Magnepan thoughts?

[desmo900rider]

Does anyone here have any experience with Mangnepans in general? Specifically I am looking at the MMW/MMC set they have on their website, you can get 4 of the MMWs and a MMC center for about $900 shipped...seems like a pretty good deal. I'm wondering if a nice (Yamaha, Denon, Etc.) would be sufficient to power them. Magnepan is pretty closed mouthed about receivers...

FYI, the other set I am looking at is the KEF 2005.2 system...

Thoughts/Experience?

[markw]

Make sure that whatever receiver you choose is rated for four ohms. But, the good news is that they do present a fairly stable load and, if you play their game, they provide a wonderful sound, IMNSHO.

Having owned MMG's and currently owning 1.6's, I can say without a doubt that the more clean power you have available for these, the better off you are.

Your listening levels will be the ultimate determination of how much power you really need. I used a NAD 214 for the MMG's and use a Rotel RB-991 for the 1.6's

[p38]

Friend has MMG's. Uses a 2205 Mac to power them. They like the juice. They lack the bass extension, you'll need a sub, theirs a narrow sweet spot to listen from, with the small ones, otherwise their a great deal, a whole new listening experience for sure.

[desmo900rider]

How defined is the "sweet spot" in terms of listening? What I mean is, of course when you are sitting in just the right spot with the speakers placed correctly they should sound great, but do you find that you lose those speakers when you are in other areas of the room? Thats one complaint that I have heard about planer speakers...

Obviously this would be my first venture into planar type speakers so I'm trying to get as much first hand advice as possible...

[desmo900rider]

Friend has MMG's. Uses a 2205 Mac to power them. They like the juice. They lack the bass extension, you'll need a sub, theirs a narrow sweet spot to listen from, with the small ones, otherwise their a great deal, a whole new listening experience for sure.

Thanks, I must have been posting as you were, I just saw that...

[p38]

I dont want to discourage you, but from my limited experience in front of them in stereo mode you really have to be seated in one spot with the speakers angled correctly to get the proper imageing. I dont believe that they are a speaker to get the most out of in a party situation. Their for sitting down and enjoying music in my opinion, of course there are people that would say different. You have to be the judge. I came close to getting them myself, and still might. I like the sound of ribbons. Some will say that they may not be responsive enough for rock music. I heard SRV vinyl over them and it sounded like he's right in front of you, I dont believe that you'll be sorry that you invested in them, certainly not at their cost.

[markw]

...I would suggest going slowly before making a 5 channel commitment.

I believe they offer the MMG's on a 90 day money back trial basis. Few other manufacturers have the conficence to offer that. At worst, you can return them and say "no thanks"

Pick up a pair, live with them a while, and then decide where you want to go from there. I did just that and would up trading them in for larger ones. Your experience might lead you in a totally different direction.

[p38]

I'd like to hear a set of the larger Maggies. I would guess that the image field is larger also. I'd probutly like them, but the wife... I dont think so. Too much stuff now she says.

[zildjian]

Friend of mine has the MG20.1's, they are huge & look like doors standing in his listening room, but they sound great. They do need a sub, he doesn't run one, but I think it could really use one, but there is enough bass to get by. The mid's & high's however are wonderfully reproduced! Give them a try and see if you like them if you can get a trial period. The set up / sweet spot does make a pretty big difference, when I walk around the room there are response changes, but the sweet spot in this set up is large enough to not be problematic, might be in part due to the larger drivers in the MG20.1's, but also the entire room is just set up as a critical listening room with only speakers/electronics, acoustic treatment, and two low back sofa chairs for listening relaxation. It's easy to spend hours on end there. Give the maggie's a try, and post back & let us know what you think.

[dfischer]

They MMG-W's are a bit limited in their highs, but I too am thinking about them.

Still, if the WAF factor isn't a problem the MMG is MUCH more speaker and will sound lots better.

I used to own some MG-II's and always felt the image and sound quality was unmatched. Not quite the top of a ribbon tweeter (nothing is), nor the bottom of a std woofer. But close, and simply so open and clear they're just great.

I've selected a yamaha AVR because they are rated for 4 ohm, but be aware thats 4 front and rear, 6 on the center.

