Receiver hunting...

[MichaelDiggs]

I'm looking for a new receiver. A question you may have seen 1000 times. I've been out of the AV game for a while, since I just bought the same brand (Denon) and upgraded when needed. Now their quality has dropped and my 1.5 year old AVR-X4000 model is having problems. Going in for repair, if I find the receipt but want to replace it. I'm aware there are smaller boutique companies like Rotel, Anthem, etc but I just can't afford them or can't afford to buy separate units either. This is why I'm looking for a high-end "consumer" model.

My current setup. Basic. 5.1 currently and might upgrade that to 7.1 soon. All my speakers are of the same line, so the timbre would be the same. I bought the best speakers I could with what money I had. They are the PSB 5T line. Front floor speakers, with large center and rear speakers. And a Klipsch 12" sub that I will upgrade to an SVS soon. 55" LCD TV. This in my living room. I watch content mostly from my media server amd some TV. %90+ is just Dolby Digital , DTS.

I want something to be able to power my speakers with clean good power. The speakers should be able to handle 100 continuous watts according to the specifications. I know these consumer receivers are horribly rated, but what can I do? I'm willing to spend $1000 on a receiver. I'm in no huge rush, but almost seems silly to spend $1000 on a receiver when I only use %10 of the built in features really, BUT I want new features like Dolby Atmos and new HDMI specs in case needed. I have been looking at Pioneer Elite models. Like the SC-95.

Can anyone recommend a good receiver for my setup? I did post on AVSForums, but I got so many random, confusing responses it was hard to tell what's good these days and not. I would imagine all consumer grade stuff is just hit or miss these days. That's why it has been hard to find a receiver I like. Anyway, if you could recommend something that would be great. I'm not completely against separates but when I add everything up it comes to usually over $3.5k. A little more then I can spend. I'm kind of at a tough spot, because I know there is quality stuff out there but just can't afford it. My old Denon's were built much more better then the new stuff. I wish I can get my old model back, but I do enjoy the reverse optical sound through the HDMI cable some times when viewing some off beat Netflix shows.

Thanks for reading. I live on the east coast of the US.

 

[TheWarrior]

I can't find the Audioholics article, but there was a recent one about Trading Amplifier Quality for Features. Thats the biggest obstacle in recevier shopping these days: Every marketing department is trying to tell you to buy Atmos. I personally do not recommend buying an Atmos enabled receiver, don't encourage the monster! Consumers vote with their dollars, and 11 speakers is not going to resolve either a poorly set up room, or poor sounding speakers.

Try searching Amazon for pre-Atmos (Atmos will be clearly identified in the description if it has it) Denon or Marantz or Yamaha receivers. Just my personal favorites, take any brand you like! But because they're discontinued, you can get them for cheap! So its win win for you! You get the 'older' receiver, but it likely has a better amp than current models anyway! Hope this helps!

 

[herbu]

It seems you were particularly unlucky w/ the Denon. Most people have very good experience w/ them, me included. (I also have an X4000). But if you're determined to stay away, I would suggest Yamaha. Not sure I have ever seen any complaints about their quality. The only division between Yamaha and Denon/Marantz seems to be their room equalization methods... Audyssey for Denon/Marantz vs Yamaha's proprietary YPAO. Some people prefer one over the other.

 

[Montucky]

I'm not completely against separates but when I add everything up it comes to usually over $3.5k. A little more then I can spend. I'm kind of at a tough spot, because I know there is quality stuff out there but just can't afford it.

There's actually a great middle ground for you, then. Just look for a mid range receiver that has pre-outs for at least a couple of your primary channels. Easily achievable within your $1000 budget. Then you can add some extra amplification down the road should you ever decide to go that route. Kind of the best of both worlds in my opinion without stepping up to separates just yet.

 

[lsiberian]

I always look for one around 500 dollars with pre-outs. That's worked out well for me. Pioneer, Yamaha, Onkyo, Denon or Marantz all seem to have the level of quality to me.

 

[tmurnin]

The Denon 4100 is available many places now for about $800. Great unit at a very good price, but if you think you've been burnt by Denon, the Anthem Mrx 510 is a nice unit for a little more money.

 

[little wing]

This is the article the warrior was talking about http://www.audioholics.com/audio-amplifier/trading. As someone else mentioned, Yamaha receivers seem to have very few issues. I can speak to this because I have a Yamaha AVR that's about 8 years old, it's rock solid and performs well with no issues. Most receivers these days are basically computers with an amp thrown, IMO. But they do work well enough for most people. Of course this is dependent on the speaker in question, room size, and listening habits. I would be careful of purchasing a $500 receiver to use as a pre-amp. There have been many articles written about the quality of pre-amp outputs of receivers, so you can perhaps research that and judge for yourself. I'm sure there are many folks here at happy with using pre-amp outs of receivers. I tried it, and it didn't seem to make a lot of difference to me.

