Apple Watch Infringes Masimo IP - Big Settlement to Come?

[gene]

Apple Inc is embroiled in a PR nightmare after the Cupertino computer company received International Trade Commission orders to stop selling new Apple Watches due to infringement of Masimo intellectual property. Meanwhile, Masimo CEO, Joe Kiani exposes Apple's poor implementation of its blood-oxygen monitoring technology.

Masimo CEO Joe Kiani is an outspoken business leader and philanthropist in the healthcare industry. By reputation Kiani’s gifted with the riz as the kids call it these days and he’s already delivered choice words to and about Apple:

“Apple’s internal documents that we saw in court showed that they knew their product wasn’t good enough to be used medically and they didn’t even seek FDA clearance because of that. Their own testing showed they got two measurements a day on 37% of the people. That’s it! We get over 70K measurements a day on everyone. And they pushed it out anyway, because as their email showed, because they thought in the chaos of COVID. This is a quotation, that they could get market share away from Fitbit.”

Will Apple Buy out Masimo or will they just hand Masimo a big bag of money to go away?

Read: New Apple Watch Infringes Denon/B&W Parent, Masimo's IP

 

[Bobby Bass]

I’m looking at this story through the lens of healthcare is big business and big business means big money. The wealthiest company in the world is looking around and saying - where can we spend our money to make the most money. That’s what businesses do and what shareholders want. Hopefully all that money means new R&D that leads to new products that help patients like the smartwatches noted. The downside Is when companies don’t strive for innovation but look to develop me-too products that may be no better or even worse but still generate profits. In a free-market economy the consumer needs to buy the innovation and avoid the me-too. Rewarding the innovation and not the cash grab So more breakthrough products are developed. That’s the win-win we all need.

 

[Trebdp83]

Big company stealing an IP in an attempt to capitalize on sick and stupid people? Shocked, just shocked. Why is any body buying a Smart watch with health monitoring features? Smart phones have clocks and many nagging wives are happy to tell their husbands that they are fat and lazy bastards that need to get more exercise. That usually results in remarks concerning long tits and a fat ass and all hell breaks loose and one or both of them have heart attacks. Maybe the answer isn’t more Smart Watches. Maybe it’s just less Smart Ass remarks.

 

[gene]

Dec 21, 2023 Update: Bloomberg is reporting that Apple engineers are busy tweaking the software inside the Apple watches to avoid Masimo patents, maybe just in time for last-minute Christmas orders. Boomberg says:

"It’s a high-stakes engineering effort unlike any Apple has undertaken before."

If Apple intends to retain the blood-oxygen monitoring feature in the new watches, there's a good chance this won't be enough to dodge Masimo's patent claims.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Dec 21, 2023 Update: Bloomberg is reporting that Apple engineers are busy tweaking the software inside the Apple watches to avoid Masimo patents, maybe just in time for last-minute Christmas orders. Boomberg says:

"It’s a high-stakes engineering effort unlike any Apple has undertaken before."

If Apple intends to retain the blood-oxygen monitoring feature in the new watches, there's a good chance this won't be enough to dodge Masimo's patent claims.

Not surprising at all. Apple will tweak software and/or continue to fight it in court. You don't become one of the biggest companies on Earth by "wasting" money paying patent licenses /s

 

[lovinthehd]

I'm hoping that Apple has to pay a lot to Masimo.....wouldn't want to see Masimo sold to Apple, tho. Then again I have no use for a smartwatch.

 

[Hobbit]

This isn't the first time they've pulled this. Unfortunately for the "smaller" guy, they're going to flex their muscle (e.g. money) and pull (politically), and skirt this again.

 

[TheAVInsider]

I've been following this for a few years. This past year, I've been waiting for the Masimo W1 wearable to get approval. Now that it has, I'm buying one. Shame on Apple. I hope they get sued for $B's. I'm rooting for team Masimo on this one.

 

[Cos]

This isn't the first time they've pulled this. Unfortunately for the "smaller" guy, they're going to flex their muscle (e.g. money) and pull (politically), and skirt this again.

"smaller" yes, that is very relative, Only compared to apple and a few others would a 2 Billion dollar company be considered small LOL.

Either way I am not for stealing IP in any way, but I did manage to get my Ultra 2 Watch before the 21st

I am sure this will be resolved in the next 30-60 days, but it will not be a software fix.

Apple was already able to get an emergency stay order on the watch until mid January, so they better do something.

 

[Verdinut]

I own a Withings Scanwatch which has some features found with the Apple product. It is also FDA approved:

Hybrid Smartwatch with ECG, Heart Rate & Oximeter - ScanWatch | Withings

The hybrid smartwatch that detects atrial fibrillation, with ECG and an oximeter for SpO2 measurements—plus activity and sleep tracking.

www.withings.com

FDA Clears Withings ScanWatch for SpO2 Functionality: CEO Says Wearable 'Can Aid in the Detection of Breathing Disturbances at Night'

Developed with cardiologists and sleep experts, it has been used in a study to monitor COVID patients remotely in German hospitals.

sleepreviewmag.com

 

[Hobbit]

"smaller" yes, that is very relative, Only compared to apple and a few others would a 2 Billion dollar company be considered small LOL.

