KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Yesterday, I visited ATLAudio. My main interest was to check out the PSA XS15se which is currently on sale for $700. However, the RF62-II are on sale all over the internet (including Amazon) for $300 ea. (used to go for $500, but being replaced by new model). I was impressed enough with this as a great value to present this review.

Setup:
His system consists of:
Denon AVR X-4000
Klipsch RF-62 II (crossed at 80Hz)
Klipsch RC-52 II
Klipsch RS-42 II
Power Sound Audio XS15se
Pro-Ject Genie 1.3
He had Audyssey engaged, so please consider that when considering my comments below. I have no idea how much difference Audyssey may have made. I only know what I heard was very nice. Since many people would use Audyssey anyway, I feel the review is relevant.
The speakers were "aimed" about 5 degrees behind me.
The room measured 18'X17' with listening position 5' from back wall (along 17' dimension).

Home Theater:
ATLAudio has done a great job of properly setting up his system! He played a ~10 to 15 minute segment of Avatar for me and I was thoroughly impressed! It was a thrilling and immersive experience and I could not find flaw with it. I know, intellectually, that the XS15se does not have the deepest extension, but with it corner loaded, the room was definitely well pressurized and I felt like a good theater had absolutely nothing to offer beyond this! (I checked to verify - it falls in the Audioholic's Bassaholic Large Room category).

Music:
Micro-dynamics is the term that best sets these speakers apart from competition in their price range. I was amazed at how well they presented small details. It reminded me of listening to electrostatics. When I tested for directionality, I found some of that magic detail was lost as I moved out of the sweetspot, but the sound was still well balanced. There was no collapsing of the sound field as electrostatics are prone to. These speakers present details to your ear that remind me of listening to my Monsoon planar computer speakers in near-field.
Dynamics. This is definitely a forte of the Klipsches (and I guess I should give some credit to the sub for not getting in the way in the lower frequencies). I did not have my own Focal Solo6Be speakers in the room to compare, but I felt like the attacks were of the same caliber, maybe better (which is an extraordinary compliment)! This ranges from the immediate impactfulness (if that is a word) of rim-shots on the drums to the edginess of an aggressively played trombone.
Harshness. I am happy to report that the harshness I associate with horns (mostly from the late 70's and early 80's when I was listening to everything I could in audio shops - and they had audio shops to hear about everything) is no longer an issue. The Klipsch are not laid-back, they are forward sounding speakers, but I did not hear the harshness I was expecting. I think I would get some fatigue from listening to treble heavy content on these at volume for several hours, but I get fatigue from listening to treble heavy live music, or on any speaker with a solid top end, so that is not really a valid complaint. My point is that if you want muted treble, look elsewhere. If you are sensitive to forward speakers, look elsewhere. For me, these had a great presence that I loved, but I would probably switch from "Audyssey flat" to plain "Audyssey" to rest my ears if I was listening loud for hours! Or, more likely, just turn them down. With their dynamic immediacy and Audyssey's Dynamic EQ, these speakers offer a very fulfilling experience at reduced volume levels.

Cons. Without reference speakers in the room for comparison, I have a hard time finding flaw with these.
Directionality. The directionality of the horns was not bad, but it certainly was not as good as standard dome tweeters. I suspect it is this horn directionality that affords the micro-dynamics and detail, so am reluctant to make too much noise about it. If you have your Lazy-boy or sofa as pretty much where you are when listening, it is a no-brainer - you will get the wonderfully detailed micro-dynamics without having to pay the kind of coin usually required for it. As for the size of the sweet spot, I feel confident three people abreast on a standard sofa at 12 feet back would solidly be in it. The sound is still good outside the sweet spot, but the exceptional micro-dynamics/detail is compromised.
High frequency extension. This is hardly a knock against a speaker in this price range, but when I listened to chimes, I recognized it did not have the upper harmonics of the beryllium tweeters that I normally listen to. Trumpets and trombones upper harmonics sounded better than I was used to (when listening to soft domes). This kind of makes sense once I found out these are metal (titanium) domes. Usually metal domes have extension like the Be tweeters, but add some distortion to get it. I think Klipsch may have done something to EQ out the breakup/distortion frequencies (which would likely be horrendous with the horns ability to present micro details), but I am treading way too far into BS wild-assed guessing at this point.

