Bookshelf as center channel?

[Rob Babcock]

Does anyone use a bookshelf speaker as a center channel? We all know that the horizontal M-T-M arrangement of your average center channel is more for aesthetics than function, right? So you'd think a bookshelf speaker would actually be better (potentially) than a horizontally laid out center channel.

The one possible downside might be dynamic power- most centers are somewhat larger than comparably priced bookself models in the lineup. This coupled with the extra woofer probably gives a bit more "oomph".

I've got a single Monitor Audio Gold Ref 10 in my rig as a center to complement my GR20's. The problem right now is that in my new house I have to place the GR10 pretty close to the wall, which isn't ideal as it's rear ported. I wonder if I might not eventually have to cave and buy a "real" center (the GR Center is sealed). I'm experimenting with plugging the rear port- for music is seems to sound a tad cleaner that way, but I haven't watched any big blockbuster flicks yet. Til I do I wonder if I'll lose too much dynamics that way.

What have you guys done in this situation?

 

[cyfman]

i've using a bookshelf for a center for a while now.i have it on it's side and it works very well for ME. i won't go into what brand of speakers i use since everyone's ear's are different.but give it a try and see if it works ok for you.try it with and without the rear port plugged.since you allready have it,it's not like your going to out any $$$$ only some time.

 

[Swerd]

Are you using the center channel speaker full range, or do you run it through a high-pass filter set at about 80 or 90 Hz? I don't know what the tuned frequency is for the port in your speaker, but if you filter out the bass, plugging the port should make little difference. I personally find that filtering out the bass from my center channel works better because most center channel content is dialogue.

 

[Nick250]

I am using a Paradigm Studio 20 as a center along with the Studio 20's as mains. I have had this configuration for about 5 years and I could not be more pleased. If I could put more than two thumbs up I would.

Nick

 

[j_garcia]

It should work fine. I've done it before with 3 LSi7s also.

 

[billnchristy]

I bought my parents 3 ref .5s for Christmas, will be setting everything up new years...I will let you know.

 

[Rob Babcock]

Are you using the center channel speaker full range, or do you run it through a high-pass filter set at about 80 or 90 Hz? I don't know what the tuned frequency is for the port in your speaker, but if you filter out the bass, plugging the port should make little difference. I personally find that filtering out the bass from my center channel works better because most center channel content is dialogue.

Well, I tried a variety of ways, just messing around. I tried it on it's side first...maybe it was all in my head, but I didn't like that at all. The center image wasn't very good at all. I ran it set to "LARGE" just to try it, and it wasn't too bad until I pushed it to less than 1 foot from the wall. It got a bit boomy then, and for bookshelves they put out a reasonable amount of bass.

I pulled it out just a touch, then set it back to "SMALL" and it sounds very good now. I'll have to watch a couple flicks to really dial it in. Sounded great with a couple of DVD-A's I tried, but I didn't have a lot of time as I got off late & had to work early. I cranked up a bit of Porcupine Tree's Deadwing and was impressed.

 

[gmichael]

I use matching book shelf speakers for the front 3 speakers and the rear in my bedroom system. It sounds very good to me this way.

 

[ChrisJam]

Does anyone use a bookshelf speaker as a center channel? We all know that the horizontal M-T-M arrangement of your average center channel is more for aesthetics than function, right? So you'd think a bookshelf speaker would actually be better (potentially) than a horizontally laid out center channel.

I can talk aesthetics only, because I built my first 5.1 system just a few months ago. Logically I know that using a bookshelf speaker for a center should be fine. And if the tweeter's dispersal pattern is wide enough top to bottom, the same speaker should work laid on its side. But to my eyes, it would just look wrong. I like having a low, horizontal center that almost spans the TV's width.

Gmichael mentioned loving his bookshelf center in his bedroom set-up. Good! And for that application, I could live with it just fine. But for my main set-up--the one friends will see and hear--I'd much prefer a low, horizontal center. Just my humble opinion.

Or I can see using three towers, assuming the center tower isn't too big to fit comfortably above or below the TV while on its side. But then again there'd be the question of the tweeter's dispersal pattern. Would guests sitting off to the side of the room get the full effect of the center's tweeter?

Chris

P.S. One more thought: Unless you laid the bookshelf speaker on its side, it'd be harder to fit it into a typical HT set-up, right?

 

[abboudc]

I use a bookshelf as a center too, same as my L/R. Some people claim that they can hear a difference if its vertical vs. horizontal...but if you can tell the difference in center orientation with a bookshelf in a full 5.1 surround setup, you've got the best ears on the planet.

 

[Nuglets]

I can talk aesthetics only, because I built my first 5.1 system just a few months ago. Logically I know that using a bookshelf speaker for a center should be fine. And if the tweeter's dispersal pattern is wide enough top to bottom, the same speaker should work laid on its side. But to my eyes, it would just look wrong. I like having a low, horizontal center that almost spans the TV's width.

Gmichael mentioned loving his bookshelf center in his bedroom set-up. Good! And for that application, I could live with it just fine. But for my main set-up--the one friends will see and hear--I'd much prefer a low, horizontal center. Just my humble opinion.