Either way I am not for stealing IP in any way, but I did manage to get my Ultra 2 Watch before the 21st

I am sure this will be resolved in the next 30-60 days, but it will not be a software fix.

Apple was already able to get an emergency stay order on the watch until mid January, so they better do something.

First, I'll admit I haven't researched into what the patent problem was really about. It's hard to tell what's really going on in the articles which are dumbed down for non-technical people. It's surely not about the technology itself. I built one 10 years ago for fun project. The technology itself it simple and there are a lot of SPO2 monitors available. I'll bet none of them are paying Masimo for use of their patent.

Furthermore, Samsung doesn't appear to be having the same issue with Masimo. The only difference I can tell is Samsung clearly states, in summary, that it's not a medical device and to consult with a qualified healthcare professional. Or maybe Samsung played fairly and took a different approach in interpreting the results? However, I find when I compare the results to my GF's actual medical device it's very accurate.

That leaves me to believe a either they infringed on technology that interprets the results, or the crux of the issue Apple marketed it as a medical device, or both. In either case I can easily see a software solution and it's why and how apple said they were going to "fix" the problem originally.

But you're right, not only is Apple really big and can afford a lot of litigation, the Apple army, which includes judges and lawyers, believe apple invented everything and is the end all. The apple execs know this and why take egg in your face and broker a deal with Masimo when you know you can (eventually) win and keep this myth alive.

 

[jinjuku]

I'm hoping that Apple has to pay a lot to Masimo.....wouldn't want to see Masimo sold to Apple, tho. Then again I have no use for a smartwatch.

All they have to do is stop the infringement.

 

[lovinthehd]

All they have to do is stop the infringement.

Seems from the article that's an ITC order to stop the infringement but don't see that that prevents Masimo from filing a lawsuit....or maybe Kiani would love to be bought out. I dunno.

 

[jinjuku]

Seems from the article that's an ITC order to stop the infringement but don't see that that prevents Masimo from filing a lawsuit....or maybe Kiani would love to be bought out. I dunno.

Stopping the infringement can certainly be a legal remedy. The other stuff that would need to have happen is a valuation placed on it is out of the profits Apple made, what slice the infringing IP contributed to the sale of a watch.

 

[Cos]

First, I'll admit I haven't researched into what the patent problem was really about. It's hard to tell what's really going on in the articles which are dumbed down for non-technical people. It's surely not about the technology itself. I built one 10 years ago for fun project. The technology itself it simple and there are a lot of SPO2 monitors available. I'll bet none of them are paying Masimo for use of their patent.

Furthermore, Samsung doesn't appear to be having the same issue with Masimo. The only difference I can tell is Samsung clearly states, in summary, that it's not a medical device and to consult with a qualified healthcare professional. Or maybe Samsung played fairly and took a different approach in interpreting the results? However, I find when I compare the results to my GF's actual medical device it's very accurate.

That leaves me to believe a either they infringed on technology that interprets the results, or the crux of the issue Apple marketed it as a medical device, or both. In either case I can easily see a software solution and it's why and how apple said they were going to "fix" the problem originally.

But you're right, not only is Apple really big and can afford a lot of litigation, the Apple army, which includes judges and lawyers, believe apple invented everything and is the end all. The apple execs know this and why take egg in your face and broker a deal with Masimo when you know you can (eventually) win and keep this myth alive.

I do think it could be both hardware and software related. Apple not only met with Masimo, they also stole several of their leadership & developers and overpaid them to come work for Apple. Shitty business practice, but not uncommon.

I do not agree with their business practices, they should compensate Masimo is some way.

I would never buy a Masimo watch, while it might have a great O2 sensor, it is lacking 90% of the other features I would want in a smartwatch.

 

[Hobbit]

I do think it could be both hardware and software related. Apple not only met with Masimo, they also stole several of their leadership & developers and overpaid them to come work for Apple. Shitty business practice, but not uncommon.

I do not agree with their business practices, they should compensate Masimo is some way.

I would never buy a Masimo watch, while it might have a great O2 sensor, it is lacking 90% of the other features I would want in a smartwatch.

Yes, apple is every bit as ruthless, and maybe more, than they made out Microsoft to be.

 

[gene]

Denon/Marantz/B&W: Is Masimo Poised to Sell its Audio Brands?

Masimo Consumer to be a spin-off company from Masimo and will include audio brands like Denon, Marantz and B&W.; Is the move forced by investors just sound book-keeping or a signal of future sale?

www.audioholics.com