Using a Receiver AND Seperate Amps together?

[BuddTX]

As I am still in the decision making process, I am considering several options.

The Axiom M60's are one of the finalists, and I have read how they need a good amp to show them off.

Well, among the finalists in my new receiver, was the Outlaw 1070, when it is released.

BUT, I was thinking, what if I also purchased 2 or 3 of the Outlaw M200 mono amps, and used them for my front L&R and Maybe center channel?

Please be aware that my concern is NOT to blow out the neighbors, but to reproduce sound more accurately at normal or louder but enjoyable listening levels.

So what do you think of the Outlaw 1070 or other 700-1200$ range new receiver(maybe a Denon or a Yamaha or Onkyo) combined with three of the M200's?

I remember from years ago, when HT receivers just started coming out, that often times, the center and rear channels had lower WPC than the stereo channels, and this was a common complaint about the AMPs not being matched.

Even though the Front L-C-R channels would have 200 WPC, the other 2-4 channels should still have more than enough power to balance out the sound?

I have read that receivers like the 1070 etc can handle the M60 well, but I would always be thinking, "am I missing something?"

OR, another thought, instead of using the M200's get two nice stereo Amps, for the L & R, and Bi-Amp the M60's?

Any thoughts?

Again, clear, more accurate, more precise is what I am after, not louder.

What do yall think?

 

[Rob Babcock]

I've used a receiver with amps for the front 3 channels for years- it's a solid approach. In my system the rears are much closer than the fronts and thus require far less power to satisfy me. I don't know anything about the M200's except by reputation; it seems like most owners are satisfied with them.

 

[av_phile]

In my experience, going from pure HT receivers to separate power amps yielded subtle but definite and istinct sonic improvements. My only familiarity with the Outlaw products are what I've read in reviews and they seem to be excellent products on their own. You can always do a cursory comparison based on published technical specs to give some indication of what you can expect at home. Just make sure the separate amps are indeed BETTER than the amps in the recivers you are comparing with.

At the moment I am using a stereo Acurus A250 to power the fronts and an Acurus 200X3 to power the center and rears. They two have a difference of 50watts, not really perceptible. And where I am seated which is closer to the rears, I find a lower powered rears preferable in some multi-channel music materials, though all my speakers are identical, except the center.

Bi-amping is another excellent path. But this gets to be more complicated. I wouldn't recommend passive bi-amping though. You would need active crossover electronics after your preamp out of your receiver to feed a couple of power amps with IDENTICAL GAIN, preferred, unless your crossover box has separate gain controls. Hope this helps.

 

[Rob Babcock]

I've tried passive biamping with good results, but its effectiveness varies a bit depending on what speaker & associated gear you're using.

 

[Rip Van Woofer]

Until I read some of Gene's articles (see the Receiver Picks review) I was going to get a separate prepro. But as Gene and others have pointed out before, you can spend as much or more for a prepro as for a good receiver and, paradoxically, get no more or even less in the way of features (bass management, 0.5dB channel trimming, etc.) and no audible difference in the basic performance of the receiver's prepro section vs. separates. So I'm going to go the receiver and outboard amp route for my mains (biamped, active crossover) and maybe center, and the built-in amps for surrounds in my planned system.

In fact, a used Sony STR DA-5ES is one option I'm considering since Gene was so high on the prepro section. Recent Harman Kardons like the AVR 425 and 430 look interesting too because of the bass management. And I like their looks - a bit different from the Japanese black aluminum box.

 

[BuddTX]

Thanks for all the informative replies!

Thanks for the info on the Sony receiver also. Don't know anything about it, but I will check it out. Now that I am looking at seperate amps, power will not be as huge of a consideration, if I am "outsourcing" the L-R and Center channel!

While I like Outlaw concept (as well as Axiom, Acend, AV123 and Aperion), I am not committed to anything yet.

Maybe another option would be a good 2 channel stereo Amp for each speaker, that way I could Bi-Amp them also!

(Saying 2 channel Stereo, that is redundant, kind of like ordering a RED Zinfandel at a restaurant!)

So, what companies are considered "good values" in Amps? I am sure I could find some good deals on Audiogon, but would prefer new.

I am really glad that there are these "internet direct" companies. I feel like, now, I will be able to get close to "state of the art" sound, within a reasonable budget.

 

[Rip Van Woofer]

(Saying 2 channel Stereo, that is redundant, kind of like ordering a RED Zinfandel at a restaurant!)

So, what companies are considered "good values" in Amps? I am sure I could find some good deals on Audiogon, but would prefer new.

Well, there is white Zinfandel...though you would of course get sneered at in a fancy-schmancy joint if you asked for it ("...and would monsieur like to sniff ze bottle cap?"). *

Amp values: Outlaw, again. Adcom, though their current use of and bragging about MOSFETs causes a raised eybrow; ATI, NAD, Rotel. Nothing wrong with used IMO, so don't rule it out. My used Adcom GFA 545-ii (pre-MOSFET) was a good purchase.

