S

SavidSelim

Audioholic Intern
Hello. I am building a 2.1 audio system and would like to use seperates consisting of a Preamp, Phono Stage, and DAC (these could be in the same box or seperate) and a power amp. I have a power amp and am using a reciever for a preamp currently. I went to a not so local hi-fi shop today and here is what i heard....

The cambridge DACMagic is the only "budget" DAC worth considering
A preamp costing less than $1000 is not worth considering
A "budget" (<$100) phono preamp would sound pretty good for the money.
Stay away from all chinese products that are not extremely high priced
Toslink and Coaxial are better connections than USB for connecting PC to DAC

The owner of this shop says to stay away from grant fidelity with a 10 foot pole.

Most people on this board have read the reviews on the GF DAC-09 and they seem pretty favorable.

He says this box is rubbish. Where is the truth?

The DAC-09 seems perfect for me. It has the correct interconnects and it will switch my sources. It will take the place of a Preamp and control the volume. I hear its got a pretty good DAC, and its CHEAP..

Of course i will still need a phono stage.

Is the GF worth buying? Or will i regret wasting 20% of the money I will have to spend on a preamp in the long run?

BTW, I have B&W bookshelves and a powered sub. Alesis power amp. PC, phono and cable box are only sources..... and maybe a guest's music player.

THANKS!!
 
DD66000

DD66000

Senior Audioholic
A preamp costing less than $1000 is not worth considering
Then get a good pre-amp with a good phono stage. One of the best in any price range would be a Parasound P7, which is a pure analogue pre-amp with bass management. ($1499 thru Audio Advisor)
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Warlord
I'm far from an expert in this field, but if you are considering buying something in that price range, check out Audio By Van Alstine. AVA is an internet direct builder of their own preamps and amps. They seem to have a very good reputation, but a small following. I know several of the AVA amps, and have on one or two occasions heard one of the preamps in operation. They are excellent in my opinion.

AVA Pre amps

You might be interested in the Vision DAC Preamp. It costs $1599 and is available with an optional phono preamp built-in for $199 extra.

From now till the end of the year, all new purchases are on sale for 15% off. That would pay for the optional phono preamp. Phone them to get details and verify the price.
 
woofersus

woofersus

Audioholic
I don't totally disagree with any of those assertions, but I wouldn't consider them hard and fast rules either. For example, I think Grant Fideltiy makes some nice gear for its price range. The DAC-09 probably isn't going to compete with a $1200 competitor, but that doesn't make it junk. However, if you're spending $5-6k on a 2-channel system you might consider aiming a little higher for the DAC. Honestly I know of several $400-$600 DAC's that are probably a worthwhile step up from the DACmagic, or at least they would be to me.

Likewise, I don't think every sub-$1k preamp is trash, but I do think your money would be better spent with a nice integrated if you can only spring for a $500 preamp. (note: I understant HT is a different animal here, with several nice <$1k pre/pro options out there)

TOSLINK and Coaxial are only better generally because many DAC's can only operate in 16/44 with USB even if they can do 24/192 via other connection methods. There are some exceptions popping up now though.

There really is some cheap crappy Chinese built gear out there, but there's also a growing reasonable quality mid-level segment. Of course the term "extremely expensive" is extremely relative, so maybe he meant a $3k amp is extremely expensive or maybe he meant $1500. Either way, I may be biased since I sell some Chinese built gear, but just like anything else it depends on how much quality was a priority. There's both good and bad out there.

The most important question is how much do you plan on spending and have you found speakers you love yet? Once that's decided you can start filling in the rest, like tubes vs. solid state, integrated vs. separates, etc.
 
woofersus

woofersus

Audioholic
Doh! I just noticed the last line of your first post said you had B&W bookshelves and a powered sub. Window for editing the end of mine is already closed. :eek:
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
Hello. I am building a 2.1 audio system and would like to use seperates consisting of a Preamp, Phono Stage, and DAC (these could be in the same box or seperate) and a power amp. I have a power amp and am using a reciever for a preamp currently. I went to a not so local hi-fi shop today and here is what i heard....

