HDMI kaput, some knowledge req on Optical req

[bmninada]

Hi - I have Denon 1940CI connected to my Onkyo 606. Till date my connectivity was multi-channel (analog) and in addition HDMI. I used the receiver's input organization to decide which input to use and overall was very happy (used analog for SACD playback). Recently, my HDMI inputs started malfunctioning in my receiver. Checking forums I found for Onkyo it's a common issue.
So, I switched off HDMI and added a optical connection between my player and receiver. My problem is my DVD-Audio disks sounds inferior whether I pass PCM from player or bitstream from player. As I have understood, PCM would mean player doing the decoding while bitstream would have the receiver doing it. Either way it's inferior to HDMI. Upon researching, I found this interesting detail that optical cable won't be able to transmit the newer formats on DTS and Dolby and for which HDMI is mandatory (1.3 ver) and effectively could be the reason why it's sounding bad. My questions are a> Is this true? b> Is this true irrespective of whether PCM or bitstream is passed? c> What if I completely switch to analog? d> Between the two, i.e. my receiver and player - who has the better DAC?

[Pyrrho]

Multichannel PCM is not passed via optical (nor is it passed via coaxial digital). Via optical from your DVD-Audio player for multichannel you are getting either Dolby Digital or dts (of the types available on DVD, not the new formats they have made for BD), both of which are "lossy" (not to be confused with "lousy"; "lossy" means not lossless) formats and inferior to multichannel PCM. You can also get 2 channel PCM (e.g., CD format) via optical, but, again, not multichannel PCM. So it is not a matter of which device is using its convertors. If you want the full sound capability of your DVD-Audio player, and you don't have HDMI (or one of the rare other digital connections that would work with it), you must use multichannel analog connections.

If your receiver is an unreliable brand for HDMI, the next time, I recommend buying a different brand. There is no excuse for that sort of thing being a regular problem with a brand.

[bmninada]

Thank you, yes I stand corrected regaring my ad hoc statement against Onkyo. The correct statement would be many I am seeing having this particular model of Onkyo is reported or reported this issue. Furthermore, I live about 10 miles from the authorized repair center of Onkyo and i have spoken at length to 2 folks there who have all confirmed that this and few more they get almost daily 10 requests where HDMI ports are having issues or not working at all.

Having said all that - I gather the only option as of now is for me to stick to the analog connections from my player to the receiver with the player doing all the speaker configurations and bass management. The fundamental question I would have then is the player's DAC better than the one I have in my receiver or equally good or inferior? I want to know it so that i can plan and prioritize the repair of my receiver accordingly.

[Pyrrho]

The Denon should decode everything well. The only issue is whether or not its bass management and setup are satisfactory for your particular needs. If so, then it should sound fine.

[TLS Guy]

Thank you, yes I stand corrected regaring my ad hoc statement against Onkyo. The correct statement would be many I am seeing having this particular model of Onkyo is reported or reported this issue. Furthermore, I live about 10 miles from the authorized repair center of Onkyo and i have spoken at length to 2 folks there who have all confirmed that this and few more they get almost daily 10 requests where HDMI ports are having issues or not working at all.

Having said all that - I gather the only option as of now is for me to stick to the analog connections from my player to the receiver with the player doing all the speaker configurations and bass management. The fundamental question I would have then is the player's DAC better than the one I have in my receiver or equally good or inferior? I want to know it so that i can plan and prioritize the repair of my receiver accordingly.

Don't waste time fixing that receiver. If the HDMI ports are junk before you fix it, they will be junk after you fix it.

I think using multichannel inputs for most purposes is less than satisfactory. I would get a new receiver or a pre pro and separate amp set up.

[lsiberian]

I have suspicions this is a hdcp related issue I've had numerous issues with hdcp causing hdmi ports to mess up. I'd get a Denon receiver since they will likely use the same hdcp implementation.

[bmninada]

I have suspicions this is a hdcp related issue I've had numerous issues with hdcp causing hdmi ports to mess up. I'd get a Denon receiver since they will likely use the same hdcp implementation.

Understood. But here's a finding. Please assist by telling me if it's still HDCP (most probably) or now definitely worth fixing. As someone mentioned, hate to throw away good $$ on repairs if it's not worth it.
Assume I connect my Denon via HDMI to Onkyo in HDMI #1 input and configure correctly. Everything works fine. A day or two later, when I switch back on Onkyo and then Denon Onkyo reports "No HDMI signal". I switch everything off, move the HDMI connection from #1 to #2 (in Onkyo) and switch in same sequence everything back on. Lo and behold - connectivity established fine in HDMI #2. After 2 days, I need to switch back to HDMI #1 ... so on and so forth.

[TLS Guy]

Understood. But here's a finding. Please assist by telling me if it's still HDCP (most probably) or now definitely worth fixing. As someone mentioned, hate to throw away good $$ on repairs if it's not worth it.
Assume I connect my Denon via HDMI to Onkyo in HDMI #1 input and configure correctly. Everything works fine. A day or two later, when I switch back on Onkyo and then Denon Onkyo reports "No HDMI signal". I switch everything off, move the HDMI connection from #1 to #2 (in Onkyo) and switch in same sequence everything back on. Lo and behold - connectivity established fine in HDMI #2. After 2 days, I need to switch back to HDMI #1 ... so on and so forth.

It sounds as if there is an unstable HDCP repeater handshake. Either the Onkyo or the Denon is out of compliance. If the Onkyo is known for this that is the unit likely causing the trouble.

If all units are in compliance there should be no handshake issues.