just poking around with it this afternoon. I'm working with Bob Hopkins at NHT to get replacement parts while I start looking for a buyer for all three, hopefully.

Let me know if you're interested in any of them; or the Rythmik F12 subwoofer. I don't have enough posts on the Audioholics forum to post a classified yet.
 
B

Beave

Audioholic Chief
I just found it, uhm, er, interesting, that you posted here about how bad their quality was, then posted a classified on AVS Forums - as a first time poster, no less - saying they are in mint condition.
 
B

Byron Flagg

Enthusiast
I just found it, uhm, er, interesting, that you posted here about how bad their quality was, then posted a classified on AVS Forums - as a first time poster, no less - saying they are in mint condition.
I think you are absolutely right to raise an eyebrow when you connected the dots and that fact wasn't lost on me as I was writing up the listing. You'll note in the thread above that I had already indicated that I was "dumping" the NHT speakers. I'd gladly list them here at Audioholics if the system would let me.

The word "quality" is also very broad and encompasses a lot of different aspects of a product. To be perfectly fair to NHT and Aperion, I think the quality of their components is excellent and the fidelity of the speakers (when they work) is also excellent. I think NHT has serious quality control issues in their final assembly process where components are being damaged or poorly assembled. Aperion has admitted to as much. So we can't lump all aspects of the products quality and performance in with a specific quality control issue during final assembly.

I'm selling the NHT speakers not only because I'm not impressed with their quality control, but also because the speakers ended up being under powered for my application. In a previous thread that focused more on auto-EQ I talked both about the good sound quality of the NHT speakers as well as the fact that they ended up being under powered.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/threads/help-help-im-being-repressed.105758/

So I'm willing to keep sorting through speakers with Aperion in the hope that they will meet my needs when I get some well assembled units. On the other hand, someone else will benefit from my having sorted through the NHT units when they purchase virtually brand new (and verified) speakers at a discount.

Or... if no one ends up wanting them, then eventually I'll justify another use for them around the house somewhere. They would make amazing computer speakers in my office.

Once I get this whole speaker supply issue worked out, I hope to share some data demonstrating the results I get from Dirac room correction using the Aperion Verus II Grand Towers and Center driven by a new Emotiva XMC-1 and XPA Gen 3.
 
B

BenjaminS

Audiophyte
I recently posted a question regarding the lack of reviews of the NHT C-3 loudspeakers. I speculated that this might have been due to poor quality. This thread confirms my suspicion.
 
C

Cain Galata

Enthusiast
How interesting. I bought a pair of NHT SuperZeros about 2 years back for rear channels. They sounded fine to me until I used my Disney bluray setup disc When doing the pink noise I noticed a hiss or weird static on 1 of the speakers. When I play regular material though, I don't notice anything. Also, when I use my Marantz Audyssey to set it up, it is completely fine. I figure it is a narrow frequency range that is causing the issue. Unless you are testing for specific frequencies, how the hell would the average person notice this?
 
R

randyb

Full Audioholic
I concur with Bryan. I have had similiar issues even with some "reliable" brands. Of my last three speaker purchases, one had wiring issues with the crossover, one had out of phase drivers in all three used in my main front speakers, and one had a loose object rattling around similiar to Bryan. All three were from favorites of the forum crowds. Kind of disheartening since I like the owners of all three companies. Kef is one I have never had a problem with their products LS50s
 
D

dswierenga

Audiophyte
I have three speakers from the C-series--a C4 pair and the C LRC. I also have a pair of Classic 3s as surrounds. All are flawless. NHT is well known for its customer service and stands behind their products. I believe that your issues were unique to you.
 

Latest posts

newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top