Maggies do like power, and I'm open comfortable thinking about them w/an AVR because I have real amps around.

Be aware the "like power" is really more "are so effortless sounding you will be pouring power into them. Of course if you want LOUD then maggies are kinda a problem, but you'll be able to generate sound levels beyond any sane listening level needs.

[desmo900rider]

This may be a silly question, but some of the receivers I am looking at are as follows...I can only afford under $500 for one right now, and I have sound some GREAT options in that range to power the KEF system (2005.2) that I was looking at...I'm just wondering if any of these will be OK for the Magnepans...

Denon 1907
Yamaha RX-V659
NAD T743/753 (if I can find a deal on one used or a refurb...otherwise too much $$$)

and just because it getting such great reviews everywhere, though I never would have thought of it...

Panasonic XR55/57

Will any of these work to make the Maggies sound good?

[p38]

Dont know about the Yammy. Denon does about 85 watts into 7.1 I believe. The Nad 743 is a 5.1 unit around 50 or 55 watts a channel. At 4 ohm probutly a little over a 100. Maybe someone has a better grasp on this. On a 200watt Mac I've noticed the needles straight up under normal listening levels with spikes every now and then. Although my friend runs his with my Gas amp which is 80 watts into 8 ohm. Or 150 to 160 into 4 ohm. i dont know enough about the choices you made to even chance a quess. You better find someone with more knowledge then myself before you shell out the cash.

[dfischer]

The yamaha AVR I mentioned I bought is the RXV-659. It will handle the 4 ohm load fine. It's a bit light on power (you don't really believe the power ratings they put on these amps do you?) But it will be fine for most listening.

I don't know about today's NAD's but the old ones would drive about anything fairly well.

The denon's I looked at were not rated below 6 ohms...

[highfihoney]

Magnepan makes fantastic sounding speakers but as pointed out in other posts they are not the easiest speakers to run,maggies are very placement specific & unforgiving where the slightest movement in the speaker can have drastic effects, if you do end up buying maggies i'd reccomend bumping your reciever budget up alot getting one of the higher end recievers.

The biggest problems i experienced when i had maggies was the lack of a meaningfull bass response & the small sweet spot,i have quite a few different amps to choose from so powering them wasn't an issue.

I think MARKW offered the best advise,go slow before making a huge commitment.

[desmo900rider]

Well, a friend got a pair of MMG Ws this week and I went over today and listened to them...wow. Just wow.

So open, so clear, vocals sound amazing. He was driving them with a VERY old 50 wpc amp, and they sounded great. Yes, they need a sub, but my main concern was the sweet spot. if we put them at the proper angle (39 degrees), they sounded perfect, when they come in or flatten out to the wall they do fall apart. But what I liked about them is that once they were putting out good sound, you could move around the room and they still sounded great.

I think my mind is made up, I just need to find a bargin sub and probably just use a bargin amp for now, until I find a deal on a used or refurb that I like...

[JoeE SP9]

The Dayton series of sub woofers from Part*express is reasonably priced comes in three sizes (10", 12" 15") and are available as kits that even a "caveman" could assemble in an hour or so. The MMG's are my favorite inexpensive speaker. I regularly recommend them to friends and neighbors. Several of my audio buddies own various Maggy's from the MMG all the way up to the MG-20. They are all extremely happy.
Maggy's were my first high end speakers. I bought a pair of MG-1's in 1976 and have owned nothing but panels of one type or another since.:cool:

[desmo900rider]

After hearing them I think I am going to try them with the Yamaha RX-V659...I spoke with Yamaha today and that receiver is rated to be stable at 4 ohms, although they do not have a continuous power rating at 4 ohms...all they were able to tell me was that it is rated at 100 wpc @ 8 ohms continuouos for all channels, and 4 ohms put it at 200 wpc dynamic...After talking again with Magnepan, they feel that this should get me where those speakers like to be...

