Recommend a sub for my maggies

[bhodge]

Hi, I recently bought a house and now would like to purchase a sub for my HT. I have the 1.6 maggies and I hear how they are so fast that you need to get a good sub to match. I went to the audio store where I purchased my maggies 3 years ago and they recommended ML (the abyss, grotto, depth) mentioning that they are "fast" enough to keep up with the maggies. I am trying to do research on them and there are two extreme views, you either love them or hate them and no in between. However, most of these reviews or comments (and any that mention maggies) are at least 3 years old. My room is about 22 x 15 (and open in the back). I am willing to spend ~2K (the depth was 2,200) but want to make sure I get the right sub for my maggies and room. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

 

[bandphan]

Hi, I recently bought a house and now would like to purchase a sub for my HT. I have the 1.6 maggies and I hear how they are so fast that you need to get a good sub to match. I went to the audio store where I purchased my maggies 3 years ago and they recommended ML (the abyss, grotto, depth) mentioning that they are "fast" enough to keep up with the maggies. I am trying to do research on them and there are two extreme views, you either love them or hate them and no in between. However, most of these reviews or comments (and any that mention maggies) are at least 3 years old. My room is about 22 x 15 (and open in the back). I am willing to spend ~2K (the depth was 2,200) but want to make sure I get the right sub for my maggies and room. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35455

Read the link on "fast subwoofers"

If your willing to spend 2k the SVS PB13 Ultra is one the best subs you can get under 1700, and will out perform all that you have mentioned. http://www.svsound.com/products-sub-box-pb13ultra.cfm

 

[bhodge]

Thanks. Just curious, would running two PB12s be better than running one PB13? The 2 subs would cost more than one of the 13s but not by much considering what you already have in the costs.

 

[lsiberian]

Thanks. Just curious, would running two PB12s be better than running one PB13? The 2 subs would cost more than one of the 13s but not by much considering what you already have in the costs.

I think the dual PB12 option is a great idea. However if you have the space and this is a dedicated listening room or theater then you could also buy 3 pb10s and get one pb13 later. This would give you the option to do an MBM style arrangment. The 10s would best be used as stand for your speakers or placed directly next to them.

You could place on in the rear for the surrounds. You would run your speakers to 150hz and the PB10s from 150 to 50hz. Then you would run a 12 from 50hz to lower.

If you are willing to build your own subs then you would have limitless options and significantly higher output at much lower costs. You might even hire the cabinet out and then assemble the sub yourself. Their are many very good DIY subs that will outperform a PB13 and be significantly cheaper.

The choice is yours. Most people would be very satisfied with one PB13. If your crossing it lower than 80hz you probably would be fine with just the one sub.

 

[jamie2112]

Thanks. Just curious, would running two PB12s be better than running one PB13? The 2 subs would cost more than one of the 13s but not by much considering what you already have in the costs.

More subs are always better IMO...........

 

[John Bailey]

I've auditioned a number of subwoofers with Maggies - MC1's, 12's and 1.6's. The best I've heard are REL's. I've auditioned for music only, so I'm not sure they would be the best for home theatre.

John

 

[bandphan]

The use of multiple subs to help with room issues is a great thing. What you want to understand is where the room has issues. What avr are you using? One Ultra is still very strong and you could always add a second. I recommend that if you go the dual sub route that you get some kind of eq that can help. Like the velodyne SMS or a behringer dcx2496. I like the behringer but it is not plug and play so setup takes time.

 

[bhodge]

I think the dual PB12 option is a great idea. However if you have the space and this is a dedicated listening room or theater then you could also buy 3 pb10s and get one pb13 later. This would give you the option to do an MBM style arrangment. The 10s would best be used as stand for your speakers or placed directly next to them.

Tempting but it is technically my living room so trying to keep it simple but effective. I think 4 subs would be a bit much for me to run considering the additional cost in equipment to do so.

If you are willing to build your own subs then you would have limitless options and significantly higher output at much lower costs. You might even hire the cabinet out and then assemble the sub yourself. Their are many very good DIY subs that will outperform a PB13 and be significantly cheaper.

