Overbright sound

[mouettus]

All right... I know that my room acoustics suck... I know that my Polk speakers are very bright and I also know that my Yammie HTR-entry model doesn't help. But damn when I put my speakers at decent-to-high level, the sound is too crispy. It's overbright. Very hard on my poor ears lol. Especially when I listen at my alternative metal (nickelback, theory of a deadman; this kind of stuff) and when glass shatters in movies.

What would be my best bet?
a) Change the receiver (NAD or HK?)
b) Change my room acoustics (view this thread to see what I mean)
c) Cry and watch my movies and music at low volumes

*Don't wanna have the hassle of selling my Polks, spending more on another 5.1 set of speakers and actually audition them.

These are basically my only options. Take note that WAF is very present here (hanging panels on my wall could mean me sleeping on the couch until they're gone lol) 'cause the room is a living room.

 

[agarwalro]

Use a BFD to cut the upper freq. response.

 

[markw]

Well, given ONLY those optioins.

a) Change the receiver (NAD or HK?)

You can try, but most likely it won't make a bit of difference.

b) Change my room acoustics

That's a good start but it's only good to a certian point.

c) Cry and watch my movies and music at low volumes

Well, since you won't accept the most logical option* if all else fails, option c might be all you have left

Coulda been a good contenda for option d.

*Don't wanna have the hassle of selling my Polks, spending more on another 5.1 set of speakers and actually audition them.

 

[j_garcia]

How about just dialing back the treble on the receiver?

 

[mtrycrafts]

.....

I would follow jgarcia's recommendation first before anything else. It is free and should be easy to do
Then, if you still have issues, come back and tell us what you still don't like.

 

[mouettus]

Use a BFD to cut the upper freq. response.

I don't know what a BFD is... but I do know that if I cut frequencies, I won't enjoy the full spectrum



You really think changing the speakers is the best solution?! I just finished paying those... can't return them... I'll lose money for sure on that one!

How about just dialing back the treble on the receiver?

I've already tried that several times. But it won't just make the brighter sound be less bright... the entire spectrum sounds really bad



Do you think I could add-up
d) using an eq??

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

Turn down the treble...LOL . Yes, that would help, but also cut a ton of other frequencies.

If you are listening to music in 2 channel, go pick up a cheap stereo 10 band eq at your local big box store and see if cutting the 16kHz helps out. Run the eq between your source (cd player, computer rca's, etc...) and receiver. If you like the results, return the eq and order a BFD. You can get one off ebay very cheap.

This is what I'm talking about:
http://cgi.ebay.com/BSR-EQ-3000-SPECTRUM-ANALYZER-EQUALIZER-10-BAND-MINT_W0QQitemZ9724714751QQcategoryZ3271QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/EQ-EQUALIZER-10-BAND-OPTIMUS-WITH-DISPLAY-NR_W0QQitemZ9724161240QQcategoryZ3271QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem




A Behringer Feedback Destroyer is a more complex eq, but will accomplish the same thing. You are able to dial in and change the frequencies to cut or boost though with a parametric BFD - and they run just as much.

http://www.zzounds.com/item--BEHDSP1124P

Your Polk RTi8's are great speakers. It sounds like you just need a little more control over the frequency bands. You may also try putting up a tapestry on the opposite wall, or some type of room treatments to absorb the highs. You can also canter your speakers a bit so they aren't hitting your ears directly.

Can you post a photo of your room and setup?

 

[mouettus]

Thanks a lot Buckeyefan_1 for your help. I also think an EQ would be my best bet here... cuz adjusting treble just won`t make a nice difference. I have a full eq on my Winamp and iTunes on my computer. Seemed to bring my little logitech 5.1 speaker system alive

For the pictures, just go to my first post here and click on the link. It will lead you to another similar thread that I previously posted. There are pics of my basement room and setup.

Thanks again, I'll be looking for some new stuff (don't like vintage look) in the next days. Do you think I could get a 5-channel EQ though?

Waiting for your posts

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

I wouldn't waste the money on a 5 band eq. 10 band is barely enough IMO, since each eq band actually works like a wave, and pulls and decreases other bands with it. IE, the spread from 8kHz to 16kHz are not absolute. Dropping the 16kHz is also pulling down 19,18,17;15,14,13kHz...

