Denon AVR-5805 Audyssey MultEQ XT

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agular

Junior Audioholic
I need some information about the Audyssey MultEQ XT front panel display light. The owners manual indicates that after you complete the EQ setup, the EQ indicator light on the front panel lights up green, then the owners manual indicates the if a change is made to the EQ the light changes color to red. Now my question is, the EQ indicator light light up green only when a Dolby Digital source is being played, but when a two channel stereo source is played the light turns to red, Also the light is red when playing Dolby Pro logic IIx and Dolby EX. is this the way it is supposed function? and if not what do i need to do to get it to work properly.
 
A

agular

Junior Audioholic
Help with EQ setup ?

Doesn't anybody out there have a Denon AVR-5805?
I have tried contacting Denon Via Email on three different occasions without a response. I also spoke with customer support they where unable to answer this question. I was hoping someone out there would have an answer.
 
Geno

Geno

Senior Audioholic
The way I understand it, if you calibrate your system with Audyssey and just leave the settings alone, the light stays green. If you modify any of the automatic settings (like speaker size, distance, etc.) the light will turn red - indicating a change. The Dolby Digital or DTS decoding are independent of Audyssey processing.
 
A

agular

Junior Audioholic
The owner manual indiactes the after you run the Audyssey
 
A

agular

Junior Audioholic
The owner manual indicates the after you run the Audyssey EQ the front panel indicator light will light up green then the manual indicates if a change is made to the EQ setting the light changes to red. What I am saying is that I am "NOT changing any of my EQ seatings" and the light lights up green when playing a Dolby Digital format BUT when playing a CD, or Dolby Pro-logic IIx, or Dolby Digital EX, the front panel light is red. What I am trying to find out is the system supposed to work this way. Some how I was under the impression that the front panel indicator light would stay green no mater what format is played.
 
Jase

Jase

Junior Audioholic
The EQ indicator will be green if you select Audyssey as the EQ setting but will be red for the other EQ settings (Flat, Front, Manual) even if you haven't changed any of the channel levels etc. Doublecheck what EQ mode you're in by either pressing the STATUS or ROOM EQ buttons on the front panel.

You can assign different EQ modes to different decoding modes e.g Audyssey for Dolby Digital + PLIIx Cine, Flat for Dolby PLIIx Music etc etc. You need to make sure that you have the Room EQ Setup in the main Auto EQ/Setup Menu set to ASSIGN though.
 
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Nick250

Audioholic Samurai
The owner manual indicates the after you run the Audyssey EQ the front panel indicator light will light up green then the manual indicates if a change is made to the EQ setting the light changes to red. What I am saying is that I am "NOT changing any of my EQ seatings" and the light lights up green when playing a Dolby Digital format BUT when playing a CD, or Dolby Pro-logic IIx, or Dolby Digital EX, the front panel light is red. What I am trying to find out is the system supposed to work this way. Some how I was under the impression that the front panel indicator light would stay green no mater what format is played.
I have a 3806, I'll check it out later. The 5805 may do it differently though.
 
B

blekenbleu

Enthusiast
Doesn't anybody out there have a Denon AVR-5805?
My MKII stays red for all inputs with 2 or 5.1 channels,
but I changed the crossovers after calibration. My understanding
is that Audyssey continues to function..

If I recall correctly, the light stayed green for all inputs before
I changed crossovers.
 
gene

gene

Audioholics Master Chief
Administrator
My MKII stays red for all inputs with 2 or 5.1 channels,
but I changed the crossovers after calibration. My understanding
is that Audyssey continues to function..

If I recall correctly, the light stayed green for all inputs before
I changed crossovers.
The light will only remain green if you don't alter any parameters which were calibrated in the auto setup such as level trim, delay settings, speaker size, etc. If you alter any of these, the light will turn red but you can still engage the Audyssey correction curve.
 
A

agular

Junior Audioholic
??? Green Red ????

I was able to finally get a response from Denon. They are still trying to get me an answer, as of now after about three emails I still don't have an answer.
Let me try this again.
DOES THE EQ INDICATOR LIGHT ON THE FRONT PANEL OF THE AVR-5805, LIGHT UP "GREEN" ONLY WHEN PLAYING A DOLBY DIGITAL 5.1 FORMATE? THIS SEEMS TO BE THE CASE BECAUSE THIS IS HOW MY UNIT IS FUNCTIONING AT THIS MOMENT. If not how am I to get it to function with "Green" indicator light when playing other formates Stereo, Dolby EX, Dolby PL-IIx? As I mentioned The light is green therefor no changes have been made to Eq for it be red red with 5.1.
 
gene

gene

Audioholics Master Chief
Administrator
I was able to finally get a response from Denon. They are still trying to get me an answer, as of now after about three emails I still don't have an answer.
Let me try this again.
DOES THE EQ INDICATOR LIGHT ON THE FRONT PANEL OF THE AVR-5805, LIGHT UP "GREEN" ONLY WHEN PLAYING A DOLBY DIGITAL 5.1 FORMATE? THIS SEEMS TO BE THE CASE BECAUSE THIS IS HOW MY UNIT IS FUNCTIONING AT THIS MOMENT. If not how am I to get it to function with "Green" indicator light when playing other formates Stereo, Dolby EX, Dolby PL-IIx? As I mentioned The light is green therefor no changes have been made to Eq for it be red red with 5.1.
You likely don't have it set to "Audyssey" for all modes of operation or have custom bass management set for different modes. Check both of these.
 
