Help with Projectors and Screen

M

Miketuason

Audioholic Intern
Hi I just bought a mint condition, light used Sony VPL-VW60 Has anyone own one or have any experience with it? Also, unit still in the box and I don't have a screen yet, any recommendation? I prefer motorize.

I have a small room 13'x14' my ceiling is 12 1/2' high, and the distance between my two front speakers is 6' I can not move the speakers back because I only have 1 1/2' to the back wall so the screen has to drop behind the speakers or I can stop it right above the speakers which is 3'8" tall. So what do you guys think? Thanks.
 
J

jostenmeat

Audioholic Spartan
1. Motorized means retractable means tab tensioned means I hope you have a very large budget.

2. I have no idea why you can't spread the speakers further than 6' in a room that is 13 or 14' wide, but assuming that this can't be changed, you should consider the idea of an acoustically transparent screen. I made a very big one for pretty cheap using Seymour fabric. However, with what I guess your viewing distance to be, I imagine you would really enjoy Seymour/Screen Excellence Enlightor 4K. Weave is imperceptible until you get very, very close to it.

We have no idea what's going on in that room, but if you're ok with non-retractable, you can just hide all your speakers behind it, and elevated from the ground, like I did. Start looking for a 3rd identical speaker for your center channel, like I did. Movies will be totally transformed. ;)

But FWIW, Seymour's tab tensioning system seems to be very streamlined, well engineered, compared to some of the competition I've seen.
 
BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
The Sony is over half a decade old, so I sure as heck hope you got one amazing price on that projector as it is SERIOUSLY dated at this point. The LCoS technology in it is very durable, which is good, but you may be looking at the need for a new lamp very soon ($200) and I was extremely unimpressed with the brightness of the Sony projectors that I saw.

Considering a brand new quality model like the Epson 8350 can be had for under $1,500 brand new, with a new lamp, and full manufacturer warranty - you better have gotten a great deal.

Anyway, the recommendations above for a screen are pretty good, but I agree about the 6.5' width... It doesn't make much sense. You should spread the speakers out some or you will have to build a soffit or extension of some sort for a motorized tab-tensioned screen which will be a pricey endeavor.

Kind of seems like a bought first, figure it out later, scenario across the board on this one.

I would consider redoing the room in such a manner that you get the proper space between the speakers if you don't want to invest in a screen with tab-tensioning that will come in front of the speakers and it must be acoustically transparent to do so properly. At 3.5' tall with the speakers, you don't want the screen to be above them, you will really be craning your neck to view the screen.

Finally, your screen size should be based upon you r viewing distance. Just under 10" of diagonal for every foot of viewing distance. So, about 12' viewing distance = about 110" diagonal. Which will be large for that projector if you don't have a screen with some gain to it.

The Seymour screens are awesome and a great way to go, but you really must think hard about doing it right with that setup.

Spread the speakers apart and put a Carada Criterion in Brilliant White up on the wall and it'll run a lot less and work very well.
 
M

Miketuason

Audioholic Intern
Thanks so much, I will definitely look into Seymour's product. About my speakers, unfortunately I can't separate it further apart. The distance from where I sit to the front wall where the screen is going to be is 12' close enough that I don't need a big screen.
 
M

Miketuason

Audioholic Intern
BMXTRIX, I actually got a great deal on this. When it was new, they were selling it for around $5000 but, I only got it for $650.00 I checked the lamp hour on the projector and it says 1500 hours which is about half way used. Here are the specs:

Product Specifications

Contrast: 35,000:1.

ANSI lumens: 900

Light engine: Three SXRD panels, 1920x1080 native resolution.

Connection panel: Two HDMI ports, one VGA, one 3-RCA component video, one composite video, one S-video, one serial port, one 12V relay.

Video Compatibility: 480i, 480p, 576i, 576p, 720p, 1080i, 1080p/24/50/60

Zoom lens and throw distance: 1.8x powered zoom/focus lens. Powered vertical lens shift.

Lamp life: Anticipated 2000 hours in full power mode, 3000 hours in low power mode.

Replacement lamp price: $350

More specs here: VPL-VW60 | BRAVIA SXRD 1080p Home Theater Projector | Sony | Sony Store USA
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Warlord
Thanks so much, I will definitely look into Seymour's product. About my speakers, unfortunately I can't separate it further apart. The distance from where I sit to the front wall where the screen is going to be is 12' close enough that I don't need a big screen.
Sure, you don't NEED a big screen, but I can tell you from personal experience that sitting 10.5' from a 120" screen is pretty fantastic.
 
BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
Thanks so much, I will definitely look into Seymour's product. About my speakers, unfortunately I can't separate it further apart. The distance from where I sit to the front wall where the screen is going to be is 12' close enough that I don't need a big screen.
If you are using a front projector and trying to recreate a 'center of the theater' feel in your home, then your screen size should be a 110" diagonal 16:9 screen. That is not a 'large' screen by any means when talking about front projection, it is, in fact - the proper size screen.
 
BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
BMXTRIX, I actually got a great deal on this. When it was new, they were selling it for around $5000 but, I only got it for $650.00 I checked the lamp hour on the projector and it says 1500 hours which is about half way used.
Unfortuantely, you really did not get a good deal on this projector.

It's like getting excited because you only paid $500 for a computer which cost $3,000+ just 7 years ago. A 7 year old PC is replaced by a brand new $700 laptop which is faster and offers more with a new warranty. These technologies get hit with serious degradation in value once they are in use and the path for technology improvement in the last half decade has been significant. There are brand new projectors which are 1080p and run right around $800. 3D models with better specifications coming in around $1,500. So, about $300-$400 would have been a 'great' price since the lamp will need to be replaced shortly. $700 or so WITH a brand new lamp would have also been a good deal.

