Selecting amp and speaker selector for a set of full range speakers

[hisfallacy]

Hi experts,

I need to create a sound sytem for a dining area with multiple rooms/zones, with a total of 4 speakers.
How do I calculate/determine the required specs for my amplifier and speaker selector? Or vice versa?

Context:
I tried to read up online, and have some sense of what I need to do, but i'm not very well-versed in this and dont want to make a huge mistake, or spend a lot and get something that sounds very weak. Also, don't have a huge budget. So please guide me.

I have been given the following speakers: Kicker KB6000 Full-range: KB6000 Full Range | KICKER
Since its a restaurant, each speaker will be full range.
These are 2-way, 8 ohms, 75W RMS Power.

If I have 4 of these, the effecive impedance is 2 ohms? (based on what I read/understood)
Should i then get an amplifier for 2 ohms? Although, isnt that when i connect in parallel? So what about connecting with speaker selector, what impedance should the amplifier be, and what about the impedance for the speaker selector?

And what about the power - should i get an amplifier that is 75*4 = 300 Watts RMS power or slightly more?
And what power should the speaker selector support?

Basically my question is, what should be the relationship between the ohms and watts between the speaker, speaker selector, and amplifier? What other major considerations are there?
And if there are any specific products that work well with these speakers that would be great.

Thanks so much.
Vik

 

[jinjuku]

The correct way to do this is a 70v distributed audio system. Normally in a business setting I would encourage you to seek a paid professional.

If just four speakers it should be pretty painless and quick.

With that said:

1. What is the budget?
2. How many zones? What is the cubic footage of each zone? Outside/inside or a mix?
3. Will each zone just need independent volume controls, independent sources, both?

 

[Plexmulti9]

Hi experts,

I need to create a sound sytem for a dining area with multiple rooms/zones, with a total of 4 speakers.
How do I calculate/determine the required specs for my amplifier and speaker selector? Or vice versa?

Context:
I tried to read up online, and have some sense of what I need to do, but i'm not very well-versed in this and dont want to make a huge mistake, or spend a lot and get something that sounds very weak. Also, don't have a huge budget. So please guide me.

I have been given the following speakers: Kicker KB6000 Full-range: KB6000 Full Range | KICKER
Since its a restaurant, each speaker will be full range.
These are 2-way, 8 ohms, 75W RMS Power.

If I have 4 of these, the effecive impedance is 2 ohms? (based on what I read/understood)
Should i then get an amplifier for 2 ohms? Although, isnt that when i connect in parallel? So what about connecting with speaker selector, what impedance should the amplifier be, and what about the impedance for the speaker selector?

And what about the power - should i get an amplifier that is 75*4 = 300 Watts RMS power or slightly more?
And what power should the speaker selector support?

Basically my question is, what should be the relationship between the ohms and watts between the speaker, speaker selector, and amplifier? What other major considerations are there?
And if there are any specific products that work well with these speakers that would be great.

Thanks so much.
Vik

Impedance matching volume control paired with any name brand receiver will do fine.

 

[jinjuku]

Impedance matching volume control paired with any name brand receiver will do fine.

If he needs 4 independent zones as far as sources he'll have a problem with a standard receiver.

 

[TLS Guy]

Impedance matching volume control paired with any name brand receiver will do fine.

Receivers make lousy distribution amps, especially in commercial spaces. Use of these devices under these circumstances always voids the warranty.

In a commercial space the cheapest way to go, and usually the best, is to use a 70 volt distribution system with a PA amp. This makes the addition of mic paging systems easy. The wiring is simple as you don't need long thick cables. You can use bell wire as the current is so small. There is a transformer at each speaker. This makes it easy to get even power distribution. The taps are marked on watts. The rules are simple. The lower the watt setting connected to the speaker, the lower the volume will be from that speaker and vice versa. The only other rule is that the sum of the watt settings should add up to the total power available from the amp as closely as possible.

It is simple and easy to instal once you know the simple rules and very durable. For commercial spaces this IS the preferred way to go.

 

[hisfallacy]

I learned something new, thanks!

- Its 3 zones (up to 4 zones if its easy enough)
- each will have independent volume controls, not sources. (that would be a luxury, but its not needed)
- the space: the largest room is 20' by 30' by 9' so about 5400 cubic footage. smallest room is patio outside which is half of that.
- budget: overall system about $700 incl speakers. ( i got those 4 speakers at costco at about $200 total, but thats returnable, if it doesnt make sense)
lower is better, we are spread pretty thin already, but i don't want to buy something that becomes useless.

I found this 70volt system on amazon: "Pyle Home PT510 240 Watt Amplifier with 70V Output" - would that work?
This has 4-ohm and 8-ohm outputs - so i just use the 8-ohm output?
Do i then need speakers with less rms wattage perhaps since my 4 speakers would be 75*4=300 W combined?
Also, then this will connect to my speaker selector, right? and what sort of specs should that have, 240 W?