The cambridge DACMagic is the only "budget" DAC worth considering
A preamp costing less than $1000 is not worth considering
A "budget" (<$100) phono preamp would sound pretty good for the money.
Stay away from all chinese products that are not extremely high priced
Toslink and Coaxial are better connections than USB for connecting PC to DAC

The owner of this shop says to stay away from grant fidelity with a 10 foot pole.

Most people on this board have read the reviews on the GF DAC-09 and they seem pretty favorable.

He says this box is rubbish. Where is the truth?

The DAC-09 seems perfect for me. It has the correct interconnects and it will switch my sources. It will take the place of a Preamp and control the volume. I hear its got a pretty good DAC, and its CHEAP..

Of course i will still need a phono stage.

Is the GF worth buying? Or will i regret wasting 20% of the money I will have to spend on a preamp in the long run?

BTW, I have B&W bookshelves and a powered sub. Alesis power amp. PC, phono and cable box are only sources..... and maybe a guest's music player.

THANKS!!

It sounds like the store wants to get a lot of your money.

I recommend that, if actual sound quality is what matters, you should focus your attention on speakers, getting the best ones you can afford (and placing them properly in your room, as well as eliminating any serious acoustic problems in your room). Since you are also interested in phono, you will need a good turntable, which is also going to cost you. I think if it is actual sound quality that matters to you, instead of impressing others, you will spend relatively little on the preamp and power amp (unless, of course, you end up with speakers that are difficult to drive, and then more will have to go into the power amp).

The reason for my comments is very simple. It is easy to get good sound from electronics, with a wide, flat frequency response, low distortion, etc. But with speakers (and analog sources, like turntables), even the best that money can buy will leave something to be desired in terms of these things.

And it is easy for people to tell the difference between many different speakers and analog sources in properly conducted double blind tests, though it is not easy to tell the difference in such tests with electronics (generally, if the gear is decent, it will be impossible). But many audiophiles have no interest in reality, and so they spend their budget on things that do not make any audible difference at all, and pretend that there is a flaw in scientific testing instead of their choices. Even if they were right (which they are not), they should still realize that a difference so great it shows up in such testing must be greater than any difference that does not show up in such testing, so if they had any pretense of being reasonable, they would still give you the same advice I am giving, as the speakers can make a dramatic difference. And so can different analog sources.
 
B

Boerd

Full Audioholic
Hello. I am building a 2.1 audio system and would like to use seperates consisting of a Preamp, Phono Stage, and DAC (these could be in the same box or seperate) and a power amp. I have a power amp and am using a reciever for a preamp currently. I went to a not so local hi-fi shop today and here is what i heard....

The cambridge DACMagic is the only "budget" DAC worth considering
A preamp costing less than $1000 is not worth considering
A "budget" (<$100) phono preamp would sound pretty good for the money.
Stay away from all chinese products that are not extremely high priced
Toslink and Coaxial are better connections than USB for connecting PC to DAC

The owner of this shop says to stay away from grant fidelity with a 10 foot pole.

Most people on this board have read the reviews on the GF DAC-09 and they seem pretty favorable.

He says this box is rubbish. Where is the truth?

The DAC-09 seems perfect for me. It has the correct interconnects and it will switch my sources. It will take the place of a Preamp and control the volume. I hear its got a pretty good DAC, and its CHEAP..

Of course i will still need a phono stage.

Is the GF worth buying? Or will i regret wasting 20% of the money I will have to spend on a preamp in the long run?

BTW, I have B&W bookshelves and a powered sub. Alesis power amp. PC, phono and cable box are only sources..... and maybe a guest's music player.

THANKS!!
I have a Parasound P3 with phono stage and balanced IO - nothing to sneeze at - for 800$...
Don't believe all what the local guy tells you :)
 
Last edited:
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