Best applications:
Home theater. Between the excellent dynamics and the fact that you will probably be sitting still (in the sweet spot) when watching, these are excellent speakers for HT!
Music-style. With the dynamics, details, and tightness, this system is exceptional for tight/rhythmic music. Content such as superfast detailed guitar/banjo picking, and impactful music such as Billy Cobham is ideally suited to show off these speakers. Steely Dan is a more mainstream artist that would be well suited for them. I don't mean to infer that they have weaknesses with other styles of music at all; but this music would allow them to stand out as exceptional.
Efficiency. It is no secret that horns are very efficient speakers. If you have a large room, or want to use a low power amp, these are a good option.





I was hoping to find measurements of the RF62-II, particularly the off-axis frequency response. I could not, but came across this review which is reassuring to know others heard about the same things that I did:
http://www.soundvisionreview.com/hi-fi-home-theater/speakers/klipsch-rf-62-ii-review/

I went there to listen to the sub. I was delighted to find speakers that were as tight, impactful, and articulate as these. I never heard the sub, which I see as a good thing. Bass was solid, and I know the sub did that, but the sub maintained these qualities (tight, impactful, and articulate) without ever being it's own voice. That is perfectly what a good sub should do with music (and what the Rythmik E15HP's I normally listen to do, and what the JL Audio E112's fail to do)!
 
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KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Nice write up Kurt, thanks.

Are you going to get whole Klipsch set up? Or a pair of RF-62's? Was the center dynamic?

Here's a link to another review for those that are interested in these speakers.

http://hometheaterreview.com/klipsch-rf-62-floorstanding-loudspeakers-reviewed/
Thanks!

I have given some thought to the idea of a RF62-ii based HT setup; however, I would need to take my Focals over and A-B them directly. The Focals are very tight with a great impulse response. I don't need to get another pair of speakers then discover they don't add anything to my system.
I have no hesitation recognizing the RF62's are very impactful; however, at $300, I wasn't expecting them to be outstanding at anything, and they clearly exceeded my expectations. Ultimately, I don't trust my ability to compare two speakers heard in different rooms with two hours between hearing them.

I am getting a pair of the XS15se to use in my bedroom system. I had been planning on Rythmik F12's ($1705) but with a pair of XS15se on sale for $1350 and free return if I don't like 'em, I have to give them a shot!
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Nice write up Kurt, thanks.

Are you going to get whole Klipsch set up? Or a pair of RF-62's? Was the center dynamic?

Here's a link to another review for those that are interested in these speakers.

http://hometheaterreview.com/klipsch-rf-62-floorstanding-loudspeakers-reviewed/
Interesting - the review you linked said they lacked speed and transparency. I didn't get that, especially the speed part! They also mention a bass bloom down low. That could certainly muddy the mid bass.
If I did get them, I would be crossing them to sub at 80Hz as ATLAudio did, which I believe is why I did not experience that (he told me they were a little muddy before he crossed them)!
 
zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
All ears can tend to hear some things different.

I can live with them if needed for movies - however, not for music.

So, if one likes them - then continue to enjoy them. I understand why
a lot of people do like them.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
All ears can tend to hear some things different.

I can live with them if needed for movies - however, not for music.

So, if one likes them - then continue to enjoy them. I understand why
a lot of people do like them.
I am curious how they sound without Audyssey. I don't know if you read or remember the system I set up for my GF using BS-22's, but after setting it up in my home using my AVR, I realized that it made sense to give her an AVR with Audyssey. The improvement was obvious and worthwhile - a best use of money, even with a $500 budget! I know it is kind of bad form to use Audyssey to fix speakers, but if it works, it works!
If I get back over there, I will see how Pure Direct sounds.
My point is you heard a substantially "different" speaker than I did if you heard them without Audyssey and the 80Hz crossover. We certainly don't have to like the same thing, but don't be too quick to assume that you would not like what I heard.
 
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zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
My point is you heard a substantially "different" speaker than I did if you heard them without Audyssey and the 80Hz crossover. We certainly don't have to like the same thing, but don't be too quick to assume that you would not like what I heard.
I am talking about my ears and my different experiences with Klipsch Reference.
I have been around hearing and owning Klipsch for many years. Also till recently,
still had a local Klipsch dealer in my area.

I am also not a big fan of speaker EQ above 200 hz - I fired all that awhile back.
Just my preference and taste, when it comes to sound - I am not against anyone
liking or using Audyssey.