Audio engineers and live bands use multiple 31+ band eq's for more precise control. For $99, I'd recommend just ordering the Behringer. By the time you pick up a cheap eq from ebay with shipping, you'll wish you just went with the real deal.

Is this more of what you're talking about opposed to "vintage look?"
http://cgi.ebay.com/EQ-EQUALIZER-10-BAND-OPTIMUS-WITH-DISPLAY-NR_W0QQitemZ9724161240QQcategoryZ3271QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Here's something a bit more updated.
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-DUAL-10-BAND-GRAPHIC-DJ-PRO-AUDIO-EQUALIZER-EQ-SALE_W0QQitemZ7413650479QQcategoryZ23788QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

He's one with some fancy lighting effects.
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-2006-DUAL-10-BAND-GRAPHIC-PRO-AUDIO-EQUALIZER-DJ-EQ_W0QQitemZ7413104916QQcategoryZ23788QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

[WmAx]

I wouldn't waste the money on a 5 band eq. 10 band is barely enough IMO, since each eq band actually works like a wave, and pulls and decreases other bands with it. IE, the spread from 8kHz to 16kHz are not absolute. Dropping the 16kHz is also pulling down 19,18,17;15,14,13kHz...

Audio engineers and live bands use multiple 31+ band eq's for more precise control. For $99, I'd recommend just ordering the Behringer. By the time you pick up a cheap eq from ebay with shipping, you'll wish you just went with the real deal.

Is this more of what you're talking about opposed to "vintage look?"
http://cgi.ebay.com/EQ-EQUALIZER-10-BAND-OPTIMUS-WITH-DISPLAY-NR_W0QQitemZ9724161240QQcategoryZ3271QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Here's something a bit more updated.
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-DUAL-10-BAND-GRAPHIC-DJ-PRO-AUDIO-EQUALIZER-EQ-SALE_W0QQitemZ7413650479QQcategoryZ23788QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

He's one with some fancy lighting effects.
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-2006-DUAL-10-BAND-GRAPHIC-PRO-AUDIO-EQUALIZER-DJ-EQ_W0QQitemZ7413104916QQcategoryZ23788QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

In post no. 29 in the following thread, I present measurements vs. equalizer settings that I did for a user a while back. It is a perfect example of how a standard 10 band equalizer will effect surrounding bands.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8930&page=3

-Chris

 

[mouettus]

I would`ve like the Behringer but the connections on the back doesn't fit. I don`t even have preouts on my receiver right now :S Think I'll have to wait if I want something decent. It all starts with a good foundation doesn't it? NAD 753 (1400 CAD) -vs- HK AVR-635 (900 CAD)

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

You don't need preouts. A standard eq usually has 3 l/r rca inputs for - say a cd player, dvd (2 channel), and cable/satellite (2 channel). The output from the eq would go to the receiver's one input (you pick - say DBS). Now all eq'd media would play through DBS. If you want to run surround sound, you can take the eq'd two channel source and choose a PLII/Neo mode, or multi-channel stereo mode. What you won't have is eq'd pure DD or DTS (and even the Behringer can't eq DD or DTS properly unless it's run in the pre-out mode to a separate amplifier). It's simple, and complicated at the same time. New receivers aren't meant to run equilizers, but there's ways around it. Tape loops don't work as easily as they did back in the two channel days of audio.

You can purchase balance to rca type connections at Radio Shack if you go with the Behringer.

 

[Steve1000]

Very cool, Chris! Thanks for the link to the old thread.

I use a Behringer DEQ2496 with my headphone setup, and keep different presets for different headphones. The world's greatest audio toy, I like to say.

I use a very old Yamaha 10 band equalizer with my living room speaker set-up, and it improves the sound to my ears quite a bit. I use it to juice the highs and lows a little, since I tend to listen in the 65 - 75 db range. But after reading this I'm tempted to get the Behringer feedback destroyer for $100 and stick that in the tape loop of my living room stereo instead, and see if I can get things sounding even a little better.

