Rythmik or SVS?

[Dr. Bob]

I updated my front speakers and amp a while ago, and I'm getting ready to update my subwoofer.

My room is about 2500 ft^3 - an attic room with a low ceiling that angles down on both sides. My system is Paradigm Signature S1 front speakers (small bookshelf), Klipsch surrounds, Marantz amp with Audyssey XT. Use is music and home theater, but I am mainly interested in musicality. Budget is roughly < $1000.

What I'm looking for (in this order) is (1) good clean, musical bass, (2) full extension into the low end so I can hear everything that's there, and (3) more oomph than my old Boston Acoustics 10" sub provides. What I don't need is lots of volume: I listen at moderate levels, not rock concert levels. Musical tastes are wide, from jazz to rock to pop to classical, but no rap or headbanging is happening here. With #3 I'm talking about things like movie explosions that seem to be missing the gut-punch feel you get with a really good sound system. (Is this what people mean when they say a sub is "fast"?)

Because #1 and #2 are more important than #3, I'm planning to go with a sealed sub. My two top options are:
#1 - Rythmik F12G $874
#2 - SVS SB-2000 $700.

I'm pretty sure either of these great subs would suit me fine, but I have to ask: any opinions which would be better for me?

 

[KEW]

If you want accuracy, you want the Rythmik.
That said, be aware that you may not get the HT experience you are expecting out of it!
I recently helped a guy with his new sub. It was a Reaction Audio 18" beast. He was disappointed because his neighbor's (10"?) Onkyo sub seemed stronger. In truth, Audyssey had done a wonderful job of integrating the sub into his system, but he was looking for a strong emphasis at the lower 30Hz frequencies (which the Onkyo design overemphasizes to make up for lack of extension).
The Rythmik will give you accurate bass and more extension (F3 at 14Hz!) than the SVS; however, the SVS is tuned to add emphasis to the ~20Hz. That added emphasis is thrilling for HT, but will compromise your SQ for music.
I have Rythmiks and love them for music. I also have been playing with increasing the sub level at the AVR from 3 to 6 dB depending on the movie. If it is an action film (ie Avengers), I turn up the subs. If it is a film of dialog with music (ie Silver Linings Playbook), I leave the subs as they are.

 

[3db]

I have Rythmiks and love them for music. I also have been playing with increasing the sub level at the AVR from 3 to 6 dB depending on the movie. If it is an action film (ie Avengers), I turn up the subs. If it is a film of dialog with music (ie Silver Linings Playbook), I leave the subs as they are.

Movies liek the Avengers just begs one increase the sub level on the AVR to make one's teeth rattle I normally turn mine up on action flicks and leave the level alone on non action films.

 

[afterlife2]

I have the SVS PB1000(Great customer service too) and it rattles the room with movies. Most of the time I have to tone it down. It's enough for my needs. I think it does a good job with SACD/DTS music, but mostly used for HT. Never heard a Rythmik, but peeps here seem to like it.

 

[shadyJ]

I would also take a look at the Hsu ULS-15 mk2. It will have more clean headroom then the 12"s you listed, I am guessing fully twice as much. They can also give you flat response down to 20 Hz with the EQ1 setting instead of the usual 12 dB/octave roll off that most sealed subs have, although it can do that as well. As for sound quality, if the ULS-15 mk2 is anything like the mk1, you surely would not be disappointed.

 

[Dr. Bob]

KEW, I'm leaning toward the Rythmik, even though w/shipping it's a good $300 more. Your comments are very helpful for understanding the differences.

shadyJ, thanks for the rec. HSU seems to be a great choice for people who want powerful bass. I'm wondering, if I'm listening at lower volumes, do I need to worry about headroom? Please explain!

 

[herbu]

Dr. Bob,
I have both a Rythmik and an SVS... although mine are both the top-end beast of their lineups. But I can testify to the great customer support of SVS. After nearly a year, the amp went out. I called SVS. They sent me a new one immediately, (no charge), and made sure I was comfortable w/ the procedure to replace it.

They gave me the choice of putting the new one on my credit card, then refunding the cost when they received the old/bad one back, or waiting to ship the new one until they received the old one. I chose the former, and used the box and packing material of the new one to return the old.

The new one arrived in 2 days. Immediately replaced and returned the old one. Their credit hit my card 3 days later, (no delay). Could not have been happier w/ their service.

The Rythmik has not needed service, so I can't speak for them.

 

[PENG]

I have two SVS and one Rythmik. I am sure you will be happy with either. Buy the one with the specs you need and the look you like.

