Connecting a Graphic EQ to Receiver Without "Tape 2 Loop"...Possible?

[Matt34]

Indeed -- my receiver, as I have been telling you Walter (not sure why you didn't just believe me) does not have AMP IN jacks and I never even heard of that until now; given this, I don't know how to run an EQ through this system...

You are not going to be able to EQ for all sources if you don't have an external amplifier in the chain. Which has been answered already.

If you have an external amp, it would go AVR via pre-outs/EQ/Amp/Speakers

I don't understand why every thread you create turns into multiple page threads of people giving you answers but you refusing to knowledge them.

 

[walter duque]

[

What about utilizing the standard "TAPE" ins/outs of the receiver? Can't I, as I have been asking, run the EQ in and out through this RCA interface of the receiver and then run the TASCAM CD recorder through the EQ's ins and outs?[/QUOTE]
Let me try this again. Are you trying to record onto the CD recorder using the EQ? Or are you trying to use the CD recorder as a source?

 

[PearlcorderS701]

No, because your receiver does not have a real Tape loop, what we used to call a Tape Monitor. I am including the block diagram or your selector below. You will see that the Tape Out is whatever is selected in the main zone, and if you select Tape In, well your Tape Out will only be the Tape In... (You DO have a main zone pre-out, it's just outside the diagram.)

I realize the classic term and reference was "Tape Monitor" -- I have used countless numbers of integrated amps and receivers over the years that carried this "feature"; I was just unsure if the standard TAPE connections could be used to do the same thing...

Why couldn't the EQ run through the TAPE IN/OUT (as seen in varying diagrams of the back of the 8555) and then the CD recorder -- which would normally be connected into TAPE in my case -- run through the EQ's IN/OUT? This wouldn't "act" as a monitor loop of some kind?

Another option against which there are 50 valid reasons, is to use a secondary receiver as your selector and phono preamp. ITS Tape Out could feed your EQ, then your EQ could go in your CD IN. You loose remote capability for the selector, but you get everything else you want. Any old receiver would work.

I don't even have a secondary receiver to try this with; doesn't sound like something even worth attempting anyway.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Let me try this again. Are you trying to record onto the CD recorder using the EQ? Or are you trying to use the CD recorder as a source?

No, Walter -- the EQ I am trying to incorporate into this system has nothing to do with me wanting "EQ'ed" recordings on my CD recorder; it's so difficult to explain via words on an online forum...sighhhhh...let me try and break it down:

I just like the sound of "EQ'ed" sources -- no matter what's connected to my receiver i.e. turntable, tuner (built in) or CD -- and so I wanted to add a stereo graphic EQ to my TX-8555. However, this particular model has no TAPE 2 LOOP/MONITOR feature, which is where an EQ would normally connect through, only a "TAPE" input selector. Normally, this TAPE selector would be where a RECORDING device would go through -- in my case, a TASCAM CD recorder.

Now, what I was asking was, if I instead use the receiver's TAPE IN/OUT interface to connect an EQ with -- that is, the EQ would go to appropriate IN/OUT of the TAPE connections on the receiver (instead of the CD recorder) -- and then feed the CD recorder into the back of the EQ and run it in a "loop" like that, could it all still work...

In other words:

EQ IN/OUT > RECEIVER'S "TAPE" IN/OUT
CD RECORDER IN/OUT > BACK OF EQ, "TAPE IN/OUT" OR "MONITOR"

 

[jeannot]

Why couldn't the EQ run through the TAPE IN/OUT (as seen in varying diagrams of the back of the 8555) and then the CD recorder -- which would normally be connected into TAPE in my case -- run through the EQ's IN/OUT? This wouldn't "act" as a monitor loop of some kind?

I guess I failed to communicate why your receiver does not have a tape monitor. Tape IN is just a normal input for your receiver. When selected, its signal goes to Tape Out. Not your CD, not your phono signal, just the Tape IN goes to Tape Out. If the EQ is connected to Tape Out and you select CD, then the Tape out would output the CD output, and you have no way to listen to the output of your EQ. If you then select Tape IN to listen to your EQ, then you just changed its input from CD to Tape, which is effectively itself and your EQ lost the CD.
Tape Monitors used to let you select a source, output it to Tape Out, then listen to your Tape IN without impacting the output of Tape Out.

I apologize if you already knew some of this, sometimes I write more just so i can understand what I write.

 

[walter duque]

Stereodude kind of summed it up in post 2#.

 

[jeannot]

Stereodude kind of summed it up in post 2#.

Even an external amp would not solve the problem, because he does not want (neither would I) the EQ after the volume control.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I guess I failed to communicate why your receiver does not have a tape monitor. Tape IN is just a normal input for your receiver. When selected, its signal goes to Tape Out. Not your CD, not your phono signal, just the Tape IN goes to Tape Out. If the EQ is connected to Tape Out and you select CD, then the Tape out would output the CD output, and you have no way to listen to the output of your EQ. If you then select Tape IN to listen to your EQ, then you just changed its input from CD to Tape, which is effectively itself and your EQ lost the CD.
Tape Monitors used to let you select a source, output it to Tape Out, then listen to your Tape IN without impacting the output of Tape Out.