I do not know if I would have liked what you heard - however, I am happy if you
liked what you heard.:)
 
agarwalro

agarwalro

Audioholic Ninja
Kurt, Did the room have treatments?

Talking of room, why doesn't ATLAudio have his setup in the 'Pros and Joes' section? PM sent.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Kurt, Did the room have treatments?

Talking of room, why doesn't ATLAudio have his setup in the 'Pros and Joes' section? PM sent.
No. However, I would say that it was a good room (not exceptionally live, nor acoustically dead). I know that is not the same thing, but it does make a difference.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
I am also not a big fan of speaker EQ above 200 hz - I fired all that awhile back.
Just my preference and taste, when it comes to sound - I am not against anyone
liking or using Audyssey.
If you ever get the chance, try Audyssey on the PIO BS-22's (if you still have). It might surprise you.
I hope to actually A-B some speakers with vs without Audyssey in the near future, but my current hallucination on the issue is it does little for really good speakers (and may be worse), but can present real world improvements in speakers that have enough room for improvement!
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Nice write up Kurt, thanks.

Are you going to get whole Klipsch set up? Or a pair of RF-62's? Was the center dynamic?

Here's a link to another review for those that are interested in these speakers.

http://hometheaterreview.com/klipsch-rf-62-floorstanding-loudspeakers-reviewed/
I see why they had substantially different things to say. This was the RF-62 model. The ones I heard were the RF-62 ii model. It looks like the tweeter and the crossover were both changed in this model revision.
 
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zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
If you ever get the chance, try Audyssey on the PIO BS-22's (if you still have). It might surprise you.
I hope to actually A-B some speakers with vs without Audyssey in the near future, but my current hallucination on the issue is it does little for really good speakers (and may be worse), but can present real world improvements in speakers that have enough room for improvement!
The Pioneer are gone, and will not come back - since I consider the EOS 150
the better of the two. I will not EQ the EOS - however, I may bump the bass
1 or 2 db at 63 hz on the EOS at times.

All in all I prefer not to use things such as Audyssey - and I prefer that those
tools not stress the speakers around the crossover region of the speaker.

For high quality speakers - if I need to EQ them, then I have made the wrong
decision about the speaker. All in all my main concern is the first reflection point.
The key for me is for the room not to be lively.

Not against Audyssey and such - and not against one who uses it.

However, I am for EQ below 200 hz - due to room modes/bounce of the bass.

The key for me is the speakers I will listen to - that they do not distract me.
 
psbfan9

psbfan9

Audioholic Samurai
I see why they had substantially different things to say. This was the RF-62 model. The ones I heard were the RF-62 ii model. It looks like the tweeter and the crossover were both changed in this model revision.

Ahh, okay. :oops:
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Nice review. I just ordered a pair for HT use.
After a snafu on the RF-62 ii's I ordered, I ended up ordering a pair of RF82 ii's and a RC52 ii. Crutchfield has the RC-52 ii center for $250 if you want a center. I don't think the RF62 ii would have anything on your Salon2's at all, but I do believe it may give you some of the things you love about the Salons without much damage to your wallet (or need to protect from kids, etc). To me, they are impactful and exciting, and that is fun, so why not?
I hope they work well for you!
 
Irvrobinson

Irvrobinson

Audioholic Spartan
After a snafu on the RF-62 ii's I ordered, I ended up ordering a pair of RF82 ii's and a RC52 ii. Crutchfield has the RC-52 ii center for $250 if you want a center. I don't think the RF62 ii would have anything on your Salon2's at all, but I do believe it may give you some of the things you love about the Salons without much damage to your wallet (or need to protect from kids, etc). To me, they are impactful and exciting, and that is fun, so why not?
I hope they work well for you!
The RF-62s aren't intended to compete with the Salon2s; they will be in two separate systems in different rooms, and the RF62s will only be used for movies and tv. Movie and tv sound bears no resemblance to reality anyway, so the stellar accuracy of the Salon2s would be a waste for that use. For $600 I couldn't resist.
 
Irvrobinson

Irvrobinson

Audioholic Spartan
I finally got a chance to set up the HT system in our new home in a 14x13 room. I've been pretty low-end, HT-wise, for a long time. Our previous system was a 40" edge-lit LCD monitor, an Outlaw 975 Prepro, an ATI AT602 amp, and a pair of little JBL bookshelf speakers on stands on a shelf behind the monitor, just peeking out over the top. With the new house my wife wanted an actual HT system, and my only allowed limitation was to hold it to 2.0. (I'm not a surround sound fan.)