Never thought much about DIY just assumed the quality would not be as good, but not opposed at all to the idea. But with my limited knowledge of subs/technology is this feasible? What sites/information would you recommend on getting my feet wet on this area?

The choice is yours. Most people would be very satisfied with one PB13. If your crossing it lower than 80hz you probably would be fine with just the one sub.

Trying to educate myself to get the best system setup with what I have. I am definitely willing to invest the time to get it right, no matter the path. Cost isn't a huge concern but I want to be realistic for the room that I have and what I have already invested in with the maggies.

Thanks!

 

[bhodge]

The use of multiple subs to help with room issues is a great thing. What you want to understand is where the room has issues.

Well, I think thats my first problem. Don't know what issues with the room I will have until I get a sub. Any thoughts on analyzing the potential issues? My original thought is to get the best quality sub and move it around and play with it to match my room, but if I need to first analyze the room and then select the most appropriate sub, I can do that was well.

What avr are you using?

I have an ONKYO TX-SR703, about 5 years old, but will to upgrade it if needed to get desired results. However, was hoping to get a sub and down the road upgrade the avr.

I have a 3 step plan for finishing my room. Along with the avr, and 1.6 maggies, my center channel is the maggie CC3. First step was to get a sub, next step was to get rear surround to finish up the 5.1 and last was to upgrade my avr.

 

[bhodge]

I've auditioned a number of subwoofers with Maggies - MC1's, 12's and 1.6's. The best I've heard are REL's. I've auditioned for music only, so I'm not sure they would be the best for home theatre.

John

Unfortunately (and this might be blasphemy), I am not a huge music person and primarily use my setup for home theater.

 

[jamie2112]

Unfortunately (and this might be blasphemy), I am not a huge music person and primarily use my setup for home theater.

: Just Kidding thats fine, all advice still applies.

 

[STRONGBADF1]

Hi, I recently bought a house and now would like to purchase a sub for my HT. I have the 1.6 maggies and I hear how they are so fast that you need to get a good sub to match. I went to the audio store where I purchased my maggies 3 years ago and they recommended ML (the abyss, grotto, depth) mentioning that they are "fast" enough to keep up with the maggies. I am trying to do research on them and there are two extreme views, you either love them or hate them and no in between. However, most of these reviews or comments (and any that mention maggies) are at least 3 years old. My room is about 22 x 15 (and open in the back). I am willing to spend ~2K (the depth was 2,200) but want to make sure I get the right sub for my maggies and room. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Hi bhodge,

Welcome to the forum.

How big of a box can you live with in your room would be my first question. The second is how loud do you like to listen to your system? The subs being suggested are very nice subs but you need to realize how large they are. Some living rooms just don't have that kind of room.

SBF1

 

[bandphan]

Well, I think thats my first problem. Don't know what issues with the room I will have until I get a sub. Any thoughts on analyzing the potential issues? My original thought is to get the best quality sub and move it around and play with it to match my room, but if I need to first analyze the room and then select the most appropriate sub, I can do that was well.


I have an ONKYO TX-SR703, about 5 years old, but will to upgrade it if needed to get desired results. However, was hoping to get a sub and down the road upgrade the avr.

I have a 3 step plan for finishing my room. Along with the avr, and 1.6 maggies, my center channel is the maggie CC3. First step was to get a sub, next step was to get rear surround to finish up the 5.1 and last was to upgrade my avr.

IMO just get the single ultra and go from there. You will not be disappointed. If you add a unit like the velodyne SMS with the 5 point kit you will have it easy. If your diligent you might be able to get a second ultra B stock for a steal. Size wise unless you get into the 2600 range there are not many "small footprint "subs that have huge output that are not cheap

 

[jostenmeat]

Unfortunately (and this might be blasphemy), I am not a huge music person and primarily use my setup for home theater.

It's not blasphemy, but I do think this is the first time I've seen maggies chosen for specifically HT. (harder to drive, lower sensitivity, perhaps more prone to compression at higher SPL).

Regarding sub placement, do not forget about the other critical thing, perhaps even more important to some experts: listener position.