FYI, in case anybody cares, Magnepan likes to see higher current in those speakers, and the example they gave is that if a amp is rated at 100 wpc @ 8 ohms, then to have enough current output to drive the Magnepans well, they like to see that wpc # increase by 50% under a 4 ohm load, so they would recommend a 100 wpc amp @ 8 ohms that goes to 150 wpc at 4 ohms...putting the Yamaha most likely in that range...

That all may be common knowledge to most in this forum, but it was all new to me so I though i would share...:D

[Peter Nielsen]

FYI, in case anybody cares, Magnepan likes to see higher current in those speakers, and the example they gave is that if a amp is rated at 100 wpc @ 8 ohms, then to have enough current output to drive the Magnepans well, they like to see that wpc # increase by 50% under a 4 ohm load, so they would recommend a 100 wpc amp @ 8 ohms that goes to 150 wpc at 4 ohms...putting the Yamaha most likely in that range...

Wrong. The power should DOUBLE in 4 ohms. If it's 100W in 8 ohms, it should be 200W in 4 ohms. Physical fact. Ohm's law tells you P=R*I^2 which yields 2P=0.5R*I^2.

A "good" amp will double its power in 4 ohms, and those are the ones that work well with Maggies...

Said by an owner of 20.1, 3.6, CC3, and MG1...

Peter

[desmo900rider]

Wrong. The power should DOUBLE in 4 ohms. If it's 100W in 8 ohms, it should be 200W in 4 ohms. Physical fact. Ohm's law tells you P=R*I^2 which yields 2P=0.5R*I^2.

A "good" amp will double its power in 4 ohms, and those are the ones that work well with Maggies...

Said by an owner of 20.1, 3.6, CC3, and MG1...

Peter

Well, I'm not going to argue with your formula there, mostly because I have no idea what it means...:eek:

But, what I posted is exactly what the person I spoke with at Magnepan told me that those speakers like. Either way, I am hoping that the Yamaha I have in mind will work well.

Since you seem to be a fan of Magnepan, do you have any experience with their MMGW/MMGC series of speakers? I do know that they are actually 5 ohm speakers, not 4 ohm if that makes much of a difference as far as power needed...

[p38]

Do yourself a big favor and save for a good two channel amp. Your Maggies will thank you.

[desmo900rider]

Do yourself a big favor and save for a good two channel amp. Your Maggies will thank you.

If this was going to be a music only system I would, but this needs to serve the HT function as well...

[Yamahaluver]

I know the top end Yamahas like the 2700 or 4600 work quite well with Maggies, I would seriously look into those, I truly relate to your love for Maggies, they are the sweetest offering to come out of the US, have always admired their sound.

[desmo900rider]

Maybe someday, but thats way more than I have to spend right now...Hopefully a 659 will just wet my appetite for bigger and better Yamahas...;)

[EconoPUndit]

Do yourself a big favor and save for a good two channel amp. Your Maggies will thank you.

Have to say I agree. After hum & other problems with preamp/processor/3 basic amps I traded everything but 5 Maggies & Bryston 4B in for an easy to run NAD T773. Ran everything off of it for several years and was happy.

But in a fit of ambition I went to the back of the T773, pulled the front R&L jumpers and put the Bryston's 400 watts back into service.

Whoa! What a difference.

[william]

I have a pair of MMGs that I have been auditioning and comparing with Ascend CMT-340 SE. Magnepan's return policy is 60 days and my audition period is about up. My listening observations are:

- I found the sound quality between the Magnepan MMGs and Ascend CMT-340s to be very close. The MMGs seemed to have slightly more lower bass extension than the Ascends. The Ascends seemed slightly better in the high frequency response.
- These speakers have different sound characteristics, however, both produced great sound and were a pleasure to listen to on a wide range of music and HT soundtracks.
- I did find the sweet spot for the MMGs to be very limited. Vertical dispersion characteristics caused the sound timbre to quickly change as you go from sitting to standing. The sound becomes noticeably more muted if you are doing critical listening. However, for casual listening and parties, you'd likely never notice this difference. And if you always sit in the sweet spot, then no problem - the MMGs sounded exceptional.
- I also experienced some odd sound stage behavior with the MMGs. 1) When I moved my head slightly off center axis to the left in one particular audition room/set-up, I passed through a point where the center vocals shifted from the front center to my left side. Very odd. Moving my head further left caused the image to move back to center. This soundstage anomaly, I'm certain is very setup dependent. 2) On some material (such as female Jazz vocals) the sound image (vocalist or instrument) appeared "supersized" compared to the image produced by the Ascends. While this supersized sound image still sounded great, the effect caused the MMGs to be perceived by me to be less "natural" or "live performance" like at times. The Ascend's seemed to give a better "live" performance illusion.