My living room stereo is pretty low-brow -- an old $100 technics SA-EX140 stereo receiver (with an old-style tape loop), Primus Infinity 150 speakers ($150/pair), the old $100 Yamaha GE-20 equalizer and an old-model cheap Sony subwoofer (about $70). So go ahead and laugh at me. My sources are IPOD, XM-radio, and DVD, VCR, minidisc and CD players But I think it's the best loudpeaker sound I've ever achieved in the home anyway. I actually ended up rearranging the living room to get it sounding better (before putting the finishing touches on with the EQ). And our living room looks much nicer now! Anyway, I'm pretty thrilled with it -- It sounds so nice I generally feel like it's all the speaker hi-fi I need for full enjoyment of the music.

In post no. 29 in the following thread, I present measurements vs. equalizer settings that I did for a user a while back. It is a perfect example of how a standard 10 band equalizer will effect surrounding bands.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8930&page=3

-Chris

 

[mouettus]

You can purchase balance to rca type connections at Radio Shack if you go with the Behringer.

Didn`t know you could do that. Thanks for the info. Now the other problem is that this eq sets up by computer... omg imagine the options you'll have to set in there!

Bummer for the DD and DTS but the hell... sound in movies isn`t that bad at all untreated.

... but I still think I need a new receiver HAHA

 

[mouettus]

I got that in the linked thread:

The Q(bandwidth) of the filters in standard graphic equalizers is usually very wide, and to boot, the filters usually effect/interact with each other if you use more then one. Basicly, it might say '10kHz' under the slider, but it may have a broad effect much higher and lower as well.

My response: who cares that it`s not THAT precise? I'm sure it can boost the sound quality at my ears and cut a bit on my Polk`s harsh higher frequencies at high volume.

I'm presently looking at the BEHRINGER ULTRACURVE PRO DEQ2496 on eBay and I'm in the process of choosing wether spending 400 CAD on an EQ (even if it`s a high-tech one) is worth it. And are you sure that it will solve my Overbright problem actually? (refering to the TITLE of MY thread here ) lol

 

[Resident Loser]

Problem is...

...where do you connect any EQ? There seems to be a distinct lack of any facilities to do so, unless I missed something at the Yammie site...no true Tape Monitor...no Pre-out/Power in jacks...Source EQing can cause Dolby/surround/processor problems...that's why many HT mfrs. don't recommend EQs nor do they provide facilities for their hookup...

Do you have all the pre-sets set correctly? Keep in mind excess treble could be caused by insufficient bass...it's all relative...all subjective...Room acoustics, proximity to the tweeters, hard reflective surfaces...they all play a part...

As has been suggested, try the tone controls...and don't worry about that "full spectrum" claptrap...generally speaking, it's audiophool hooey...Plus as I see it, you don't much seem to care that the sound isn't...

...THAT precise...

A word of advice...when looking for help in forums like these, you would do well to defer to those who (like WmAx) have most likely forgotten more than you will probably ever know...

jimHJJ(...and besides it's only Tee-Vee...so who gives a rat's @$$?...)

 

[WmAx]

I got that in the linked thread:



My response: who cares that it`s not THAT precise? I'm sure it can boost the sound quality at my ears and cut a bit on my Polk`s harsh higher frequencies at high volume.

I was simply pointing out that a common graphic equalizer has very low precision.

I'm presently looking at the BEHRINGER ULTRACURVE PRO DEQ2496 on eBay and I'm in the process of choosing wether spending 400 CAD on an EQ (even if it`s a high-tech one) is worth it. And are you sure that it will solve my Overbright problem actually? (refering to the TITLE of MY thread here ) lol

Consider the DCX2496. It's cheaper, and it has far more abilities than just equalization. You can later use this device to to put together stereo systems that would not normally be feasible, and provide for bass/main integration that is much better than normally possible on a receiver's built in bass management. Of course, you still need a way to connect this thing in the circuit, and so far it seems that your receiver has no such provision.

-Chris

 

[pikers]

In your sig, you blame Jap audio, when your problem is quite American with the Polks. Yamaha and Polk? Pass the cotton balls. Must have been the best CC had.