Old school Crown guy

[big2bird]

After years of raising family, I am trying to get back into home audio.
My system was basically all purchased in the late 70's
.Crown SX-700 R-T-R (Rebuilt by John Haines 10 years ago)
B&O 4000 (Rebuilt by Soundsmith 10 years ago)
Crown IC-150 preamp (Needs pots/recap) ATE can do this work
Crown FM-2 tuner (Works fine)
Crown EQ-2 equaliser (Not looking good here) Maybe a new DBX unit?
Crown VFX2A X-over (Not yet tested) Could need recap)
2) Crown DC-150A's (Needs pots/recap)
1) Crown DC-300A (Needs pow supply cap) ATE can service
Denon C-630CD player (For the spouse)
Crown OC-150 (Going to the trash bin)
DOD RTA (Works fine for how cheap it was)
Altec/Lansing Valencia speakers (Going to be rebuilt by GPA or a friend)

I have a budget of about $3000 to repair or replace what I have. The speakers will eat $1000.
Restoring the preamp is about $600 I "guess"
I am open to new Crown amps of equal/better performance.
Should I buy an SA-2 amp and have it restored?

Frankly, I just started this project a few weeks ago, and am in the edification stage.

No, I cannot afford all new stuff, or Mac equipment. LOL (Actually I can, but I do not seek divorce at this time)

 

[big2bird]

A few notes:
I have been an IBEW electrician for 35 years, and I also played trumpet, baritone, and french horn at university. I have a decent ear.
I know when the system was all new, it was pretty good for that era.
Yes, the bass rolled off below 40HZ, and the H/F rolled off about 14KHTZ. Triangle never sounded correct, and bass drum lacked all the lower overtones.
I am open to new preamp options for $1000, as I have 1,200 albums/remastered, d to d albums to play.
I am open to any suggestions, including adding a sub woofer for the L/F sound.
I would not mind spending a few dollars to integrate the modern stuff like HDMI surround sound using what I have for a basis. I am not sure what is out there now to do this, or if it's worth it.

 

[Irvrobinson]

After years of raising family, I am trying to get back into home audio.
My system was basically all purchased in the late 70's
.Crown SX-700 R-T-R (Rebuilt by John Haines 10 years ago)
B&O 4000 (Rebuilt by Soundsmith 10 years ago)
Crown IC-150 preamp (Needs pots/recap) ATE can do this work
Crown FM-2 tuner (Works fine)
Crown EQ-2 equaliser (Not looking good here) Maybe a new DBX unit?
Crown VFX2A X-over (Not yet tested) Could need recap)
2) Crown DC-150A's (Needs pots/recap)
1) Crown DC-300A (Needs pow supply cap) ATE can service
Denon C-630CD player (For the spouse)
Crown OC-150 (Going to the trash bin)
DOD RTA (Works fine for how cheap it was)
Altec/Lansing Valencia speakers (Going to be rebuilt by GPA or a friend)

I have a budget of about $3000 to repair or replace what I have. The speakers will eat $1000.
Restoring the preamp is about $600 I "guess"
I am open to new Crown amps of equal/better performance.
Should I buy an SA-2 amp and have it restored?

Frankly, I just started this project a few weeks ago, and am in the edification stage.

No, I cannot afford all new stuff, or Mac equipment. LOL (Actually I can, but I do not seek divorce at this time)

Here's my opinion, probably worth what you're paying for it.

1. Cool SX700. I had my old CX822 rebuilt by John Haines too.

2. The IC-150 is nice. Have it refurbed.

3. I don't think you need an equalizer these days, so save your money. The same for the crossover, especially with my comment below.

4. I'd keep the DC300A and have it refurbed. I'd sell the DC150A.

5. I'd sell the Altec speakers. Yup, I say sell 'em.

6. Take whatever is left of your budget and the proceeds of selling the speakers and the DC150A and go speaker shopping. For $2000 these days you can get some nice stuff, like the Golden Ear Triton 3, just to choose one at random. I think they'll sound a lot better than the Altecs. They won't look as impressive, but close your eyes. I'm not sure what the big Valencias are worth, but maybe enough that if you sell them you can be in the $3000/pr class for new ones, and then you can get some very fine sound, especially if you have the courage to buy used.

 

[big2bird]

Here's my opinion, probably worth what you're paying for it.

1. Cool SX700. I had my old CX822 rebuilt by John Haines too.Thanks

2. The IC-150 is nice. Have it refurbed.I should while they still have parts

3. I don't think you need an equalizer these days, so save your money. The same for the crossover, especially with my comment below.

