Buying an amp $1000 limit, old vs new, What would you do?

[mibson]

I’m about to have my first "good" stereo.

I’ve decided on the jbl L890 (I know these barely classify as good but its what I can afford right now)

I’m now trying to decide if I should get a new theatre amp (5.1 or 7.1) with HDMI/Optical inputs or an older (used) good power amp (bryston for eg).
(about $1000 limit).

My priority is 2 channel for music (can’t afford separate systems)

I have my brother’s old Arcam (Xeta 2) that I can use for now as a preamp...

I do have a playstation 3 that I will use for bluray and cds, and I will eventually upgrade and get a good cd player.

What would you do?

 

[adwilk]

What would you do?

If just getting an amp, I wouldn't "waste" your money on some audiophile amp. If you don't care so much about looks, Yamaha or Behringer pro amps will be much cheaper and produce the same sound as the high end amps.

Since you're using the PS3 and watching BluRays, You might consider a pre-amp/avr that can decode the latest formats. I don't think the Arcam can do that. Even in two channel, uncompressed formats might be a little better.

I would get a new AVR if it were me and that was my budget. I definitely would not blow the budget on just an amp.

 

[jamie2112]

+1 on Yamaha or Behringer pro amps.I would never buy a (audiophile)amp as you get better build and better power from the 2 companies mentioned pro amps IMO.........

 

[mibson]

If just getting an amp, I wouldn't "waste" your money on some audiophile amp. If you don't care so much about looks, Yamaha or Behringer pro amps will be much cheaper and produce the same sound as the high end amps.

Since you're using the PS3 and watching BluRays, You might consider a pre-amp/avr that can decode the latest formats. I don't think the Arcam can do that. Even in two channel, uncompressed formats might be a little better.

I would get a new AVR if it were me and that was my budget. I definitely would not blow the budget on just an amp.

Im not sure, Ive heard my brothers stereo(audiophile), and read that "" Yamaha or Behringer pro amps will be much cheaper and produce the same sound as the high end amps. "" is not true...Im not sure.

I really dont know allot about stereos yet, but...

2 channel music is my priority (only buying two speakers and amp right away)
I want to be able to eventually add at least a center channel for movies
I will eventually upgrade my speakers(5-10 years from now)
I plan to eventually add components to upgrade.

My understanding is that I could get a good two channel power amp, then upgrade later so that I can use that amp for my mains, and other amp(s) for the surround speakers. Since I have a free Arcam Xeta2 (pro logic only - would use as a preamp) sitting here doing nothing it seems like the best choise to me...

The old Arcam is only prologic, but I would need to use it as a pre amp (if I get a power amp) since all I can afford soon is speakers and amp ($2500 max)

 

[CraigV]

One of the new Pioneer Elite or Denon receivers would fit the bill for both stereo music & home theater, and will fit in your budget. The speakers you use will have a larger impact on overall quality of sound.

If you want a good quality stereo amp only, you can’t go wrong with an Emotiva XPA-2. On sale right now if you click the banner at the top of the page.

 

[mibson]

One of the new Pioneer Elite or Denon receivers would fit the bill for both stereo music & home theater, and will fit in your budget. The speakers you use will have a larger impact on overall quality of sound.

If you want a good quality stereo amp only, you can’t go wrong with an Emotiva XPA-2. On sale right now if you click the banner at the top of the page.

Is the Emotiva stuff that good? Ill be honest, after a few hours of reading. all the reviews are really starting to sound a bit like advertisements...

 

[adwilk]

Is the Emotiva stuff that good? Ill be honest, after a few hours of reading. all the reviews are really starting to sound a bit like advertisements...

No matter what you choose to believe, as long as an amp is operating in its specified range, and is not clipping, they should sound the same. If they don't then one isnt working properly. Sorry.

 

[WmAx]

Mibson, I have standards for sound quality that can be considered insane. 99.9% of 'audiophile' systems are not near satisfactory to me. But you need to understand... the key to superior SQ has nothing to do with exotic amplifiers or cd players. It has to do with the speakers and room acoustics, and of course, the quality of recording you playback over the system.

I use Yamaha pro amps in my main system - and my main system easily produces extremely real sounding playback of high quality acoustic and classical recordings. I used to use so-called 'audiophile' electronics - but discovered some time ago that it was a waste of money if you think it offers some kind of special performance. The main use of it was for cosmetic and/or pride of ownership purposes. In reality, much pro audio gear is BETTER built and will handle far more complex speaker loads. Anyways, today I throw money only where it matters (speakers and room acoustics), and I recommend you do the same unless you simply have excess money that you want to dedicate towards fancy cosmetic amplifiers and famous-maker names for pride of ownership(nothing wrong with this, but it's not how you go about maximizing the use of your money if you have limited funds, and so far as I can tell, MOST people have limited funds... ).