Or I can see using three towers, assuming the center tower isn't too big to fit comfortably above or below the TV while on its side. But then again there'd be the question of the tweeter's dispersal pattern. Would guests sitting off to the side of the room get the full effect of the center's tweeter?

Chris

P.S. One more thought: Unless you laid the bookshelf speaker on its side, it'd be harder to fit it into a typical HT set-up, right?

I don't see why a center channel's horizontal dispersion would be better than a typical bookshelf or tower speaker. Based on observations of my current setup, the tweeter in my center is exactly the same as the tweeter in my tower's so I wouldn't expect a difference in horizontal dispersion. Based on some theories I have read, a bookshelf or a tower is a better option than a center but I haven't had a chance to try it out for myself so I'm not sure.

 

[RMK!]

MA Gold

I think the GR10 makes a good center channel. I have the Gold CP in wall acting as my center with GR60's and 20's as the fronts and surrounds. It is sealed and has the same mid bass driver/tweeter as the other gold series speakers so it is essentially a sealed GR10. I had dual GR10's (horizontal mount) acting as center channel for several months. They were in an Entertainment Center, I used port plugs and though un-conventional, I thought they sounded fine.

 

[ChrisJam]

I don't see why a center channel's horizontal dispersion would be better than a typical bookshelf or tower speaker. Based on observations of my current setup, the tweeter in my center is exactly the same as the tweeter in my tower's so I wouldn't expect a difference in horizontal dispersion.

I've read lots of speaker specs the past few months, and a good number say that the speaker's tweeter dispersal pattern is wider than it is tall. For example, a tweeter might have a 30? horizontal dispersion pattern, but only a 15? vertical one. Sure, put one of these in a room, lay it on its side, and play something through it and you'd hear high frequencies, but the prime listening area will be diminished.

I auditioned Phase Tech 3.1 II speakers a few weeks ago. These are bookshelves, but they're designed to be LCRs. For center speaker use, Phase Tech engineered the tweeter/midrange assembly (1-inch soft dome tweeter and a 1 1/2-inch soft dome midrange) to be easily rotated 90? to produce high frequencies in the same pattern that the speaker would have when standing vertically.

A dedicated center channel speaker should be designed to produce the optimal dispersion pattern lying on its side, but not when standing on end.

Chris

 

[billnchristy]

Pardon my ignorance but arent most tweeters round?

 

[Crackerballer]

My dad use to use 2 small bookshelves (not sure on brand as this was 15-20 years ago) layed on their side as his center channel. I was very impressed and it seems to me a good set of small bookshelves would work just as good, esp if you just had them laying around.

 

[j_garcia]

Pardon my ignorance but arent most tweeters round?

Yes, but not all tweeters/speakers disperse with the same pattern equally. My speakers were designed to produce good response off axis both vertically and horizontally, so they are equally at home laying on their side or standing on end.

 

[billnchristy]

I find this very hard to believe with anything besides a ribbon. That should produce a more flat "cone" of sound. A round dome or radiator should produce a cone that is relative to the shape of the speaker.

Is there any tests showing otherwise?

 

[Dolby CP-200]

Are you using the center channel speaker full range, or do you run it through a high-pass filter set at about 80 or 90 Hz? I don't know what the tuned frequency is for the port in your speaker, but if you filter out the bass, plugging the port should make little difference. I personally find that filtering out the bass from my center channel works better because most center channel content is dialogue.

I’ve been using the JBL control 5 for the whole front three-screen array for 16 years now!

The results are fantastic when used with audio limiters equalizers the level can go high, yet without sounding harsh bass is warm sounding mid range sounds natural highs are controlled to prevent too much bitterness in the sound only when the film mix or general stereo tracks are used and deepening on that mix if it’s got highs that tingle down the back your neck so be it, I just keep the treble controls on the amplifiers down. I’m not that hard of hearing on the high end yet!

The lows are for the fronts are extended via the sub bass extension where I can simply turn it on or off or increase or decrease the level on the mixer.


Adding to this I have to say you're wrong dialogue isn’t just used for the centre it can be panned around to any of the remaining full spectrum loudspeakers.

Sound effects and music also play an important role in the centre channel! This is why all, all the fronts must be matching so that they all receive the same sonic impact without compromising the performance!

 

[j_garcia]

I find this very hard to believe with anything besides a ribbon. That should produce a more flat "cone" of sound. A round dome or radiator should produce a cone that is relative to the shape of the speaker.

Is there any tests showing otherwise?

High frequencies "beam" because they are shorter wavelengths rather than disperse more uniformly and less directionally the way lower frequencies do. That is a big part of your "sweet spot" and why a sweet spot occurs - the tweeters lend a lot to the directionality of the sound from the speaker.

 

[Tex-amp]

I use a bookshelf as a center too, same as my L/R. Some people claim that they can hear a difference if its vertical vs. horizontal...but if you can tell the difference in center orientation with a bookshelf in a full 5.1 surround setup, you've got the best ears on the planet.

All depends on which speakers.