If you can give at least a theoretical sample of specs for each, that would work together, that would help a lot.

thanks so much!

The correct way to do this is a 70v distributed audio system. Normally in a business setting I would encourage you to seek a paid professional.

If just four speakers it should be pretty painless and quick.

With that said:

1. What is the budget?
2. How many zones? What is the cubic footage of each zone? Outside/inside or a mix?
3. Will each zone just need independent volume controls, independent sources, both?

 

[hisfallacy]

Appreciate all your responses.

I learned something new, thanks!

- Its 3 zones (up to 4 zones if its easy enough)
- each will have independent volume controls, not sources. (that would be a luxury, but its not needed)
- the space: the largest room is 20' by 30' by 9' so about 5400 cubic footage. smallest room is patio outside which is half of that.
- budget: overall system about $700 incl speakers. ( i got those 4 speakers at costco at about $200 total, but thats returnable, if it doesnt make sense)
lower is better, we are spread pretty thin already, but i don't want to buy something that becomes useless.

I found this 70volt system on amazon: "Pyle Home PT510 240 Watt Amplifier with 70V Output" - would that work?
This has 4-ohm and 8-ohm outputs - so i just use the 8-ohm output?
Do i then need speakers with less rms wattage perhaps since my 4 speakers would be 75*4=300 W combined?
Also, then this will connect to my speaker selector, right? and what sort of specs should that have, 240 W?

If you can give at least a theoretical sample of specs for each, that would work together, that would help a lot.

thanks so much!

 

[TLS Guy]

Appreciate all your responses.

I learned something new, thanks!

- Its 3 zones (up to 4 zones if its easy enough)
- each will have independent volume controls, not sources. (that would be a luxury, but its not needed)
- the space: the largest room is 20' by 30' by 9' so about 5400 cubic footage. smallest room is patio outside which is half of that.
- budget: overall system about $700 incl speakers. ( i got those 4 speakers at costco at about $200 total, but thats returnable, if it doesnt make sense)
lower is better, we are spread pretty thin already, but i don't want to buy something that becomes useless.

I found this 70volt system on amazon: "Pyle Home PT510 240 Watt Amplifier with 70V Output" - would that work?
This has 4-ohm and 8-ohm outputs - so i just use the 8-ohm output?
Do i then need speakers with less rms wattage perhaps since my 4 speakers would be 75*4=300 W combined?
Also, then this will connect to my speaker selector, right? and what sort of specs should that have, 240 W?

If you can give at least a theoretical sample of specs for each, that would work together, that would help a lot.

thanks so much!

Sorry, but you haven't got a clue.

You use the 70 volt output. If you use the speakers you have you will need a transformer at each speaker. Either return those and get speaker with transformers. For a 70 volt system the impedances you will be needing are 500 to 5000 ohms. You will need to some soldering if you do this yourself.

This article explains how to do it.

 

[Plexmulti9]

Appreciate all your responses.

I learned something new, thanks!

- Its 3 zones (up to 4 zones if its easy enough)
- each will have independent volume controls, not sources. (that would be a luxury, but its not needed)
- the space: the largest room is 20' by 30' by 9' so about 5400 cubic footage. smallest room is patio outside which is half of that.
- budget: overall system about $700 incl speakers. ( i got those 4 speakers at costco at about $200 total, but thats returnable, if it doesnt make sense)
lower is better, we are spread pretty thin already, but i don't want to buy something that becomes useless.

I found this 70volt system on amazon: "Pyle Home PT510 240 Watt Amplifier with 70V Output" - would that work?
This has 4-ohm and 8-ohm outputs - so i just use the 8-ohm output?
Do i then need speakers with less rms wattage perhaps since my 4 speakers would be 75*4=300 W combined?
Also, then this will connect to my speaker selector, right? and what sort of specs should that have, 240 W?

If you can give at least a theoretical sample of specs for each, that would work together, that would help a lot.

thanks so much!

We do this all the time in commercial spaces or homes where they are on a really tight budget.

But, to make sure I understand you correctly...

- 3 different zones playing the same source with the capability of adding a 4th.
- 3 pair of 8ohm speakers (1 pair for each zone).
- 1 source shared and playing at the same time between these three zones.

If the above basically describes the system you are trying to create here is the equipment to use:

-Speakers: Whichever you would like. 8ohm is fine. 70 volt will work as well if you want to do a system like that but with so few speakers I don't understand why you would bother, but that's just me. What I am going to tell you to do is going to give you more features, be simple to install, and still come in under your budget. We just did this at a golf course. I will post pics tomorrow evening/afternoon. It works great!

- A/V Receiver: Pioneer VSX-523-K 5.1 Home Theater Receiver | 250-635
- Impedance Matching Volume Controlls: (You will need 3 - one for each zone) Wired Home VRS100 Impedance Matching Rotary Volume Control | 300-552

Total investment NOT including speakers, wiring, or shipping: Roughly $370 but you can probably find that receiver for less online pretty easily.