I apologize if you already knew some of this, sometimes I write more just so i can understand what I write.

Jeeeeeeeeez....

What's scary is, some of this is actually coming back...

Okay -- so using the standard, normal "TAPE" input of the receiver won't work, in a nutshell, huh?

I suppose all that leaves me is running the source through the EQ and then to the receiver -- but that will only let me hear EQ'ed audio of that particular source, which is not what I was after. I wanted to EQ every source connected -- including low-quality FM and Phono signals. It's disheartening that I am truly SOL here...

 

[walter duque]

Even an external amp would not solve the problem, because he does not want (neither would I) the EQ after the volume control.

Any EQ or Dynamic Rage expander does loop after the pre amp out.

 

[markw]

As simple and beautiful as a ball bearing, and just as dense...

I don't really know if you're really this dense, starved for adult attention, or simply a troll, but I'll give this a stab.

To INSERT an equalizer into a circuit, one must ave the ability to

1) take the line level signal out of the receiver's signal path, and then

2) INSERT the equalizer into the circuit and then, finally

3) RETURN the equalized signal BACK into the receiver's signal path.

This was happily controlled in days of old by tape MONITOR LOOPS. These were controlled by a switch on the front panel which would either keep the signal in the receiver or, when pushed, send it OUT of the receiver's signal path via the "tape out" and BACK INTO the receiver's signal path through the tape input.

You knew you had a "tape monitor loop" on your unit when you pushed the tape monitor button with no equalizer and the signal disappeared.

Simply having a tape out and a tape in does not mean you have the required "monitor loop", just two unrelated inputs and outputs.

Now, does your receiver have a "tape monitor" button on front, or not? If not, you're boned. Quitcher whining, man up, get over it, and move on.

 

[jeannot]

Okay -- so using the standard, normal "TAPE" input of the receiver won't work, in a nutshell, huh?

Right.

I suppose all that leaves me is running the source through the EQ and then to the receiver -- but that will only let me hear EQ'ed audio of that particular source, which is not what I was after. I wanted to EQ every source connected -- including low-quality FM and Phono signals. It's disheartening that I am truly SOL here...

Well, if you happen to know a technician, a Tape Monitor is really nothing more than a DPDT switch and a pair of RCA jacks inserted in the current circuit - about $10 worth of parts. You can PM me for a diagram targeting your receiver.

Good luck.

 

[jeannot]

Any EQ or Dynamic Rage expander does loop after the pre amp out.

You are correct they do, but not good for recording because your amp volume affects the recorder input. And when not tamed by a volume control, all the EQ background noise makes it 100% to the amp.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I don't really know if you're really this dense, starved for adult attention, or simply a troll, but I'll give this a stab.

To INSERT an equalizer into a circuit, one must ave the ability to

1) take the line level signal out of the receiver's signal path, and then

2) INSERT the equalizer into the circuit and then, finally

3) RETURN the equalized signal BACK into the receiver's signal path.

This was happily controlled in days of old by tape MONITOR LOOPS. These were controlled by a switch on the front panel which would either keep the signal in the receiver or, when pushed, send it OUT of the receiver's signal path via the "tape out" and BACK INTO the receiver's signal path through the tape input.

You knew you had a "tape monitor loop" on your unit when you pushed the tape monitor button with no equalizer and the signal disappeared.

Simply having a tape out and a tape in does not mean you have the required "monitor loop", just two unrelated inputs and outputs.

Now, does your receiver have a "tape monitor" button on front, or not? If not, you're boned. Quitcher whining, man up, get over it, and move on.

Normally, I wouldn't have even responded to this kind of ridiculous, cruel intentioned and spirited comment, but I felt it necessary because you're just being a total ****, and you know it -- let me make something absolutely sparkling clear to you: I'm NOT a troll. I'm NOT dense. I'm not STARVED FOR ATTENTION BECAUSE I ASKED FOR ASSISTANCE ABOUT A GRAPHIC EQ AND HOW IT COULD CONNECT TO MY SETUP. And these questions have NOTHING TO DO WITH "MANNING UP" -- THAT'S JUST ASININE. I'm not WHINING, either -- I'm trying to eliminate EVERY POSSIBILITY REGARDING USING AN EQ IN THIS SYSTEM BY ASKING QUESTIONS ON A FORUM. Sometimes someone else has a solution another group may not have thought of.

No, there's no Tape Monitor loop on this receiver (TAPE 2), so that's why I wanted to know if there was any way to make the TAPE input/output work, as I did not know that ONLY a "monitor" type switch could be used, exclusively. I was searching for any other way to introduce an EQ into the setup, outside of running it between one source and the receiver (which I don't want to do because I want EVERY source equalized).

I've been on this forum long enough for you to know that I'm not a troll -- do me a favor and keep those asinine comments about me being "dense" (looks like I found yet another candidate for my "ignore" list as you're taking a page from other likeminded cruel members here) and "needing attention" to yourself, because that's simply NOT TRUE.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Right.