Regarding receivers:
- I tested the MMGs with both a Yamaha 5960 (equivalent to 659) and Denon 1907. I thought qualitatively that the Yamaha sounded "strained" when driving the MMGs. I too spoke to Yamaha tech support and they did not recommend the 5960 (or 659) for 4 ohm speakers. In particular, they said that the center channel and surround amplifiers were different than for the front mains and that these were not really designed for driving 4 ohm speakers. So, if you're planning an all Magnepan 5 speaker HT configuration, consider other amps.
- I also felt that the MMGs sounded better with the Denon 1907 (and my older Harman Kardon AVR-130) than with the Yamaha. (The Denon had the added benefit that s-video signals looked better on screen than with the Yamaha. I also liked the Denon's OSD menu system better than the Yamaha's.)

Relative to my overall speaker evaluation, I concluded that the Ascends offered the better value because:
- Similar sound quality to MMGs.
- Had no sound stage "anomlies" like what I experienced with the MMGs.
- Much easier to work with from a room placement / sound optimization perspective.
- They sounded more like a live performance to me and had better off axis response.
- Lower estimated cost for a 5 speaker HT configuration (based on Ascend CMT-340s for front L/R and center and CBM-170s for surrounds versus Magnepan MMGs for front L/R and CC3 center and MMG-Ws for surrounds).

Ultimately, which sounds best will depend on your room/setup and listening preferences. The Magnepan MMGs do sound great. I will really hate to send them back in a about a week. If you plan to implement just a stereo setup for music and have a room that can accommodate the Magnepans optimal placement, then I would highly recommend the MMGs. Also, if you are considering upgrading to higher-end Magnepans (e.g. 1.6s) within the year, then Magnepan's refund upgrade policy can't be beat. By the way, I did test the MMGs as surrounds with 1.6s as front L/R and a CC3 for the center (HSU VTF 3.3 Subwoofer). It was spectacular on 5.1 channel music.

Hope this helps.

[rumble]

Regarding receivers:
- I tested the MMGs with both a Yamaha 5960 (equivalent to 659) and Denon 1907. I thought qualitatively that the Yamaha sounded "strained" when driving the MMGs. I too spoke to Yamaha tech support and they did not recommend the 5960 (or 659) for 4 ohm speakers. In particular, they said that the center channel and surround amplifiers were different than for the front mains and that these were not really designed for driving 4 ohm speakers. So, if you're planning an all Magnepan 5 speaker HT configuration, consider other amps.
-

Hope this helps.

I also have the MMGs and I think the receivers you used for your testing are way underpowered. Magnepan rates the MMGs at 40 watts minimum, 150 watts maximum at 8 ohms. But these speakers present a true 4 ohm load(4 ohms acros the entire frequency response with a narrow spike at the crossover point) so those numbers are understated. You really need an amp stable at 4 ohms with plenty of power.

I use a Behringer A500 amp to power both speakers. I found a site on the internet that tested the output of this amp and rated it at 180 watts per channel at 4 ohms. I can run these speakers all the way until just before the clip lights come on the amp without any problems. I get the impression they could handle more power than this.

[fourwheels0]

ok i have a yamaha rx-v992 with the 4-8 ohm switch on the back and i'm getting a nice set of magnepan mg-1 imp's. will this receiver set to 4 ohm's have enough power to push the maggie's properly?.

