If you are a member of AES, then get this reprint: - 3693, Leebrugen and Scott.
I am not a member, but what is his credential? I have no idea what his paper deals with, it may or may not be relevant to what we are talking about here.
There is extensive mathematical analysis and measurement.
Extensive does not mean correct. You can google, and I have, and found all sorts of analysis, and I found a few bogus analysis. Besides, may be the author of that article deals with something different than what I am talking about. For example, if he tried, and sucessfully proved there is no audible benefits, then I have nothing to disagree with him about. If he tried to prove biwire is electrically same as running two parallel pairs from the amp terminals to the speaker terminals without removing the speaker terminal jumpers than I have problem with it.
The upshot of no benefit to bi-wiring. And it bi-wiring is a long jumper, you can see that clearly it is from that data.
As I said, I was not debating whether there is no benefits. I heard no improvements myself. My point is, if you understand basic electrical theory you would not made, and then insist of it as equivalent to a long jumper. Electrically speaking it is not, regardless of the impedance of the wire, it is the crossover at the speaker end that makes the signa (contents) different in the wires.
If you soldered speaker wires to the midpoint of the jumper between the terminals and extrude it back to amp you have just that situation.
It is hard to understand what you are saying without a sketch.
The resistance of the cable to the high pass we will make R1 and the resistance to the low pass crossover R2. R1 will be the same as R2. Now the current in the high pass filter will be less as it takes less power, so the amplitude reduction of the signal to the high pass filter will be less than to the low pass filter.
The high pass will pass mostly high frequency signals so the signal current flow in this wire will be mostly of high frequencies.
Now even with speaker cable resistance of half an ohm, the authors found that the amplitude difference was less than 0.1 db. The linearity of the signal was unaffected, whether R1 and R2 were paralleled. In other words using a single wire pair of half the resistance of a bi-wired pair.
I have no idea why the author talked about these things. People that I communicated to before, such as B&W, talked only about the difference in signal contents in the two pair of wires, not overall amplitude of the current.
Blinded listening tests were done using experience listeners also, and no difference could be detected between the standard and bi-wire configuration.
The conclusion was that bi-wiring conferred no benefit.
Again, you will get argument from me on this so I guess we are not in total disagreement. Our disagreement is on the theoretical (electrical) side.
So I think I'm entitled to call it bogus, and so you have to provide credible data and a mathematical basis for benefit.
Of course you are entitled to call it bogus, me too (I can almost agree with you on this). I am also entitled to be disappointed when you stated that it is the same as a long jumper .........thing. It is bogus in the SQ benefit claim but no electrically speaking, that's all I am saying. I had provided some theoretical explanations in the past, so has jneutron. There is no need for me to provide credible data. The theory is in most college/university electrical circuit theory text books. It is simple enough that a quantitative analysis with hard numbers serve no purpose. That being said, however basic the theories are involved in such analysis, it does go beyond the commonly cited Ohm's law, so either someone starts reading up on the basic principles of electricity, or he/she has to have a reasonably sound background in electrical circuit theory.
I can completely understand how so much hearsays manage to entrench on all sorts of forums. What I cannot understand is that people who are seemingly knowledgeable in this fields got stuck in those hearsays as well. All they need to do is to sit down and really do their only circuit analysis. You obviously knows how filters work, and presumably you know Ohms law, Superpostion theorem, Kirchoff's law and Thevenin's theorem among others, so you should be able to figure out that in the biwire configuration, one pair of wire will carry mostly high frequency signals and the other will carry mostly low frequency signals. In your so called long jumper scenario (assuming you are not removing the jumpers at the biwirable speaker terminals), the signals in the two pair of wires should be almost identical so it will in fact be almost the same as running one pair of thicker cable of the same total X-section area of the two pair of wires (long jumpers).
This topic has been dealt with to the nth degree, yet I still failed to resist responding this time mainly because I didn't think you were involved in those lengthy posts a couple of years ago. Regardless, if I can't change you mind now I never will, so I should let it go and move on.
