McIntosh New or Used

[Cseven]

I am getting ready to build a new 5.1 surround system and want some opinions from those with personal experience before I drop the hammer. What has been your experience with the McIntosh MX 205 and the MC 121 (just came out)? I an looking at a new 121 and used 205, B&W 804's for the front, 805's rear, a center (not sure which yet) and one or two 12 inch subs. Is a used McIntosh amp a relatively safe item or should I just go for new? What about used speakers? Too risky? The cost is a factor and if I can keep it down it would be desirable. If you factor in quality, reliability and performance, would you go with this system or are there any other combinations you would recommend. Thanks for any input!

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

I am getting ready to build a new 5.1 surround system and want some opinions from those with personal experience before I drop the hammer. What has been your experience with the McIntosh MX 205 and the MC 121 (just came out)? I an looking at a new 121 and used 205, B&W 804's for the front, 805's rear, a center (not sure which yet) and one or two 12 inch subs. Is a used McIntosh amp a relatively safe item or should I just go for new? What about used speakers? Too risky? The cost is a factor and if I can keep it down it would be desirable. If you factor in quality, reliability and performance, would you go with this system or are there any other combinations you would recommend. Thanks for any input!

Before you overspend of electronics and under-spend on speakers, please elaborate what is your target budget and how big is the room..
Imho for $4k/pair B&W 804 - you could get so much better speakers elsewhere
Salk Sound Veracity HT2-TL or Ascend Sierra Towers w/NRT upgrade for example

 

[jinjuku]

Based on my recent listening sessions on some McGear I wouldn't pay the cost premium. I would put the extra $$ toward speakers.

 

[jcl]

I'm wondering how you came by your choices? McIntosh and B & W are not generally thought of when keeping costs down. They may deliver quality, but at a price. If you look you can find brands offering better value for your dollar.

Oh, and don't treat your sub(s) as an afterthought. They are an important part of the whole.

 

[Grador]

The above advice is very solid, but to answer one of your questions going used on the electronics would be fine.

 

[Cseven]

My target budget is currently preferably under $20,000 for the pre amp, amp, two front speakers, one center speaker and either one or two subs. My original budget was $10,000 but I believe it was unrealistic, retrospectively. I agree with starting with speakers and appreciate BoredSysAdmin's and jinjuky's suggestions. I will research the speakers you recommend. I agree with the recommendation about cost control of the gear and I have read a lot of reviews on McIntosh, Krell, Classe but the $$$$ of new puts them out of reach. Used equipment: I am hoping to get some advice on which pre-amp/surround 5.1-7.1 and which amp combination would be something I should start looking for. I think high end equipment would be well maintained and may not be a bad option for me, although there is that concern about defective electronics and no warranty.
Jcl; I was looking at a used MC 205 (35% less than new) and a new MX 121 ($6,000) and have not purchased yet. The B&W speakers also used at about 30% off when they come up. Better value for the investment is sound advice and I agree. What options do you suggest? I thought the equipment I listed would be excellent and long lasting, thats why I was considering the system I described.
I have (in master bedroom) Outlaw 990, two outlaw monoblock amps for the two rear speakers, M&K active speakers (three front) and M&K Sub (two push pull 8"). I like the system but for the living room I want to go up a few levels.
Thank you all for your responses and if you have any other suggestions, I am all ears!

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

My target budget is currently preferably under $20,000 for the pre amp, amp, two front speakers, one center speaker and either one or two subs. My original budget was $10,000 but I believe it was unrealistic, retrospectively. I agree with starting with speakers and appreciate BoredSysAdmin's and jinjuky's suggestions. I will research the speakers you recommend. I agree with the recommendation about cost control of the gear and I have read a lot of reviews on McIntosh, Krell, Classe but the $$$$ of new puts them out of reach. Used equipment: I am hoping to get some advice on which pre-amp/surround 5.1-7.1 and which amp combination would be something I should start looking for. I think high end equipment would be well maintained and may not be a bad option for me, although there is that concern about defective electronics and no warranty.
Jcl; I was looking at a used MC 205 (35% less than new) and a new MX 121 ($6,000) and have not purchased yet. The B&W speakers also used at about 30% off when they come up. Better value for the investment is sound advice and I agree. What options do you suggest? I thought the equipment I listed would be excellent and long lasting, thats why I was considering the system I described.
I have (in master bedroom) Outlaw 990, two outlaw monoblock amps for the two rear speakers, M&K active speakers (three front) and M&K Sub (two push pull 8"). I like the system but for the living room I want to go up a few levels.
Thank you all for your responses and if you have any other suggestions, I am all ears!

