Audio through HDMI or Optical

[xgalaxy]

HDMI or Optical is better...

Perhaps this subject has been discussed thousand times, but I want to revisit. I connected my panny blue ray DMP-BD605 connected to Yammy RXV863 receiver thorugh HDMI. Under blu ray bitstream playing I am not that impressed with HD audio quality. I have to lift the volune so high to listen movies dialogues. On the other hand my ordinary sony dvd player through optical cable ordinary DVDs plays superb sound and much better than blue ray audio. Have to turn down the volume so low not to blast the basement. But I do agree the video quality is superb on blue ray.

Is this master audio and tru HD is a hype?? Any one agrees with me?

 

[Codifus]

HDMI or Optical is better...

Perhaps this subject has been discussed thousand times, but I want to revisit. I connected my panny blue ray DMP-BD605 connected to Yammy RXV863 receiver thorugh HDMI. Under blu ray bitstream playing I am not that impressed with HD audio quality. I have to lift the volune so high to listen movies dialogues. On the other hand my ordinary sony dvd player through optical cable ordinary DVDs plays superb sound and much better than blue ray audio. Have to turn down the volume so low not to blast the basement. But I do agree the video quality is superb on blue ray.

Is this master audio and tru HD is a hype?? Any one agrees with me?

Sounds like you are missing the center channel in your Yammy RXV863 AVR setup. What is your speaker configuration?

And yeah, TrueHD and DTS Master Audio are better. They're both lossless whereas all other movie soundtracks are lossy. OK maybe give a slight nod to DTS surround. For lossy sound, it wasn't that bad.

CD

 

[zhimbo]

HDMI will transfer all the data just as well as optical.

The HD tracks will be better quality. It may or may not be noticeable, but it won't be worse.

However, the HD audio tracks may be mastered differently. In most cases that I've heard of, this results in a better, more dynamic audio track, but the dialog could be lower in the mix in some cases.

But...It sounds like more than that is going on here.

 

[xgalaxy]

i have 7 boston acoustic speaker set up. the yapo went well with out any issue or error message. I di hear sond from ctr channel. but every thing is low. Speakers and receiver are perfect because when i play through regular dvd player the sound is fantastic.

 

[PENG]

DTHD and DTS-HD-MA should be better than DD and DTS based on specs but they don't sound all that different to me and to most people I dare say in a blind test. It sounds like your problem may not have anything to do with the SQ of one vs the other but rather, the much lower output level. May be those who are familiar with the DMP-BD605 can shed some light on why the volume is so low.

 

[skers_54]

I did some comparisons of optical vs HDMI with my HD-DVD player a while ago. IF I remember correctly, there was about a 10 dB difference on some discs. U-571 for sure, maybe the Bourne and Mummy movies. I think the HDMI input was actually the quieter of the two but I can't really remember. I do know that there was definitely a difference though. Not sure why though.

BTW, I have a BD60 and don't have an issue with poor sound. I do have to turn the master volume up on Blu-Rays compared to CDs and my Denon universal player.

 

[Jeff R.]

I have similar issues on my system. I have to crank the volume knob on my receiver when using HDMI cables. Not sure why???? On my CD player with a digital coax cable I get a ton of volume. For my my PS3 is a little closer to that of my CD player not as loud at the same volume position and my Direct TV Box is even quieter. I have a hard time getting enough volume when I watch live concerts on the Direct TV box. I find it very frustrating....

 

[Codifus]

....my Direct TV Box is even quieter...

Since you mentioned DirectTV it made me realize, or maybe appreciate something even more. CableTV, and I would assume DirectTV, leave alot to be desired when it comes to employing and using video/audio standards.

My cable box was connected to my TV via HDMI. When using the TV speakers, it went loud, but no that loud. Because I wanted to free up an HDMi port and knew that cable outputs 1080i only, I switched my box to use component cables instead of HDMI to connect to my TV. The volume and picture quality were exactly the same. Even with the coaxial digital audio out feeding my stereo, the output was still the weakest of all my connected devices.

Enforcement/application of standards from cable/directTV companies is all over the map, to say the least. Cable/direct TV broadcasts are the MP3 of the video world. If i occasionally see better quality, I'm happily surprised.

CD

 

[Midwesthonky]

I'm not running HDMI but optical since my receiver is old enough to not have HDMI. So I can't offer a comparison between the two. But I have noticed the need to turn up the volume on blue-rays as compared to regular DVDs. That is with the same player. So there may be something in the disc coding themselves.

 

[xgalaxy]

so i am not alone

looks like others also noticing what I found. I have to crank up the volume when watching the blu ray. Also I noticed the sound is not crisp on blue ray movies. Regular dolby dvds sound so crisp and richer. My receiver is excellent, when i play ipod with yamaha dock I feel like I am listening live music right in front of me.

Also HDMI audio seems to be worst and I truly belive its hype and technology is still being developed. When I talk to yamaha rep he mentiond optical cable I might hear little louder. So optical is the way to go?