A

agular

Junior Audioholic
Audyssey

The setup menu has two options "ALL" and "assign" the unit is set to "ALL".I am not to sure what you mean by low frequency settings. The low frequency settings are set to, Low frequency plus mains.You also can cycle through by remote or via the front panel the EQ on each input Audyssey, Front ,Flat, and Manual. All inputes are set to Audyssey.
 
Jase

Jase

Junior Audioholic
As I mentioned before. Change the setting from ALL to ASSIGN and you can then freely assign which EQ mode you want to each listening mode etc. E.g. Audyssey for Dolby Digital, Flat for Dolby PLIIx Music etc etc.

Seems that the UK/Euro version of the 5805 (the A1XV) works differently with regards to the EQ indicator light. The EQ indicator is green when Audyssey EQ is engaged but red when Flat or Front are used. If any settings are changed then the indicator also goes red for the Audyssey mode.
 
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A

agular

Junior Audioholic
Audyssey

I will have to assume that my Denon AVR 5805 EQ indicator light is working as the manufacture has intended, based on the information I have received so far, as it seems nobody really know for sure if the Audyssey light is green “ONLY” when a Dolby Digital 5.1 format is being played. This would be my logic First: No one has told me otherwise. Two: No changes have been made to the Audyssey after the initial setup. Three: The indicator light “DOES LIGHT UP GREEN” when playing a Dolby Digital 5.1 format. I am aware that when the Audyssey indicator light is red the QE is operating. Somehow I was confused because the owner’s manual indicated that if the indicator light was “RED” a change to the Audyssey Parameters had been made, and this is not the case WOW. Thank you everybody for your input I will just enjoy my Great sounding Denon as it is now.
 
N

Nick250

Audioholic Samurai
A brief observation, last night when I was listening to music on the radio in 2.1 mode. The red Audyssey was on indicating that Audyssey EQ was engaged, but that I had modified some settings after I ran Audyssey auto eq. In my case this ment I had set all my speakers to small and crossed them over at 80 Hz after I ran Audyssey. The red light is on 100% of the time unless I turn off Audyssey or run the reciver in pure direct, though I have not acutually tested pure direct.

For those who are new to Audyssey, a while back, Chris from Audyssey posted this FAQ over at AVS.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7969145#post7969145

• The microphone has been calibrated for grazing incidence and so it must point to the ceiling during calibration. Any other orientation will produce incorrect results.

• The microphone response has been calibrated to match (on average) the response of an industry-standard ¼” instrumentation microphone. It is critical to use the microphone that came with the receiver and not one from another model that may have a different calibration curve.

• It is also important to place the microphone on a tripod or other stand so that it is at ear height. We strongly recommend against holding the microphone in your hand because this can give rise to low frequency handling noise that will cause the MultEQ filters to compensate by cutting those frequencies. Furthermore, it is not recommended to place the microphone on the back of the couch or recliner. If a tripod is used, care must be taken to ensure that the microphone is placed at a height just above the seat back so that reflections from the seat do not cause problems at higher frequencies.

• The first microphone position is used to calculate the distances to each loudspeaker and subwoofer and set the delays. It is also used to measure and set the trims. So, it is important to place the microphone in the main listening seat for the first measurement.

• MultEQ measures the background noise level in the room before playing the test signal from each speaker. For the measurements to be valid, the signal to noise ratio must be above a certain threshold. If it is not, the test signal from that speaker will repeat at a higher level. If the noise in the room happens to be higher during some of the speaker measurements, then the test signals from those speakers will sound louder than the test signals from the other speakers. This does not affect the calculation of trim levels. If the room noise is too high even after the test signals increase in level, then an error message will be displayed warning the user that measurements can not be completed.

• After the first position is measured, MultEQ measures other positions in the room around the listening area. These do not necessarily have to be in each individual seat. The idea is to capture as many points around the listening area as possible so that the acoustical problems that affect the quality of sound within that area are minimized.

• For example, we recommend taking 3 positions on the couch facing the TV and then 3 more positions about 3 feet in front of the couch and parallel to the first three. Measurements up against the back or side walls should be avoided.