[chadnliz]

Power does not have to double down at 4 ohms so ignore that, High current amps will do that but if one increases 50% that is just fine, as far as the Magnepan speakers I owned them when I ran Electrostat mains and can say from experience the are an outstanding value.
The high frequency limits are just fine as many cant even hear past 15K, bass isnt there but probably the best sub that wont break the bank to mate with them is the Vandersteen sub, it is super fast and deep for music and great for movies also.
This line of speakers is a no brainer if you have reasonable power, they look great and have a purity in the mid range that is stellar for this price point, there are few if any speakers in this budget that can compete, plus they come with a return receipt if you dont like them, they also hold value well so it is a minimal risk to try them. WAF is also high as the wall mounts have swing away brackets when not in use.

[chadnliz]

PS I ran mine with 75W Rotel amp and had NO PROBLEMS, I would suggest more power (100-200 for mains) and as little as 50-75w for surrounds.

[jaxvon]

Power does not have to double down at 4 ohms so ignore that, High current amps will do that but if one increases 50% that is just fine, as far as the Magnepan speakers I owned them when I ran Electrostat mains and can say from experience the are an outstanding value.
The high frequency limits are just fine as many cant even hear past 15K, bass isnt there but probably the best sub that wont break the bank to mate with them is the Vandersteen sub, it is super fast and deep for music and great for movies also.
This line of speakers is a no brainer if you have reasonable power, they look great and have a purity in the mid range that is stellar for this price point, there are few if any speakers in this budget that can compete, plus they come with a return receipt if you dont like them, they also hold value well so it is a minimal risk to try them. WAF is also high as the wall mounts have swing away brackets when not in use.

Halving the impedance does require twice the power output from the amplifier. Do mind that. And also, a 50% gain in power is pretty much worthless. A 100% gain will only get you a 3dB increase in output, so unless you need a couple extra watts to avoid clipping at your usual reference volumes, this is bad advice.

[fourwheels0]

well i went and picked up the speakers this morning and they are in great shape and sound good (no rattle's or buzz) aside from 1 small snag in 1 sock i can't complain. now i need to decide on whether to keep the system or sell it. anybody have any idea's what it would be worth?. system includes yamaha rx-v992 receiver,yamaha kx-w282 dual cassette and the magnepan speakers. thanks.

[dilznoofus]

Wrong. The power should DOUBLE in 4 ohms. If it's 100W in 8 ohms, it should be 200W in 4 ohms. Physical fact. Ohm's law tells you P=R*I^2 which yields 2P=0.5R*I^2.

A "good" amp will double its power in 4 ohms, and those are the ones that work well with Maggies...

Said by an owner of 20.1, 3.6, CC3, and MG1...

PeterPower does not have to double down at 4 ohms so ignore that....

Let's see, who I am gonna trust on this one? Someone who owns a veritable boatload of Magnepans, or someone who spends time worrying about the title under his made up internet name on a web forum?

What Peter said about current is absolutely correct.

Chadnliz, why don't you wander back down to the Member Systems Gallery and make a bunch more of your "wow, great system" posts. That way, your post count can zoom into the stratosphere and you can then perceive yourself as an Audio God if you like.

Said by an owner of 1.6's, SMGc's, MGCC-1

[fourwheels0]

ok upon checking my receiver it DOES double the power at 4 ohm's. it's 100 watt's at 8 ohm's and 200 at 4 ohm's. god these speaker's do sound good haha.

[peterw]

I owned a pair of 1.6 maggies in the early 2000s.

They spoiled me in the mids and highs when I listen to other speakers now.

Get a good sub.

[Audioi]

Magnepan's can be wonderful with the correct associated pieces. I have owned a few pairs over the last 21 years. I find that they like power, the more the merrier. They also seem to eat current so an amp that can supplu lots will make them happy. Don't be afraid of too much power but dont ask more than the amp can deliver.
I am currently running my MG2.7Qr with 1200 watts per of McIntosh power and they LOVE it.
Get em' right and you will not believe how good they sound!
Good Luck.:)

[DFCall]

I have been playing with the MMG Ws for about 8months. I found a pair of discounted AV123 ERT SUPER TWEETERS that I have hooked up for the extension of the high end, and two 8” M&K subs for the bottom end. I have found this setup one of the best detailed speakers systems I have heard. Yes I would like the bigger Magges, however I do not have the space for them.
If you can find a good price on a set of super tweeters and small fast subs, the MMG Ws can be the mid range for a killer system.