Well, if you happen to know a technician, a Tape Monitor is really nothing more than a DPDT switch and a pair of RCA jacks inserted in the current circuit - about $10 worth of parts. You can PM me for a diagram targeting your receiver.

Good luck.

Unfortunately, the last half of your response here leaves me with no answer; I don't personally know a technician who could pull this off.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

BTW,

Thanks to the complete douche bag who continues to go into my "reputation" protocols, COMPLETELY ANONYMOUSLY (you KNOW who you are) and makes nasty, cruel comments about me, dropping red chicklet after red chicklet just out of personal spite at this point -- I have a feeling I know who this is, but I find it so humorous that someone tells me to "man up" and then there are suddenly ANONYMOUS comments without a name attached to them in my reputation comment area...no, that's not HYPOCRITICAL, AT ALL.

Continuing to hide behind an anonymous comment system is real productive; my hat's off to you, pal. For the record, I was seriously -- without malice or negative intention -- attempting to discover if there was another way to run this EQ through my setup as-is. You want to think otherwise? Be my guest.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Walter:

Did my explanation of what I want to do with the EQ make more sense? You had asked if I wanted to use the CD recorder in the loop, etc...I had explained how I wanted to run it; do you have any more feedback?

Thanks.

 

[markw]

You're welcome for the educaton, which you sorely needed.

Normally, I wouldn't have even responded to this kind of ridiculous, cruel intentioned and spirited comment, but I felt it necessary because you're just being a total ****, and you know it -- let me make something absolutely sparkling clear to you: I'm NOT a troll. I'm NOT dense. I'm not STARVED FOR ATTENTION BECAUSE I ASKED FOR ASSISTANCE ABOUT A GRAPHIC EQ AND HOW IT COULD CONNECT TO MY SETUP. And these questions have NOTHING TO DO WITH "MANNING UP" -- THAT'S JUST ASININE. I'm not WHINING, either -- I'm trying to eliminate EVERY POSSIBILITY REGARDING USING AN EQ IN THIS SYSTEM BY ASKING QUESTIONS ON A FORUM. Sometimes someone else has a solution another group may not have thought of.

Well, here's the rub with this statement: You got answers, over an over. But would you accept them as true? NO!! Just like a little child who thinks that if he rephrases the question, or asks enough different adults, he'll get an answer that he wants to hear. That ain't gonna happen here.

No, there's no Tape Monitor loop on this receiver (TAPE 2), so that's why I wanted to know if there was any way to make the TAPE input/output work, as I did not know that ONLY a "monitor" type switch could be used, exclusively. I was searching for any other way to introduce an EQ into the setup, outside of running it between one source and the receiver (which I don't want to do because I want EVERY source equalized).

Again, here you show that you didn't even grasp my answer. WTF does "TAPE 2" have to do with anything? All it shows is that you can't even grasp a basic concept when it's laid out in baby steps. ...and you try to come off as all knowing?

From what you seem to be doing with us here, perhaps you should change your moniker to Pearlnecklace.

I've been on this forum long enough for you to know that I'm not a troll -- do me a favor and keep those asinine comments about me being "dense" (looks like I found yet another candidate for my "ignore" list as you're taking a page from other likeminded cruel members here) and "needing attention" to yourself, because that's simply NOT TRUE.

Yeah, you've been here a long time but have learned, and contributed, nothing aside from stupid posts. Remember, there were two other choices along with troll and, as of this time, the jury is still out on which one of the three is more appropriate.

Oh, as for those red chicklets, none of them are mine ...yet. You see, you can't get any more than you currently have. To bang you now would have no effect and be a waste of my red chicklets. That would be like emptying several clips into someone who is already dead. Now, if you somehow manage to make it to the green and continue playing your games, I might change my mind but, I give you my word that I'll sign it, and I'll send you an email so you know it was me. Fair enough?

Another thing about them... one person cannot bang you over and over again. they have to wait for some period of time before they can bang the same person again. If you keep on getting them, you can rest assured they more than myself find you annoying.

 

[TLS Guy]

Pearl, you have had the correct advice.

The older vintage gear had a tape monitor loop so that you could use three head recorders, that allowed off tape monitoring. So the source was always at the tape out, if the tape monitor loop switch was to source then you heard the source from the speakers. If you depressed the switch and the tape deck was set to output the play back head during record, then you listed directly to your tape recording from the tape as it was being made. That way you heard problems right away, and could for instance correct tape saturation before it ruined a whole recording.

That same loop could run and equalizer and the equalizer could also run the tape recorder. A DAT machine like your TASCAM does not need a monitor loop, because you can't off tape monitor with a spinning drum recorder like a DAT machine.

If you want that facility then you need to get a nice piece of vintage gear.

You could buy a really nice vintage pre amp and amp for probably around the price of your Onkyo. The right vintage piece would also be the better unit.

Your other alternative is a an external amp, with the Equalizer ahead of the amp. There are good vintage options out there, or new units.

If you can rise to it a Quad 34 or 44 preamp with either a 303 or 405 2 power amp would do you proud. You now have to be a bit patient to find one, but you would not go wrong.