-Chris

 

[Seth=L]

I've got a great deal on a Adcom GFA-5400 power amp right now, I'm doing $250 shipped for it.

 

[KEW]

Try this strategy on for size:

1) You will realize much more gain in sound quality for money put into your speakers then your amp. I don't believe anyone disputes this.

2) So buy a Behringer A500 for ~$200 (link below to independent lab data on it). This seems to be the least expensive entry point into a good pro amp. If you like, you can consider this a "get me by until I am ready to buy a high dollar amp". Take the $800 you save on the amp and put it into your speakers.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17004

3) Get the best speakers you can find/afford! Be willing to invest as much time as you can in auditioning. The forums can help with suggestions if you identify what you do and don't like about a pair of speakers you have listened to. Speakers is where your payback is, so don't cut them short.

4) Enjoy your system. When you get a chance, take the A500 to your brothers house and compare. Ideally, put up a blind and you set up for your brother to make judgments and he sets up for you, so the listener does not know which amp they are listening to.

5) Worst case is you have an A500 to use for your surrounds. Nonetheless, a $2300 pair of speakers with this $200 amp will outperform a $1500 pair of speakers with a $1000 amp.

HTH

Edit - Seth's Adcom could fill the role of the Behringer as well.
Obviously, if you want your system to be a visual showcase as well as a source of high quality sound, you may not want the pro amps, but understand you sacrifice sound quality or money for the visual aspect. That is your choice, just be honest with yourself about it.

 

[Quickley17]

I agree with KEW.

At the same time, if you're interested in getting something that you can some day use for theater, and like you said, to add a center channel at some point, there are a plethora of good to great recievers for under $1000. The main Audioholics site has a couple of articles about different price points that might help you:

"Entry" - http://www.audioholics.com/buying-guides/how-to-shop/entry-level-receivers-comparison-guide

$500 - http://www.audioholics.com/buying-guides/how-to-shop/2009-500-receiver-comparison-guide

$750 - http://www.audioholics.com/buying-guides/how-to-shop/2009-750-receiver-comparison-guide

Hope this helps,

Matt

 

[Rickster71]

If I may add to all the good posts above.^

How important is a remote to you? Weigh the fact that the Behringer and Yamaha amps are manual only.

 

[njedpx3]

Just my 2 cents - get the best speakers you can afford

Mibson,

You have been given some good advice already, let me sum up my thoughts.

Use the Arcam for a preamp and get a Yamaha, Behringer or Emotiva amp ( I really like WmAx's reason for Yamaha Pro). Those should come well under your budget ( well maybe not so much the Emotiva XPA-2 or theYamaha Pro)

Behringer EP2500 - $249.95
http://www.digitalfotoclub.com/sc/from-froogle.asp?id=964608376&rf=froogle&dfdate=11_16_2009

Emotiva UPA-2 ( 125 watts, maybe not enough power) $249
http://www.emotiva.com/upa2.shtm

Emotiva XPA-2 (250 watts) $699
http://www.emotiva.com/xpa2.shtm

Yamaha XP2500 amplifier $748.97
http://www.retrevo.com/s/Yamaha-XP2500-Amps-review-manual/id/962dj195/t/1-2/



With the extra money consider, even at this point, upgrading your choice JBL L890s. Remember the main component of sound in any HT system is the SPEAKERS. ...and your peference is for 2- channel stereo.

If I were you I would go to HT stores in your area , take the CDs you like the best and audition as many speakers as you can Because int he $1,000-$1,500 price range for apair of fronts, there are a lot of good choices.

Then if you select the JBL L890s ..great!




Good Luck!

Forest Man

 

[WmAx]

Njedpx3, you have listed the wrong Yamaha amp series.

The P2500S (lowest powered Yamaha) is about $400 shipped. 250 x 2, 8 Ohms, both channels driven, 20Hz-20,000Hz. 310x2, 4 Ohms, both channels driven, 20Hz-20,000Hz. According to power level needed, there is the P3500S, P5000s and P7000s(700x2, 8Ohms, 950x2, 4 Ohms). Unlike most pro amps, the Yamahas listed do not have any fan noise and the pro rack mount ears are removable for use in regular consumer audio racks.

-Chris

 

[jinjuku]

Im not sure, Ive heard my brothers stereo(audiophile), and read that "" Yamaha or Behringer pro amps will be much cheaper and produce the same sound as the high end amps. "" is not true...Im not sure.

I really dont know allot about stereos yet, but...

2 channel music is my priority (only buying two speakers and amp right away)
I want to be able to eventually add at least a center channel for movies
I will eventually upgrade my speakers(5-10 years from now)
I plan to eventually add components to upgrade.

My understanding is that I could get a good two channel power amp, then upgrade later so that I can use that amp for my mains, and other amp(s) for the surround speakers. Since I have a free Arcam Xeta2 (pro logic only - would use as a preamp) sitting here doing nothing it seems like the best choise to me...