The new system consists of a 70" 4K back-lit LCD monitor sitting on a Salamander Sonoma 237 AV cabinet. The Outlaw 975 and the AT602 stayed, and the JBLs were replaced by the RF-62IIs.

I previously had output level problems with the Outlaw prepro. It didn't like to be in combination with the JBLs at about 85db/w/m sensitivity and the AT602 with 28db of gain. On some inputs with some source material we literally ran out of gain. Klipsch says the RF-62IIs have 99db/w/m sensitivity, which I didn't quite believe, but the system gain problems are now completely solved, with average volume control level down at least 10db over the JBL combination.

The AT602 is still dead silent, even with the RF62's high sensitivity. Very impressive. The AT602 isn't a great value anymore given the price reductions in alternatives like the Crowns, but that kind of low noise performance is very nice to have, especially in a small room like mine.

So how does the system sound? Frankly, unbelievably good for speakers I spent $300 each on. The RF62s have a frequency balance that reminds me a lot of B&W 800Ds. Bass with a bit of bloom, a little more bite than one would want for music in the upper mids, very listenable and detailed highs. What some people used to call "Technicolor sound". For music they're not my taste, but for movies and TV the RF62s are very nice. Outstanding speech intelligibility. Movie and TV sound has nothing to do with realism anyway, it's all about excitement and drama, and the RF62s are not only good at that, but they are listenable for hours. Like I said, unbelievable for $300 each. (Yeah, they had a higher MSRP, but since they're discontinued they and other Klipsch models are widely available at close-out prices.)

I was also pleasantly surprised at the bass. They reached cleanly down to about 40Hz. Not bad for two 6.5" woofers, and much better than I expected. I won't be adding a sub, well, one isn't planned. If I succumb to upgraditis in my main system (for no good reason) I might plop down the DD18+ in a choice spot in this system, but I really don't feel the need. We're not into blockbuster action movies much, especially my wife.

And they image well enough I'm not thinking about a center channel either. I was worried I would need one, because Klipsch does not have a reputation for imaging, but it works well enough for voices on a big screen, that you never get the impression a voice is originating from a particular speaker. So these are the exception speakers that break the spend more on speakers rule. Sitting here listening to them while my wife binge-watches Dexter, I'm amazed at what a bargain they were.

At the office, over lunch, I was discussing the choice of Klipsch with a few friends, and two had an immediate negative reaction, mentioning "screechy" highs, and offering expert advice on what I should I have purchased. None of them knew that I'm a little beyond the beginner level in audio. Proof-positive to me that you've got to have an open mind.
 
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KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Glad they worked out for you! For $300 each, there is a heck of a lot to like!

Kind of a shame you don't watch action movies, because that is just what these speakers are really made for, IMHO (when coupled with a decent sub)!

If you want to play around sometime, tow the speakers so they are aimed about 3' in front of the LP. I find this gives great imaging.
I tried this after reading an article on horn speakers. Don't remember where I read the article, but my synopsis is:
1) the horns are a little over bearing if pointed directly at you.
2) If speakers point behind you, and you move from center to right, the sound from the right speaker will dominate (you are moving closer to it and more into the direct "line of fire")
3) If the speakers point in front of you, as you move from center to right, you move closer to the right speaker, but you are moving away from the horn's focal point (and towards the focal point of the far speaker), so the effects cancel each other (to some extent).

What I didn't really expect was for the imaging to be better when sitting still in the LP. I guess it is a reflection of how the reflections in my room are perceived.:)
 
Irvrobinson

Irvrobinson

Audioholic Spartan
Kind of a shame you don't watch action movies, because that is just what these speakers are really made for, IMHO (when coupled with a decent sub)!


Agreed, but I think most action movies are just plain dumb. There's a lot of entertainment in the latest two Star Trek movies, but I get turned off when there are loud noises in space. My bs limit is about at the Interstellar level, and movies like that don't seem to come around very often. Cars that roll over and cause huge explosions. guys that can go for multiple minutes in fist fights without getting bloody knuckles or writhing in pain from landing several punches on someone's jaw, people who can fire a whole clip from a 45mm semi-automatic without ear protection and seem to suffer no effects like terrible ear ringing... I'm just too much into authenticity for the vast majority of action movies. I know, my loss. My wife reminds me of that all the time.
 
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