Can we continue this post as I am interested in more feedback and others experiences.

 

[XEagleDriver]

XGalaxy,

Try adjusting the 863's VOLUME TRIM setting for the HDMI input from the BD-60. This setting is found under the 4 INPUT MENU (see page 96 of the manual).

FYI: Vol Trim will increase the volume for a particular source by up to 6db to better level the sound as compared to other soucres (CD, DVD, Cable, etc.).

Cheers,
XEagleDriver

 

[skers_54]

looks like others also noticing what I found. I have to crank up the volume when watching the blu ray. Also I noticed the sound is not crisp on blue ray movies. Regular dolby dvds sound so crisp and richer. My receiver is excellent, when i play ipod with yamaha dock I feel like I am listening live music right in front of me.

Also HDMI audio seems to be worst and I truly belive its hype and technology is still being developed. When I talk to yamaha rep he mentiond optical cable I might hear little louder. So optical is the way to go?

Can we continue this post as I am interested in more feedback and others experiences.

I think what people are saying is that the output level is lower for Blu-Ray, not the quality. A slightly lower volume will make you perceive the sound as duller and flatter. If you have an SPL meter, use that to compare the levels. Then match them and compare again. I think you'll like Blu-Ray better in that case. BR audio is definitely superior from a technical standpoint.

BTW, thanks to whoever left me the unsigned negative rep. I appreciate your constructive criticism.

 

[selden]

Check to verify that your player is transmitting bitstreamed DD and DTS audio. When the DD or DTS audio is decompressed by a player into multichannel LPCM, then it usually plays at a volume level that's 4db lower than the bitstreamed audio. (My understanding is that the older "fat" PS3 can't bitstream the high-definition lossless DD and DTS audio tracks that are recorded on most BDs. It has to decompress them internally and transmit LPCM.)

Don't forget that playing the same audio at a very slightly lower sound level makes it sound worse than if it is played at a very slightly higher level, even with differences less than 1db. This is a well documented psychoacoustic effect. Also, human hearing has poorer sensitivity to the lowest and highest audible frequencies at lower volumes, which is why the "loudness contour" was developed.

SACD encoded as DSD, multichannel LPCM, and the new Dolby and DTS high-definition lossless audio tracks can only be transmitted over HDMI and not over optical or coax S/PDIF digital audio connections. S/PDIF digital audio connections only have the bandwidth to carry stereo PCM or the lossy DD and DTS encodings.

That said, the lossy BD DD and DTS audio tracks are recorded at significantly higher bitrates than comparable lossy DVD DD and DTS audio tracks. Many people are unable to hear any difference between them and the lossless encodings.

 

[Cranberry23]

Why does the sound tend to sound muddy. I have HDMI connections via PS3 and the DMR-BW500 Panasonic Bluray, but the sound sounds like it is in another room, with a blanket over the speakers. I have JBL speakers and they have proven to sound clear and crisp in the past with my older receivers (Pioneer) with analog and fibre optic connections. I have been nothing but disappointing with HDMI. I have to turn it up to - 33db which is not right. Tried the menu settings on the AMP to improve, but something aint right? The Samsung Plasma TV speakers sound 1000 times better when I play the Wii, and that is direct to the TV (not via my Yamaha RX-V863. Any suggestions?

 

[KEW]

Why does the sound tend to sound muddy. I have HDMI connections via PS3 and the DMR-BW500 Panasonic Bluray, but the sound sounds like it is in another room, with a blanket over the speakers. I have JBL speakers and they have proven to sound clear and crisp in the past with my older receivers (Pioneer) with analog and fibre optic connections. I have been nothing but disappointing with HDMI. I have to turn it up to - 33db which is not right. Tried the menu settings on the AMP to improve, but something aint right? The Samsung Plasma TV speakers sound 1000 times better when I play the Wii, and that is direct to the TV (not via my Yamaha RX-V863. Any suggestions?

Did you try XEagleDriver's suggestion in post #11 of this thread?

If that is not it, have you ruled out a defective Blue Ray Player? Can you hook it to another receiver? Does it have a headphone jack you can try or analog outputs?
As you describe it, it seems like the problem is more than simple adjustments.

 

[MDS]

HDMI is not the issue. That's just the interface over which the bits flow to the receiver and has no effect whatsoever on the level of the audio.

The problem is simply one of average levels of the encoded audio stream. BD discs have an even greater dynamic range (and hence lower average level) than standard DVDs and CDs are an order of magnitude louder than either.

 

[gmichael]

I would try connecting your BR player with an optical cable to see what that sounds like. Just to compare. Apples to apples is a good place to start.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I think theoretically, HDMI is better than optical because HDMI is more robust in terms of capability. But practically, it should not make any difference if we are comparing two identical bitstream sounds.

Theoretically, TrueHD & DTS-HD is better than regular DD & DTS. But practically, I can't the difference when the ORIGINAL MASTER is identical.