The old Arcam is only prologic, but I would need to use it as a pre amp (if I get a power amp) since all I can afford soon is speakers and amp ($2500 max)

I have a Parasound HCA 1000A and Behringer A500. For my speakers I built the Zaph ZDT3.5's plus the ZDT3 center.

A few points to establish up front:

1. The ZDT3.5's are a very high resolution system. I would put them in the ring with any $4K set of L/C/R's out there.

2. No one is going to argue that the Parasound isn't a 'phile' audio amp. Some people even call them the poor mans Lexicon.

I have compared both and while I have a preference for the Parasound,it is, I repeat, it is not a night or day difference. It is insignificant enough that I wouldn't miss the Parasound if I had to do with the A500 for a week or two.

Sound stage is good with both. The Parasound has a lower noise floor and more capacitance than the A500. But would I pay $450 new for the HCA 1000? No. Would I buy another HCA 1000A for the $200 I picked mine up for (*it was used only once by the previous owner in a display) in a heartbeat.

 

[jinjuku]

Is the Emotiva stuff that good? Ill be honest, after a few hours of reading. all the reviews are really starting to sound a bit like advertisements...

If you went to:

AVSForum.com
Hometheatershack.com
HTGuide.com
Klipsch message boards

You would see the same 'advertisement' from members there.

Now if you go to Polkaudio.com and hit their boards you would start a flame war.

Look used also. The Parasound has a 10 year, I believe, transferable warranty. Others to consider: Adcom, Rotel, Carver, B&K... Along with Emotiva they make really good product.

 

[njedpx3]

Thanks for the correction

Njedpx3, you have listed the wrong Yamaha amp series.

The P2500S (lowest powered Yamaha) is about $400 shipped. 250 x 2, 8 Ohms, both channels driven, 20Hz-20,000Hz. 310x2, 4 Ohms, both channels driven, 20Hz-20,000Hz. According to power level needed, there is the P3500S, P5000s and P7000s(700x2, 8Ohms, 950x2, 4 Ohms). Unlike most pro amps, the Yamahas listed do not have any fan noise and the pro rack mount ears are removable for use in regular consumer audio racks.

-Chris

Chris ( WmAx) thanks for the correction. The P2500S sounds like a winner!

Thanks,

Forest Man

 

[mibson]

Thanks for all the input!

The more I read online the more Im confused about what to get. I like what I see and have read about Emotiva amps.

Im starting to second guess what speakers to get. How do I listen to speakers and decide when the other components are often different?

Ive heard my friends sterio (infinity speakers) that he spent about $4000 on, it sounds terrible , the bass is so muffled. He does have a small room though...that could be a big factor perhaps.

Im starting to wonder about the efficiancey of Klispch and the fact that I could go with less powerful amp....

Also, what about the Emotiva ERT 8.3 speakers?

So Many speaker/amp choices, what to do?

Ill start a new post...to get some ideas...

 

[mibson]

If you went to:

AVSForum.com
Hometheatershack.com
HTGuide.com
Klipsch message boards

You would see the same 'advertisement' from members there.

Now if you go to Polkaudio.com and hit their boards you would start a flame war.

Look used also. The Parasound has a 10 year, I believe, transferable warranty. Others to consider: Adcom, Rotel, Carver, B&K... Along with Emotiva they make really good product.

I have been to every single forum I can find, getting more confused regarding what to get by the minute, I need to audition more speakers. Ive only heard one stereo that sounded perfect, my brothers, everything else Ive heard does not work for me. I like Paradigm, but the ones I can afford need a sub, Ive never heard a sub I liked and Ive listened to alot, even REL...

 

[Yamaheart]

Mibson, I have standards for sound quality that can be considered insane. 99.9% of 'audiophile' systems are not near satisfactory to me. But you need to understand... the key to superior SQ has nothing to do with exotic amplifiers or cd players. It has to do with the speakers and room acoustics, and of course, the quality of recording you playback over the system.

I use Yamaha pro amps in my main system - and my main system easily produces extremely real sounding playback of high quality acoustic and classical recordings. I used to use so-called 'audiophile' electronics - but discovered some time ago that it was a waste of money if you think it offers some kind of special performance. The main use of it was for cosmetic and/or pride of ownership purposes. In reality, much pro audio gear is BETTER built and will handle far more complex speaker loads. Anyways, today I throw money only where it matters (speakers and room acoustics), and I recommend you do the same unless you simply have excess money that you want to dedicate towards fancy cosmetic amplifiers and famous-maker names for pride of ownership(nothing wrong with this, but it's not how you go about maximizing the use of your money if you have limited funds, and so far as I can tell, MOST people have limited funds... ).

-Chris

To WmAx,

What Yamaha pro amps are you using? Or what components are in your main system? Im a yamaha's fan and see if I can do the same. Thanks.