Onix x-ls, Ascend CBM-170 or SVS SBS-01

[Brandst]

I am looking at upgrading my main HT/music system from the current JBLs that have served me well for the last 13 years. I have narrowed my choices down to the Onix x-ls, the Ascend 170s or the new SVS SBS system. I will be keeping my current sub, a velodyne VPR-1000, for now and adding a SVS PB10-NSD in the future. Usage will be about 50/50 maybe favoring HT a little more. I am running a Marantz 7500 receiver, Sony 5 disc DVD changer, Onkyo universal DVD, and Samsung HD satellite for sources.

The Onix and the SVS are about a wash as far as price goes and I'm leaning more towards the Onix as the musical part of reviews on the SVS aren't as good. The Ascends will run about $150 more than the Onix and almost $200 more than the SVS, but are said to be more neutral sounding than the SVS, have not seen them and the Onix compared.

My question is, I'm leaning more toward the Ascends, are they really worth the extra money over the Onix system? It really only works out to an extra $35 or less per speaker. I would love to be able to get them all in the house to audition, sadly I'm not able to do that right now though.

Thanks in advance,
Steve

 

[silversurfer]

The Ascends will run about $150 more than the Onix and almost $200 more than the SVS, but are said to be more neutral sounding than the SVS, have not seen them and the Onix compared.

Someone started an Ascend Review thread on AVS. In it is the only comparison between the X-LS and 170SE I have seen:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=717152

The original review is in the long Ascend thread over at AVS.

 

[jcPanny]

Speaker audition

The SVS speakers would probably work well for HT, but the Onix and Ascend would be better for Music and HT.
Consider ordering a pair of both the Onix and Ascend bookshelf speakers. You will have a month to audition them in your home and will only be only out the $30 to ship back the loser.
You might want to demo them with the SVS sub since that is how you will use them in your system. Also mains and center channel + sub would be a good upgrade path with a few JBLs saved for the temporary surround speakers.

 

[VS540]

The SVS speakers would probably work well for HT, but the Onix and Ascend would be better for Music and HT.
Consider ordering a pair of both the Onix and Ascend bookshelf speakers. You will have a month to audition them in your home and will only be only out the $30 to ship back the loser.
You might want to demo them with the SVS sub since that is how you will use them in your system. Also mains and center channel + sub would be a good upgrade path with a few JBLs saved for the temporary surround speakers.

I say try both as well. Shipping one pair back wouldn't be too much, and peace of mind is priceless.

 

[Tomorrow]

I am looking at upgrading my main HT/music system from the current JBLs that have served me well for the last 13 years. I have narrowed my choices down to the Onix x-ls, the Ascend 170s or the new SVS SBS system. I will be keeping my current sub, a velodyne VPR-1000, for now and adding a SVS PB10-NSD in the future. Usage will be about 50/50 maybe favoring HT a little more. I am running a Marantz 7500 receiver, Sony 5 disc DVD changer, Onkyo universal DVD, and Samsung HD satellite for sources.

The Onix and the SVS are about a wash as far as price goes and I'm leaning more towards the Onix as the musical part of reviews on the SVS aren't as good. The Ascends will run about $150 more than the Onix and almost $200 more than the SVS, but are said to be more neutral sounding than the SVS, have not seen them and the Onix compared.

My question is, I'm leaning more toward the Ascends, are they really worth the extra money over the Onix system? It really only works out to an extra $35 or less per speaker. I would love to be able to get them all in the house to audition, sadly I'm not able to do that right now though.

Thanks in advance,
Steve

Just a word of caution (and before the boos rain down upon me, lol)....

Be sure to A/B your new acquisitions with your current speakers. Depending upon what models your JBLs are, I wouldn't be surprised if you don't prefer them.

 

[Nick250]

If I had to order blind, it would be the Ascend. I don't think the other two are real competition, the Ascend is a level or two above them by all reports.

I started a thread over at the Avs Forum in the speaker forum a couple of months ago called "Does Anybody Not Like Ascend?" I don't have a link handy but if you do a search you will find it. Great thread. Lots of give and take, but in a good way.

Nick

 

[silversurfer]

When you demo, it is best to demo them as you intend to use them. Meaning, if you are going to use them with a sub, demo them with a sub properly setup.

The best demos are the ones in your home, setup and properly calibrated. Everyone is right, shipping on a pair of these bookshelves is relatively small.

 

[STRONGBADF1]

If I had to order blind, it would be the Ascend. I don't think the other two are real competition, the Ascend is a level or two above them by all reports.