As for subwoofer outboard EQ, I would much rather have the SVS ASEQ1 than an SMS1. And even more so if you're thinking dual subs.

The pb13 should scare you &^@!less. You might consider doing a mockup, maybe with cardboard, to understand how large some of these subs are.

The one thing about the pb13 over dual pb12s is the extension. Once you give it up, you never get it back. Either route has high value attached to it, but not as much as DIY obviously . . . there's a DIY subforum here. . .

 

[bhodge]

Hi bhodge,

Welcome to the forum.

How big of a box can you live with in your room would be my first question. The second is how loud do you like to listen to your system? The subs being suggested are very nice subs but you need to realize how large they are. Some living rooms just don't have that kind of room.

SBF1

I was reading those dimensions on the site and couldn't believe how big they are. I have double (and triple checked) and the sub will fit nicely behind my left maggie (see below). And typically, I do tend to have my system turned up for movies. I was looking at the PB12-Plus (maybe 2 of them instead of one PB13-Ultra) but they are about the same size as well. But I think I am leaning towards the one Ultra like bandphan has suggested. In the end its cheaper (than 2 Plus) and I can always add down the road.

From what I have found, I can't find anyone with a bad thing to say about the SVS subs and if they produce better than the ML Depth I will be very happy.

Of course any additional input people have will be greatly appreciated (on setups of 1 bigger sub vs 2 smaller, brand, model, cylindrical versus box, etc). Trying to buy a sub this week.

 

[bhodge]

Does anyone have a preference on the PC13-Ultra and PB13-Ultra. Honestly I have never seen/heard of a cylinder sub but according to SVS FAQ they produce the same sound/quality/specs.

Is it truly a personal preference?

 

[Adam]

From some of the material that I've read here, the PB13-Ultra has a slightly flatter response than the PC13-Ultra.

I have a PC13-Ultra. I love it. I had a box sub before this one, and I like the aesthetic change. The surface finish isn't that of wood venear, but it goes well with my piano black NHT speakers.

I went back and forth between a box and a cylinder for a couple of years, but when the new Ultra woofers were announced, I settled on the cylinder. I'm glad that I did.

To answer your question, it really is about personal preference, IMO.

 

[John Bailey]

Unfortunately (and this might be blasphemy), I am not a huge music person and primarily use my setup for home theater.

Not blasphemy at all. I just wanted to point that out because I don't believe the REL's would be a good choice if movies were the mainstays.

John

 

[WmAx]

If one wants guaranteed seamless integration of the subwoofer and main speakers, then it would be best to use an external active crossover. This device shall allow the user to combine both the sub and mains with optimal filters, thus restricting the precise frequencies from the mains that the subwoofer will now be reproducing. It is unwise to use mains full range, when using a capable subwoofer, as without the correct crossover, this puts the mains under more stress (higher distortion, restricted dynamics) and does not allow for optimal physical integration of the two sound sources.

I would suggest two slightly smaller subs, one placed in each side of the room, as opposed to a single larger subwoofer. This will allow better bass fill in the room and guarantee perfect integration at the optimal xover frequencies to allow the mains to perform to their potential, which is around 70-80Hz most likely.

-Chris

 

[lsiberian]

Never thought much about DIY just assumed the quality would not be as good, but not opposed at all to the idea. But with my limited knowledge of subs/technology is this feasible? What sites/information would you recommend on getting my feet wet on this area?

Since I don't want you to be overwhelmed. I will suggest you do the Perfect Mid VQ build on our DIY section. If you aren't a woodworker and really want a nice cabinet. I suggest you give those plans to 2 or 3 cabinet makers and ask for quotes.

If your further interested refer to that thread.

Trying to educate myself to get the best system setup with what I have. I am definitely willing to invest the time to get it right, no matter the path. Cost isn't a huge concern but I want to be realistic for the room that I have and what I have already invested in with the maggies.

Thanks!

Well subs should be at least 40% of a home theater budget typically because that is where they are most vital. But most people make them an after thought. Hey if you not interested in the DIY option then just get the 13. While the 12 can help in room response. The 13 has the extension to give you that theater like experience. Make sure you put it in the corner and cross it at 80hz or lower.