And there's a company called AudioSource that makes amps at what seem to be ridiculously low prices for the claimed power and specs. Intriguing but I don't know much about them. Caveat emptor; do some research! Parts Express carries them.

Bear in mind that I'm notorious for being one of those "all modern amps sound alike" guys. Search for my rantings on the subject if you're curious.

* Yes, that was an hommage to "The Muppets Take Manhattan".

 

[kingtut]

I have an Audiosource Amp 3 @ 150w x 2 driving the front Polk Tower speakers, and the Denon 3803 is driving the center and rear speakers. The Amp 3 improved the bass and the details of the front speakers. The Amp 3 has a Torroidal power supply, and it's a very neutral amp. Overall, I'm very happy w/the Amp 3.

 

[BuddTX]

Well, there is white Zinfandel...though you would of course get sneered at in a fancy-schmancy joint if you asked for it ("...and would monsieur like to sniff ze bottle cap?"). *

AAAAAauuuuggggghhhhh!!! <grin!>

Before a small boutique winery called Sutter home made a "mistake" in the 80's,a and did not leave the skin on the grape "must" for long enough to get the disired red color, and they decided to cold ferment it and make a quick rose, there was ONLY RED ZINFANDEL!

Red Zin STILL is considered the RED WINE DRINKERS SECRET!Great wines, low prices, lots of variety.

Anyway, back to Amps . . .

Thanks for the amp suggestions.

I am reaally leaning towards this receiver/amp combo.

Doesn't that sound like a good idea, to get two moderately priced stereo amps, and bi-amp the L&R, and get a mono amp for the center, and let the receiver take care of the rear and side speakers.

 

[Rip Van Woofer]

Doesn't that sound like a good idea, to get two moderately priced stereo amps, and bi-amp the L&R, and get a mono amp for the center, and let the receiver take care of the rear and side speakers.

That's pretty much my plan too except that my amps will be DIY (fools rush in...) and I'll probably use the receiver's center channel amp at least for awhile.

Red Zin is my favorite, too. Goes well with the southern Italian food I grew up on and love. Including pizza. One of the best surprises I had, believe it or not, was having a red zin with some leftover pizza I warmed up in the oven for a quick lunch. Magic! (I think it was Rodney Strong Old Vines).

But, declasse as it may be, white zin is a good summertime quaff IMO.

 

[Rob Babcock]

It's a well established fact that all your best wines have a screw top, right?

How about a nice Boone's Farm "Blanc de Blanc"

I've recently (and hopefully temporarily) had to downsize to just the reciever, moving one of my amps to power my subs. The bass is better now, but unfortunately the Denon isn't really getting done. No knock on the Denon, but going from 3 x 200 for the L,C & R down to my poor 3802 having to run all five is sorta tough. I really want a 5 ch amp, but economics may dictate trying to pick up a used Adcom '555 or something for sub use.

Man, being broke sucks!

 

[BuddTX]

Red Zin is my favorite, too. Goes well with the southern Italian food I grew up on and love. Including pizza. One of the best surprises I had, believe it or not, was having a red zin with some leftover pizza I warmed up in the oven for a quick lunch. Magic! (I think it was Rodney Strong Old Vines).

Zinfandel is the only native (found originally in the US) "Vitus Vinifera" grape (or commonly called Euporean variety). Other US grapes are "Vitus Lambrusca", like Concord and Nigara etc. They say Zinfandel appears to be related to Italian Red grapes.

More Zinfandel Italian Connection

While I also like Napa Zin's, try any Zinfandel from Amador County, the sierra foothills. Amador County is to Zin, what NApa is to Cab Sauv and Chard!

 

[BuddTX]

It's a well established fact that all your best wines have a screw top, right? :

While I prefer synthetic cork to screw top, Expensive bottles of wine are starting to be sold in screw tops!

135$ Napa Valley Cabernet Sauvignon Reserve in a Screw Top

 

[LeadTrac]

I have two Outlaw M-200 Mono amps connected to my main speakers. I also have an Adcom 7506 (125watts X 5) driving my center, surround and rear surround speakers. I must say I am quite pleased with the sound.

 

[mumum]

I have two Outlaw M-200 Mono amps connected to my main speakers. I also have an Adcom 7506 (125watts X 5) driving my center, surround and rear surround speakers. I must say I am quite pleased with the sound.

Hi,
I am new here and really appreciate this thread. My "newbie" question is how do you connect all these? I mean do the front speakers go directly into a dedicated 2 channel amp, then the amp is connected to the receiver? Or does a speaker selector switch come into play? I really appreciate so assistance.

Regards.