I started a thread over at the Avs Forum in the speaker forum a couple of months ago called "Does Anybody Not Like Ascend?" I don't have a link handy but if you do a search you will find it. Great thread. Lots of give and take, but in a good way.

Nick

I was interested so I looked.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=708659&highlight=Does+Anybody+Not+Like+Ascend


SBF1

 

[Tomorrow]

I was interested so I looked.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=708659&highlight=Does+Anybody+Not+Like+Ascend


SBF1

Thanks for the link, SBF1.

After reading much of the thread, it comes back to the same old refrain...people talk about speakers when they have limited experience with a broad range of brands and designs... "yeah, I have heard a pair of those down at Snoopy's HiFi...they sound much rangier than my Flabbia Tuberosa 240's.", or "yep, I prefer a more neutral and accurate speaker." IMHO these are mostly discussions with huge logic loopholes. Who amongst us has listened to or A/B auditioned many (as in, say, more than a dozen) different speakers in their listening environment? Gene? Craigsub? Anyone else? Only a few, I'd wager. To make broad statements about speaker performance and coloration, or lack thereof, is not fruitful.

The only thing that matters is what is between the ears. And you can safely ignore all the marketing strategies, and forum support, and research, and DBTs, and 'value' pricing and ..... . Accuracy is an illusion, by the way. Unless you have the band playing the song you're running through your speakers for A/B purposes, you can't possibly tell anything of accuracy. All speakers utilize tradeoffs of one sort or another in their design. Further, what you're listening to is recorded by someone else's (recording engineer, who's listening to HIS speakers) version of what the music should sound like. And let's not even go into the discussion of the transparency, or lack thereof, of the media itself or the front-end equipment. Finally, each unique listening environment will variously affect speaker acoustics.

I don't want to come across as the grumpy old man (that I probably am ) with nothing positive to contribute. On the contrary. My advice is to audition as many speakers, in situ, that you can afford to ship back, and select the best sounding ones to you. Pick a price range that you're comfortable with, and go for it. Then you will be satisfied that you have the right speaker for yourself.

 

[j_garcia]

I've heard the SBSs and the Ascends, but not the X-LS. I would choose the 170s over the SBSs. The X-LS was co-designed by the guy who designed my speakers though, so I know they are going to be good as well. Tough choice, but I don't think you will be disappointed with any of these speakers.

 

[Brandst]

Thanks for the link SBF1. I think I have pretty well decided on the Ascends but wanted to hear some opinions on the others. Fom what I've seen they are definatly a step (or two?) up from the SBS, thought the SBS were a good bit cheaper too and they're not. And after comparing the x-ls and the Ascends on price, the Ascends come out only $150 more, the shipping on the x-ls setup is almost twice as much and almost negates the price difference. I could always go with the MBM-200s for surround duty or keep my JBLs for that and save even more on the 170s.

These are the JBLs that I have.
http://www.jbl.com/home/products/product_detail.aspx?prod=SAT2&CheckProduct=Y
They came as a 2.1 system for mains and also as a 3 piece set for center and surround. I have been pleased with them since I first heard them, demoed them at CC along with everything else they had in the room that was bookshelf or smaller at the time. 4 hours and 10 or so CDs later I decided on them for both music and HT, still lived at my dads house at the time. I have a Infinity Primus Theater Pack in the bedroom with the Primus 140s and like them slightly more than the JBLs. I will probably move the Infinity's to the main room while I try to sell the JBLs on ebay, should be easy and probably $100+ per pair, they don't come up often and have a rather large following on there. I have seen pairs with the mounting brackets, which I have, go for over $200 a few times and I have 5 sats and 1 center.

Thanks again,
Steve

 

[silversurfer]

.....the shipping on the x-ls setup is almost twice as much and almost negates the price difference.

Really? Do you have some numbers you can show?

 

[Brandst]

Shipping from AV123 on 4 x-ls speakers and 1 x-cs speaker is $118. The shipping on 5 Ascend CBM-170s is $56 dollars. I live in Northwest Florida just east of Pensacola, Ascend is in CA and AV123 in CO. The shipping brings the difference in price between the 2 to just under $150, about $25 more per speaker for the 170s.

Steve

 

[silversurfer]

Ahhhh....OK

But if you went with the CMT-340 center, just like you went with the dedicated X series center, the difference grows.

 

[Tomorrow]

Fom what I've seen they are definatly a step (or two?) up from the SBS, thought the SBS were a good bit cheaper too and they're not. And after comparing the x-ls and the Ascends on price, the Ascends come out only $150 more, the shipping on the x-ls setup is almost twice as much and almost negates the price difference. Steve

Steve.