• Some loudspeakers have rather problematic responses when measured off-axis (i.e. more than 15° away from the imaginary straight line that points to the listening position). In these systems, measurements taken too far away from the center line will show a reduced high-frequency response that may result in overcorrection and thus overly bright sound. Although it is difficult to predict which type of loudspeaker will have these off-axis problems we have most often observed them in poorly-designed multiple-driver arrays that exhibit very high off-axis lobing. In these situations we recommend a tighter calibration pattern centered around the main listening position and making sure that the mic is not placed in extreme locations and certainly not outside the plane of the front main speakers.

Checking the Results

• Once MultEQ calibration is complete the results are stored in the receiver memory.

• It is important to activate MultEQ by selecting one of the target curves. This is not performed by default after the calibration is finished and must be selected by the user. In a THX system we recommend using the “Flat” setting that allows the re-equalization to work as intended. In other systems, we recommend “Audyssey” for movie playback and “Flat” for music playback. Unfortunately, the music industry does not have any mixing standards like the movie industry so some music program material may sound better with the “Audyssey” setting. “Front Align” also uses the Audyssey process, but it does not apply the filters to the two front loudspeakers. “Manual” is not an Audyssey setting and does not use MultEQ filters. It is a simple parametric equalizer and will be subject to all the limitations that come with parametric EQ.

• Small vs. Large speakers. This is the most commonly discussed topic by MultEQ users. The first thing to understand is that it is not a personal insult to your system if your speakers were detected as “Small”. It simply means, that in the room they were measured the – 3 dB point was detected at 80 Hz or above. This may happen even if the manufacturer’s spec shows that the speaker is capable of playing lower. In fact, there are several benefits at crossing the speakers over at 80 Hz that have to do with power handling and headroom in the bass region that will be handled by the subwoofer amplifier.

• The second most common question also relates to Small vs. Large. In the Denon receivers, MultEQ will designate as “Large” any speaker that has a –3 dB point below 80 Hz. For non-THX speaker systems this is an arbitrary definition that often causes confusion. All it means is that the speaker will not be bass managed unless the user tells it to be. Because Audyssey is not in charge of bass management, we have to abide by the manufacturers’ rules and simply report the information found by the measurements to the bass management system.

• In situations where the speakers do not play significantly below 80 Hz, an additional step must be taken to make sure that there is no loss of bass information. The user must set the speaker to Small manually so that bass management is performed properly.

• Polarity: MultEQ checks the absolute polarity of each loudspeaker and reports it to the user. This is simply a report and does not affect the subsequent calculations in any way. It just asks you to check the wiring to make sure it is connected properly to each speaker. Sometimes we get false alarms. This is usually because the speaker has a driver (usually the mid-range driver) wired out-of-phase intentionally to make up for some problems at the crossover region. If a phase warning is shown, it is not a cause of alarm. Simply check the cables and hit “Skip” if everything is fine. Again, this does not have any effect on the EQ results.

• Subwoofer distance: in many active subwoofers it is not possible to defeat the low-pass filtering. That means that the pre-pro bass management filters will be on top of the low-pass filters inside the subwoofer. The built-in low-filters introduce a delay to the signal coming in (because they have poles). This delay is seen by MultEQ as acoustical delay and is reported in the results. That is why sometimes the subwoofer distance is reported to be longer than the physical measured distance. The setting should not be changed because the blend between the sub and the satellites has been designed based on this time delay.

• The design constraints for MultEQ were that it (1) must fit within a small portion of the DSP so that other processes can also run and (2) it must use FIR filters because of the well-known artifacts that IIR filters cause particularly in the time domain response. As it turns out, these two requirements are contradicting. In order for FIR filters to be effective and capable of correcting to low frequencies, they must consist of several thousand coefficients (taps). The problem is that the CPU power required increases with the number of taps, hence the dilemma. What we did at Audyssey was to come up with a different way to partition the frequency axis so that we can use fewer taps and yet not completely give up on low frequency resolution (and therefore low frequency correction). This allows us to take a 512 tap filter that would normally have a resolution of 94 Hz (meaning that any peak or dip narrower than 94 Hz would be missed) and significantly improve its resolving power. The resolution of the filter actually varies continuously with frequency and starts at around 10 Hz. Does this mean that MultEQ can correct an arbitrarily narrow peak or dip at 30 Hz? Of course not. The reality is that in the MultEQ XT version found in receivers, we can correct broader features below 100 Hz better than narrow ones. For example, a lump that is half an octave wide at 50 Hz can be fixed. A narrow dip or peak that is 1/3 or 1/6 octaves wide and centered at 30 Hz will be improved, but not eliminated.

• The on-screen display in the receiver has very limited graphics. Therefore it is not possible to really show what the MultEQ correction filter is doing at all frequencies. It appears to only be operating on 9 bands like a parametric equalizer, but this is not the case. What is shown is a very crude approximation to the MultEQ correction and it should not be used to read exact values of cut or boost at the 9 frequencies shown.

• Furthermore, there is no display for the subwoofer filter. This doesn’t mean that there is no subwoofer correction. It was not added to the display because of interface and memory considerations.
 
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