4. I'd keep the DC300A and have it refurbed. I'd sell the DC150A.Yep. The DC-150a's are unsupported at ATE

5. I'd sell the Altec speakers. Yup, I say sell 'em.On the fence here

6. Take whatever is left of your budget and the proceeds of selling the speakers and the DC150A and go speaker shopping. For $2000 these days you can get some nice stuff, like the Golden Ear Triton 3, just to choose one at random. I think they'll sound a lot better than the Altecs. They won't look as impressive, but close your eyes. I'm not sure what the big Valencias are worth, but maybe enough that if you sell them you can be in the $3000/pr class for new ones, and then you can get some very fine sound, especially if you have the courage to buy used.

I appreciate the candid comments, and would add you are the second person that has suggested just that.

What is the concensous on rebuilding the DC-300A vs getting new XLS-2000's and bi amping? I have not a clue. I am trying to come up to speed, but have a lot to read.

The usual "seperating the wheat from the chaffe" when it comes to the hype associated with audio and aftermarket car parts. LOL

 

[Irvrobinson]

I appreciate the candid comments, and would add you are the second person that has suggested just that.

What is the concensous on rebuilding the DC-300A vs getting new XLS-2000's and bi amping? I have not a clue. I am trying to come up to speed, but have a lot to read.

The usual "seperating the wheat from the chaffe" when it comes to the hype associated with audio and aftermarket car parts. LOL

Regarding the DC-300A, it depends on how much it costs to refurb it. An XLS1000 will easily drive most speakers, and it costs $299 at Musician's Friend online. The ATI AT602 that I use in my video system, which is a more conventional Class A/B design, also sells for $299 new online. Frankly, I think a new amp isn't a bad idea, but I thought you had an attachment to the old stuff.

Forget bi-amping. In your case a complete waste of money.

 

[big2bird]

Regarding the DC-300A, it depends on how much it costs to refurb it. An XLS1000 will easily drive most speakers, and it costs $299 at Musician's Friend online. The ATI AT602 that I use in my video system, which is a more conventional Class A/B design, also sells for $299 new online. Frankly, I think a new amp isn't a bad idea, but I thought you had an attachment to the old stuff.

Forget bi-amping. In your case a complete waste of money.

I just want good music back in my life. I prefer to rack mount, and would not hesitate to buy a new amp if the quality is there.
I looked at the Triton 3 articles. Quite impressive.
I am quite open minded.
I will send off the IC-150A to ATE ASAP. I also have a spare one if they determine it is DOA.

 

[big2bird]

Just for giggles, I routed the CD player right into one of my DC-150C's. Mamma mia, it woke up. The speakers are fine. (Well, as good as they were back in the day) The preamp is the main issue. It has enough power to shake the walls, so RIP DC-300A.
I know now what is good, and what is trash. Good first step.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Now'a days the technology makes whole this much simpler. Crown still makes fine equipment, but now mostly for pro market
Most AHers are typical experts in vintage audio and me neither but one thing I can tell you for sure:
Out of 3k budget, spending only 1k on speakers is a no optimal investment. You'd want to have 70-80% of your budget in speakers.

here few notes and opinions regarding your speakers:
Help with Altec Valencia
You may want to consider to upgrade them or replace all together

I'd say, keep the sources (tt and r2r) but the rest could be replaced with two pieces: pre-amp and amp: Emotiva usp-1 and this amp:
PA 2-160 Stereo Amplifier | Sherbourn Technologies - hurry - this sale will end soon
You could replace with Crown Amazon.com: Crown XTi 1002: Musical Instruments

you should have spend the rest on speakers

 

[big2bird]

Now'a days the technology makes whole this much simpler. Crown still makes fine equipment, but now mostly for pro market
Most AHers are typical experts in vintage audio and me neither but one thing I can tell you for sure:
Out of 3k budget, spending only 1k on speakers is a no optimal investment. You'd want to have 70-80% of your budget in speakers.

here few notes and opinions regarding your speakers:
Help with Altec Valencia
You may want to consider to upgrade them or replace all together

I'd say, keep the sources (tt and r2r) but the rest could be replaced with two pieces: pre-amp and amp: Emotiva usp-1 and this amp:
PA 2-160 Stereo Amplifier | Sherbourn Technologies - hurry - this sale will end soon
You could replace with Crown Amazon.com: Crown XTi 1002: Musical Instruments

you should have spend the rest on speakers

I appreciate all the suggestions. Please keep ideas coming. For now, with a pre amp added I function, have music again, and can always buy upgraded speakers as funds permit.