Please help me understand. How are the Ascends a step or two up from the SBS? What have you seen or heard that demonstrates this to you?

And speaking of price.... If you listen to enough speakers you will hear multi-thousand dollar speakers that you think sound awful and cheap speakers you will think sound great. It's all in what your ears prefer.

 

[silversurfer]

Please help me understand. How are the Ascends a step or two up from the SBS? What have you seen or heard that demonstrates this to you?

I have not heard the SBS speakers, but I have read most of what has been posted here and AVS about the SBS/Ascend comparisons, and most seem to indicate that the Ascends are a step up.

 

[Tomorrow]

I have not heard the SBS speakers, but I have read most of what has been posted here and AVS about the SBS/Ascend comparisons, and most seem to indicate that the Ascends are a step up.

That's what I see, SS. But that doesn't make it so. In the finest tradition of WmAx, I'd like to see something other than hearsay from someone else's opinion who heard (hearing is the key word) the speakers once against some other set. I'd like to see some evidence that these speakers are "better" than or a "step up" from any other speakers. You know...some real proof that they are better in some specific way (cabinet build, heavier gauge wire, driver tolerances, off-axis capabilities, etc). What truly is better about the Ascends over the xl-s or other speakers under scrutiny, here? Otherwise, there is no better with speakers unless your ears tell you so in your listening environment. (That is truly what is going on here.) And that goes back to my earlier point. Hearing is unique to every listener. I can tell you all day long that Sonus Faber speakers are the BEST speakers made...and you could hate them because of their soft attributes.

Steve is going to spend money on speakers he has never heard....more money than on buying other speakers he also has never heard. The human dynamics are too interesting to pass up. I'd like to understand.

 

[silversurfer]

That's what I see, SS. But that doesn't make it so. In the finest tradition of WmAx, I'd like to see something other than hearsay from someone else's opinion who heard (hearing is the key word) the speakers once against some other set. I'd like to see some evidence that these speakers are "better" than or a "step up" from any other speakers. You know...some real proof that they are better in some specific way (cabinet build, heavier gauge wire, driver tolerances, off-axis capabilities, etc). What truly is better about the Ascends over the xl-s or other speakers under scrutiny, here? Otherwise, there is no better with speakers unless your ears tell you so in your listening environment. And that goes back to my earlier point. Hearing is unique to every listener. I can tell you all day long that Sonus Faber speakers are the BEST speakers made...and you could hate them because of their soft attributes.

Steve is going to spend money on speakers he has never heard....more money than on buying other speakers he also has never heard. The human dynamics are too interesting to pass up. I'd like to understand.

I understand what you are saying, but how do you otherwise narrow down your choices without actually being able to hear the speakers? How many speakers do you suggest he listen to in his own environment?

 

[billnchristy]

I do not think you will be disappointed with the XL-S. I don't know how they compare to the Ascends but they have been favorably compared to much more expensive speakers.

The X-CS is going to be one serious center channel also and at half the price of the Ascend version.

I also do not know how ascend ships, but I can guarantee that unless UPS uses your boxes as a wrecking ball that your speakers will get to you unharmed.

Lastly, the X series speakers weigh quite a bit more than the ascends which is probably why shipping is more.

For instance the Ascend center is 26lbs with a 28lb shipping weight
the X-CS is 33lbs with a 41lb ship weight...that is a considerable amount of boxing.

Either way, hope you are happy, I love my X-LS and have another pair and 3 X-CS coming. (X-CS will be my surrounds in my Rocket HT)

 

[Tomorrow]

I understand what you are saying, but how do you otherwise narrow down your choices without actually being able to hear the speakers? How many speakers do you suggest he listen to in his own environment?

I believe in narrowing the choices based upon some logic. I haven't seen that as yet. What I've seen is a decision to buy Ascends "because they are a step (or two) up from the others". That's why I asked the question I did. ----> "Please help me understand. How are the Ascends a step or two up? What have you seen or heard that demonstrates this to you?"

I want to know less about Ascend speakers, SS, than I do about the reason we make the audio purchase decisions that we do.

If you're asking what would I do...I would audition as many speaker brands as I could (in stores for financial reasons), discover the 'sound style' that appeals to me, and then come here to ask for opinions about speakers that have those attributes, both sonic and build/aesthetics.

Don't you think it's sensible to audition as many speakers as possible to more reasonably be able to make statements of certainty like "A is better/a step up from B" (especially given individual preferences)?