Worth looking at:
Top 10 Home Theater Projectors

At 1,500 hours I would expect that you may (MAY) get 500-1000 hours of use from the current lamp, but generally people should budget for a new lamp at 1,000 hours due to the significant degradation of light output from the lamps as they age. In simplest terms - the lamp really is past its prime, even if it still works, it should be replaced to get a bright vibrant image on screen at some point sooner rather than later.

The Sony is still a good projector, but I'm not sure how you did your research before makng the purchase. It is not one that I think I would have recommended considering the options out there.
 
M

Miketuason

Audioholic Intern
This is what I have and what I'm dealing with, as you can see I can not move my speaker any further. I spoke to the guy from Seymour Screen, he said the 4K may not work properly because the room need to be very dark or have a high lumens projector, mine says ANSI Lumens 900 as you can see the spec above. So, anymore screen recommendation.
 

Attachments

BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
This is what I have and what I'm dealing with, as you can see I can not move my speaker any further. I spoke to the guy from Seymour Screen, he said the 4K may not work properly because the room need to be very dark or have a high lumens projector, mine says ANSI Lumens 900 as you can see the spec above. So, anymore screen recommendation.
1. Move your gear, move your speakers further out. You certainly have no reason to have a huge audio tower in there, and you could easily put it in a credenza under the screen.

2. Front projection is something of a commitment. Some time spent working on the room can drastically improve the quality of the final result. In a completely dark room (dark paint, dark ceiling, dark carpet, night viewing) your end result is better than your typical movie theater.

3. If you OWN this home, then why not set the room up the way it should be?

4. If you just want to give this a try, then get a cheap manual screen to try it. Check eBay or Craigslist for a screen and try things out... or make something yourself. Paint a piece of MDF (or similar) white and try it out.

If this were my space, I would put all the equipment either in a console under the screen, or I would remove it completely from the front of the room. Spread the speakers out to the corners and move the sub about 1/3 in from the end of the wall. I would paint the room a dark color (blue, red, green, grey, etc.) as well as the ceiling. At some point I would go with dark carpet to match. Get some really good light blocking curtains for the windows to allow me to close them and use the projector during the daytime if I wanted. Then, I would hang the TV on the wall and go with a 110" diagonal DaLite tab tensioned screen with high contrast cinema vision material and mount it so it would drop down in front of the TV on the wall.

If you don't own the home, then a cheap manual screen on L brackets in front of the TV would be about as far as I would go.

I've been doing front projection for about 15 years now, and I've pretty much done everything I just listed above, and I've had my room setup like yours before. It's a night and day difference setting things up properly.
 
J

jostenmeat

Audioholic Spartan
Let's say your speakers are 10" deep or so. You say 1.5' from these to back wall. That means an AT screen in front is already at least about 2.5' from the back wall. Accounting for thickness of your noggin, let's pretend your eyeballs are 2' from back wall. (Further would likely be better for audio, btw.)

You never specified which wall was 13' (or did I miss it), but let's pretend that's length. 13 - 2.5 - 2 = 8.5' only. This means that even a very modest screen of 76" (16:9) will give you a 36 deg viewing angle. After much playing around, I prefer 42, and wouldn't change a thing myself, and if you were like me that would still be relatively modest at 90". I think poster above might be around 45 deg or so.

But let's say you get further away from the back wall to improve your audio situation. All of a sudden, the screen needs to be smaller and smaller. Anyway, I think you get my point; your need for lumens might not be as bad as it sometimes is with others who are looking for considerably larger screens.

Tools for you:
Viewing Distance Calculator

TV Calculator

Using the second tool, I could tell you that you that the PJ would only need 71% of the brightness on the 76" screen, to match what it would normally do on the 90" (which is already considered modest, btw). For example the larger 90" here would only need 67% of the brightness on what it can normally do on the 110".

I don't think you got as hosed as BMX might think you did, I think it might be a decent projector for that money, assuming it's been well cared for, with relatively low hours (which you probably don't know, lamp timer probably gets reset each time, and I agree that you are extremely unrealistic about lamp hours). It was a direct competitor to my own projector, the RS1, not quite as bright, but probably a little quiter as a result. I don't think you would call it a screaming deal either, but there might be value here IMO. Though if you had more play money, of course I'd vote for new as well, but you have to pay to play. Seeing McIntosh gear up front, I'm thinking you could probably have swung a new one if you wanted too, but whatever. Also, it's not quite 7 years old either. It was introduced at CEDIA in the fall of 2007, which means consumers in the US weren't really picking them up in earnest until 2008, which is only 4 years ago. Sort of.

Darken the room some, I think you'll be ok. Chris Seymour said "may" for a reason, but you could say that about any darn screen.

Definitely get anything with a light on it away from the front. The alternative to moving the rack would be to instead switch the couch over to the front wall, making it the new back wall, with the rack on your side. Hey the HDMI run will be shorter if the PJ is close to the rack I suppose. EVEN THEN, I highly recommend doing the following: putting each component display to minimum brightness, liberal use of window tint on these displays just don't cover IR sensors, and even the use of black tape if need be. You know, just one little tiny uncontrolled light source like a night light, candle, whatever, so dramatically decreases the PQ level, it's like the difference between a $2,000 projector, and $10,000 projector. In the case of the projector world, the room truly is the end all be all, in a way.

If you do go with a solid screen, the Carada that BMX suggests happens to be Seymour's preferred solid screen for the money, FWIW, and that says something.

Well- do you need a different screen than (insert any brand here) due to the lumens? It sure is possible, but that depends on your light control inside the room, and the size of the screen. They are equally important for your intents and purposes.
 
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