 

[Irvrobinson]

If you haven't read this article on the Valencias you might find it interesting:

Listening #125 | Stereophile.com

 

[big2bird]

If you haven't read this article on the Valencias you might find it interesting:

Listening #125 | Stereophile.com

Interesting. Those are 846A's, vs mine are 846B's. Main difference are that the B's are 8 ohms, vs the A's which are 16 ohms. The porting is different, as the grill. I "think" I paid about $500@ in 1976.
They have always suffered down low, below is 60htz is non-existant, as above 10-12K they roll off fast.
After I get the pre amp section going, I can test the TT, RTR, and my old DBX encoder-decoder, and see what needs work there.

 

[Irvrobinson]

They have always suffered down low, below is 60htz is non-existent, as above 10-12K they roll off fast.

I didn't realize they were that bad. If you're correct the Valencias don't really qualify as high fidelity speakers. That's not even up to FM radio or vinyl standards, assuming your assessment is correct, and since you have an RTA it probably is. Modern digital recordings have a lot of content below 60Hz, and I'd wager you're also missing out on stereo imaging. If they're rolling off above 10KHz percussion instruments will also sound deficient. It's your decision, obviously, but you're missing out on a lot, IMO.

 

[big2bird]

I didn't realize they were that bad. If you're correct the Valencias don't really qualify as high fidelity speakers. That's not even up to FM radio or vinyl standards, assuming your assessment is correct, and since you have an RTA it probably is. Modern digital recordings have a lot of content below 60Hz, and I'd wager you're also missing out on stereo imaging. If they're rolling off above 10KHz percussion instruments will also sound deficient. It's your decision, obviously, but you're missing out on a lot, IMO.

I have friend that is going to look them over soon. I do not wish to release his name without permission, but as luck would have it, he is well known in the field. My x-over caps showed up today. I will install them ASAP to see what difference that could make. AND, by blind luck, I scored another IC-150A preamp that was factroy rebuilt 2 years ago. Saves a round trip to AET with my old one.

 

[big2bird]

I didn't realize they were that bad. If you're correct the Valencias don't really qualify as high fidelity speakers. That's not even up to FM radio or vinyl standards, assuming your assessment is correct, and since you have an RTA it probably is. Modern digital recordings have a lot of content below 60Hz, and I'd wager you're also missing out on stereo imaging. If they're rolling off above 10KHz percussion instruments will also sound deficient. It's your decision, obviously, but you're missing out on a lot, IMO.

In defense of the speakers, I think when new they were good for 35hz-17/18khtz. I still am chasing issues, and the RTA mic may even be limiting the readings. I'll keep the thread updated, as it might be fun to see the old guy chase down what once was, and pursue what is yet to come. The bass seems to be waking up more as they play, but H/F overtones like triangles did always lack.

 

[jinjuku]

I started out on Crown in the 80's and went away from it and boomeranged back (after Carver, Adcom, Parasound etc...).

I owned the DC 300A, DC 150A, IC 150A, OC 150.

Honestly I wouldn't put the money into the vintage stuff. While I feel nostalgic for it time and technology has moved on. I would get the XLS 1500 vs the DC 300A. I use a computer as a pre and of course this depends on your current sources.

 

[Stuart Lorriman]

I am old as well. Office system
Crown IC150
Crown PS200
JBL 4312

 

[Bucknekked]

I am old as well. Office system
Crown IC150
Crown PS200
JBL 4312

Stuart:
I'm with you, old as well. Want to know what causes cranky old man syndrome?
Getting excited about a thread and then seeing it's a 4 year old thread.
Yup. You and me are the only ones that didn't notice the thread is from 2013.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

something tells me re-reading this 4 year old thread that OP (@big2bird) still listens to music on his original valencias..

 

[Bucknekked]

something tells me re-reading this 4 year old thread that OP (@big2bird) still listens to music on his original valencias..

I never had much chance to listen to Altecs back in the day. But I did get chances to listen to the Klipsch speakers that are sized and designed in that same gigantic oversized way. If I had a pair of Khorns, or La Scalas or Heresys, I might still be listening to them as well. Get them rebuilt/refurbed if necessary and keep on going.

I don't know whether it was a blessing or a curse to never have both a big enough house and a big enough audio budget at the same time. I never did over the years and as life turns out, now that I can, I know I would choose other more modern designs (I just did with the Salk Songtowers).

You are probably correct: the OP is sitting back listening to his Valencias probably on the same vintage amp he always used after he got it refurbed. Not a bad way to spend a Saturday afternoon.

 

[MrBoat]

Seems being he was willing to spend $1k on those speakers, he could have upgraded the crossovers, or maybe even a different CD for the highs and added subwoofers to his layout being that he mentioned issues with the lows.