That's it! How do you install it? I will draw and scan a diagram and load it up tomorrow morning for you. It's very easy. Sound quality will be perfectly fine and the receiver will be in great shape.

Edit: I just drew something up in paint real quick. it's this easy to install.

 

[hisfallacy]

I realized.. I was looking at some other threads on this forum, and yes, i need 70v speakers with transformers. (i will return the ones i got).
so the volume control will be based on the taps on the speakers themselves.. i can't control individual volumes centrally? (i',m ok with this, just confirming)
So all i need is a 70v system and a set of 70v speakers that include transformers, so the speakers' total W adds up to the amp Wattage?
Is there any other component I would need?

thanks

Sorry, but you haven't got a clue.

You use the 70 volt output. If you use the speakers you have you will need a transformer at each speaker. Either return those and get speaker with transformers. For a 70 volt system the impedances you will be needing are 500 to 5000 ohms. You will need to some soldering if you do this yourself.

This article explains how to do it.

 

[TLS Guy]

I realized.. I was looking at some other threads on this forum, and yes, i need 70v speakers with transformers. (i will return the ones i got).
so the volume control will be based on the taps on the speakers themselves.. i can't control individual volumes centrally? (i',m ok with this, just confirming)
So all i need is a 70v system and a set of 70v speakers that include transformers, so the speakers' total W adds up to the amp Wattage?
Is there any other component I would need?

thanks

Now you have got it. That is all you need. You can experiment after installation to get just the power you need in all locations. These systems provide trouble free operation for years and years.

 

[hisfallacy]

We do this all the time in commercial spaces or homes where they are on a really tight budget.

But, to make sure I understand you correctly...

- 3 different zones playing the same source with the capability of adding a 4th.
- 3 pair of 8ohm speakers (1 pair for each zone).
- 1 source shared and playing at the same time between these three zones.

If the above basically describes the system you are trying to create here is the equipment to use:

-Speakers: Whichever you would like. 8ohm is fine. 70 volt will work as well if you want to do a system like that but with so few speakers I don't understand why you would bother, but that's just me. What I am going to tell you to do is going to give you more features, be simple to install, and still come in under your budget. We just did this at a golf course. I will post pics tomorrow evening/afternoon. It works great!

- A/V Receiver: Pioneer VSX-523-K 5.1 Home Theater Receiver | 250-635
- Impedance Matching Volume Controlls: (You will need 3 - one for each zone) Wired Home VRS100 Impedance Matching Rotary Volume Control | 300-552

Total investment NOT including speakers, wiring, or shipping: Roughly $370 but you can probably find that receiver for less online pretty easily.

That's it! How do you install it? I will draw and scan a diagram and load it up tomorrow morning for you. It's very easy. Sound quality will be perfectly fine and the receiver will be in great shape.

Edit: I just drew something up in paint real quick. it's this easy to install.

View attachment 13220

Thank you, for drawing and giving a very clear explanation!

Just a few follow up questions if I can choose this option:
- so basically the impedance matching volume control takes care of the.. impedance? so that i can add multiple 8-ohm speakers but still use an 8-ohm amplifier?
- For the amplifier then basically any wattage that is higher than the total speaker wattage?
- can I use this then .. since its slightly cheaper and has similar specs: Amazon.com: Yamaha RX-V375 5.1 Channel 3D A/V Home Theater Receiver (Black): Electronics
- just for my own understanding, i don't really need a 5.1 or 5 channel system though, right? since my speakers are actually full range, and i'm not splitting the frequencies. is that correct?
does that make any difference in the diagram?

- and if this works, I can use the same speakers i already got..

thanks again.. we are opening in exactly a week, so i'm in panic mode...

 

[Plexmulti9]

Thank you, for drawing and giving a very clear explanation!

Just a few follow up questions if I can choose this option:
- so basically the impedance matching volume control takes care of the.. impedance? so that i can add multiple 8-ohm speakers but still use an 8-ohm amplifier?
- For the amplifier then basically any wattage that is higher than the total speaker wattage?
- can I use this then .. since its slightly cheaper and has similar specs: Amazon.com: Yamaha RX-V375 5.1 Channel 3D A/V Home Theater Receiver (Black): Electronics
- just for my own understanding, i don't really need a 5.1 or 5 channel system though, right? since my speakers are actually full range, and i'm not splitting the frequencies. is that correct?
does that make any difference in the diagram?

- and if this works, I can use the same speakers i already got..

thanks again.. we are opening in exactly a week, so i'm in panic mode...

That receiver should be fine. You will use the "Music" button on the remote to put it into 5 channel stereo. I will explain more about it later, but you basically have the concept down with my drawing. Get the receiver you found and the volume controls I linked and whatever speakers (yes, your 8ohm ones are fine) you need.