 

[afterlife2]

Dr. Bob,
I have both a Rythmik and an SVS... although mine are both the top-end beast of their lineups. But I can testify to the great customer support of SVS. After nearly a year, the amp went out. I called SVS. They sent me a new one immediately, (no charge), and made sure I was comfortable w/ the procedure to replace it.

They gave me the choice of putting the new one on my credit card, then refunding the cost when they received the old/bad one back, or waiting to ship the new one until they received the old one. I chose the former, and used the box and packing material of the new one to return the old.

The new one arrived in 2 days. Immediately replaced and returned the old one. Their credit hit my card 3 days later, (no delay). Could not have been happier w/ their service.

The Rythmik has not needed service, so I can't speak for them.

Happened to me this year withe the PB1000 and they did the same for me. Very fast service too.

 

[shadyJ]

shadyJ, thanks for the rec. HSU seems to be a great choice for people who want powerful bass. I'm wondering, if I'm listening at lower volumes, do I need to worry about headroom? Please explain!

You don't need to worry about headroom at lower volumes, but it has advantages even at those loudness levels. First, it should have commensurately lower distortion levels at all output levels, especially in deep bass frequencies. Below 30 Hz a sealed 12" can run out of excursion very quickly since it does not have a huge amount of displacement available. Also, the less you physically tax a sub, the longer it can last, so going for something with a healthy amount of headroom is better for long term reliability. The headroom is also nice for those moments when you do want to crank it.

 

[Dr. Bob]

Just saw a Paradigm Studio Servo-15 for $150 (!) on Craigslist. This was a $2200 sub about 10 years ago. What do you think - would it do better than my other options, for a fraction of the price? Or, are the new subs a big improvement even on the better, older subs?

 

[shadyJ]

That is a very good price on it, that ws a very good sub back in the day. I would jump on it. I think it would outperform the Rythmik and SVS subs. Probably not the Hsu sub though. For $150, you can't go wrong.

 

[felipe]

Not familiar with Rythmik or the Paradigm, but if your budget is ~1000, why not go dual? The SVS SB1000 is compact,very musical, and packs quite a punch! ( I have one ). Running dual subs will help with room nodes in such...just a thought . Wish I could run dual SB1000's...

 

[KEW]

I would also take a look at the Hsu ULS-15 mk2.
They can also give you flat response down to 20 Hz with the EQ1 setting instead of the usual 12 dB/octave roll off that most sealed subs have.

I don't believe you can realistically level this criticism against the specific sealed subs that Dr. Bob listed (Rythmik F3 = 14Hz, SVS F3=19Hz).
Nonetheless, the new ULS-15 mk2 certainly looks like a nice option. Hopefully we will get independent measurements on it soon.

 

[KEW]

For $150, if it works, I would jump on it!
Get him to demo it for you to make sure it does not fall apart with deep bass in movies.

 

[shadyJ]

I don't believe you can realistically level this criticism against the specific sealed subs that Dr. Bob listed (Rythmik F3 = 14Hz, SVS F3=19Hz).
Nonetheless, the new ULS-15 mk2 certainly looks like a nice option. Hopefully we will get independent measurements on it soon.

A 12" woofer with moderate excursion ability with an f3 of 14 Hz will run out of throw very fast. Supposedly the servo mechanism compensates for the typical 12 dB/octave roll off of sealed subs, but I would not run the F12 in the mode with that kind of extension, it doesn't have the displacement for it. That would be asking a lot of even an 18" woofer. I don't think anyone should be buying a sealed sub with the expectation of getting a flat response to 20 Hz, and that includes the ULS-15 mk2- unless the sub were some kind of super sub like the Deep Sea Sound Mariana 24.

 

[jinjuku]

Going to posit a 3rd option:
http://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-rs1202k-1000-watt-dual-12-subwoofer-kit--300-766

 

[Steve81]

I'd also expect the Hsu to be a very capable option at that price. It's similar to the F12 in that it has some tuning options to match to your room, but the 15" driver should give it a performance edge in the deep bass. Even at moderate levels, it takes a fair amount of displacement to dig down to 20Hz and below.

Going to posit a 3rd option:
http://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-rs1202k-1000-watt-dual-12-subwoofer-kit--300-766

Some caveats worth mentioning there, namely the amp. It's got a non-defeatable high pass filter, which partly defeats the purpose of a high powered sealed system. It's also been mentioned in the past that it has some issues with hum/noise.

 

[jinjuku]

I've never heard one of them hum to be honest. I know they don't dig as deep but it's very clean and a killer amount of punch.

Just trade offs.

 

[riker1384]

Sorry, too slow. I got the Paradigm. (I found it myself earlier, wasn't tipped off by this thread.) Heavy sumbitch. Some cosmetic wear though, veneer starting to peel on one part.