 

[MichaelDiggs]

I have decided to hold off on buying anything right now. I "thought" my Denon was faulty, but when I run the Audyssey it doesn't tell me the sub is bad. But when I throw a test tone out on the sub I remember I use to hear a rumble type noise but there is no sound at all. I also want to "test" my current PSB speakers to make sure they are still operating %100. I have to figure out how to do that. I did more and more reading and from what I gather speakers don't normally go bad. Mine are over 15 years old, so maybe they lost sound quality? Still trying to figure all this out.

 

[markw]

A speaker won't lose sound quality over time unless something blows and you would probably notice that immediately. Put you ear to the mids and tweets to make sure they still make some sound.

As for the woofer not making any sound, did you try it alone, with another unit like a CD/DVD player. If it's good, it should make some low frequency noise from these sources.

 

[MichaelDiggs]

My receiver has to be bad. There's no way I could have my subwoofer on level on 10 and not hear anything from it when watching a movie. I remember I use to "feel" the waves of pressure throughout my body with my old receiver. It is an old sub woofer but if I'm going to replace my receiver I'll probably invest in an SVS sub and just keep my PSB speakers. It has been impossible to find the new Pioneer Elite models around anywhere.

 

[markw]

My receiver has to be bad. There's no way I could have my subwoofer on level on 10 and not hear anything from it when watching a movie

Unless, of course, the subwoofer is broken.

 

[DJWPAR3]

I just upgraded my Yamaha 863 to a 2050 because I wanted to future proof my system(4K, Atmos, Musiccast etc.) I never had a problem with the 863, a SOLID performer, as I understand Yamaha usually is.
I know you set a budget limit for your receiver, but be aware there are BIG changes coming in AV enjoyment over the next few years. I know many talk down Atmos and 4K.....but from what I have seen, they add to the entire experience. My advice is, search for a unit with as many of the latest upgrades as possible.(2.2 and HDR can be added to the above).
You won't regret it.

 

[KEW]

My receiver has to be bad. There's no way I could have my subwoofer on level on 10 and not hear anything from it when watching a movie. I remember I use to "feel" the waves of pressure throughout my body with my old receiver. It is an old sub woofer but if I'm going to replace my receiver I'll probably invest in an SVS sub and just keep my PSB speakers. It has been impossible to find the new Pioneer Elite models around anywhere.

Did you do the test recommended by Markw in post #9?

 

[KEW]

I just upgraded my Yamaha 863 to a 2050 because I wanted to future proof my system(4K, Atmos, Musiccast etc.) I never had a problem with the 863, a SOLID performer, as I understand Yamaha usually is.
I know you set a budget limit for your receiver, but be aware there are BIG changes coming in AV enjoyment over the next few years. I know many talk down Atmos and 4K.....but from what I have seen, they add to the entire experience. My advice is, search for a unit with as many of the latest upgrades as possible.(2.2 and HDR can be added to the above).
You won't regret it.

The big difference is you upgraded from a 7.5 year old receiver, and the OP here has a 1.5 year old receiver.
I understand your perspective, but your receiver was 5 times older than his.
We are trying to make sure he does not waste money on a new receiver only to find his subwoofer still malfunctions.
The cost of a replacement for his Denon AVR-X4000 (which is 4k capable, as well as having many other nice features, like properly handling EQ for 2 subs) may be better spent on a new subwoofer if that is the problem. Either MichaelDiggs is being reckless with his money to buy a new receiver or he is not keeping us informed on the results of the tests we have recommended to isolate whether the receiver or sub is at fault.
If his receiver is not at fault, I would recommend he keep it until he absolutely needs a replacement due to either malfunction or a missing feature he wants immediately.
Buying new technology before it has become a true standard is always an exercise in speculation. Ask anyone who bought a laser-disc system or betamax system.
I understand your excitement with your new receiver, and that is great. However, it is not a one size fits all solution.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Bad luck on your X4000. Did you buy it brand new?

Denon X3100 for $500 (has pre-outs) is probably best bang. It sounds great and is cheap enough (on sale for 50% off) that you might not feel like taking too much of a chance.

Denon X4100 for $800 if you are willing to spend more.

I tend to agree w/ Isiberian on the $500 AVR mark.