My Personal opinion: McIntosh makes some very robust equipment, but it comes at very hefty price tag, there are many other respectable manufacturers which you can get brand new and have full warranty and I won't be ashamed recommending.

First the "processor" - Denon AVR-4311CI - Yes, its not a pre-pro, but it's features , specs and actual performance and reliability are in line if not better than most separates... Depends on your speakers - you might not need amps at all or use amps only on front channels - where they are needed the most..

Speakers: As I already mentioned several models above, I'd throw in one more: Philharmonics 3 - these made from tiny company, but owner/designer Denis Murphy is very bright and his speakers designs amazing in both performance and value - too bad he doesn't make horizontal centers

Jim Salk used to work together with DM, but not DM went on his own way - in many aspects the sound of both brands is somewhat similar.

I think best would be to try to find a place where you could audition these speakers. I think companies I mentioned above do allow speakers returns within 30 days, unless you order a custom finish/options.

I'm not terribly familiar with M&K Subs, but dual 8" drivers doesn't inspire vote of confidence... I'd strongly recommend to seek alternatives.... From SVS,Rythmics, HSU or Outlaw. There are also smaller companies which make really kick-a$$ subs - like FunkyWaves - the brand name is funky but the subs are top notch.

 

[jinjuku]

What size is the room? Layout? How open is it to other areas?

Where do you live? Maybe another member that is close that could help.

Check out this thread for some input on another newer member that was much in the same position.

 

[fuzz092888]

Idk that I would ever recommend a Mc when you could get an ATI or AB international amp that will more than hold it's own against nearly any Mc for a fraction of the cost. Big American made amps that are built like a tank and made to last.

 

[zieglj01]

McIntosh is nice and attractive - however simply put, they are over priced.

On the retail side - look at PSB Synchrony speakers.

 

[Cseven]

jinjuku,
Good point. I was not ignoring you, just afraid to answer!
Unfortunately the room is acoustically about the worst possible one could imagine. It is rectangular total of 25 feet long (2/3 living room and the remainder dining room), 14 feet wide, limestone floor no carpets (I am afraid to tell you because I already know the response I am going to get) and the ceiling is a shallow peak, low pitch, about 9 feet high in the center. The sony xbr is built into the stone fireplace and I want the R&L speakers to be on either side of the fireplace. There is a rectangular mantle 8" tall, 8 feet wide and 10-11" deep with 12-13 inches from the top surface of the mantle to the bottom edge of the TV. Little room for a center speaker as you can see. The right side of the room is drywall. The entire left side of the room is sliding glass doors. Really a nightmare for good acoustics. Your question is extremely valid and it brings up the obvious point of what can I do to improve acoustics asthetically, without my wife booting me into the back yard for life! As usual, one question leads to five more. I live in Dana Point, California.

 

[jinjuku]

One of the possible issues that you are looking at with a room like this is taking really great speakers and making very poor sound with them.

There is a saying in the landscaping business: Dig a $50 hole for a $10 plant. Not a $10 hole for a $50 plant.

 

[jcl]

Based on the room description it sounds like you need to redirect some funds to room treatments.

Maybe some acoustic curtains over the sliding glass doors to tame reflections and block light while viewing movies. Something like these : Quiet Curtains - Your source for acoustic curtains & acoustic drapes. Lab Tested & Field Proven.

A rug on the floor to help tame reflections there.

Some panels on the wall for reflections there; if you do the custom panels your wife may be more amenable to the idea. For example :
GIK ArtPanel™. GIK Acoustics. Acoustic Panels and Bass Traps.

What are you currently using in the space? Perhaps you should work a little on the room first. I'm hardly an expert in this. Companies like Gik Acoustics provide some design services to help you treat your room. I have no personal experience with GIK, I just mention them as they have been reviewed here at audioholics.