Upgrade From Pioneer VSX-AX10iG to Yamaha RXA-3050?

[trickstar74]

Hello Guys,

Really need your help and after viewing so many of Gene's reviews, I hope he might be able to chime in here if possible. I have had the old Pioneer Flagship since about 2004 and have always loved the build quality and the sound put out through my 5x Sony SSX-90ED speakers and matching centre all of which are 4ohm. I have finally decided to bite the bullet to upgrade to a modern HDMI Receiver. Will the Yamaha drive my speakers and be comparable in quality and sound? What are your thoughts? Thanks in advance!!

 

[fmw]

It should be fine. It is important that you understand that amplifier impedance ratings are based on full output power. Since we rarely if ever use full output power or even close to it, most all amplifiers will handle nominal 4 ohm speakers without a problem. The people who write the specs have choices. If they want a lower impedance rating, they just need to lower the power rating. Most would rather have a higher power rating for marketing purchases. The reality is that, except for fairly rare circumstances, amplifiers are a trivial part of home audio and certainly less important than people want you to think.

On the matter of sound quality, it is the room calibration software that represents the differences from one receiver to another, not the amplifiers. Both Pioneer and Yamaha provide for manual adjustments in the calibration software so you can adjust things to your preference.

 

[trickstar74]

Thanks for the reply. So I should be able to watch movies and listen at reference levels like I had with the pioneer? Also how would the build quality and internal componentry compare to the copper chassis pioneer? Thanks again!

 

[fmw]

Yes, depending on the speaker efficiency, room boundary gain, listening position, subwoofer implementation and a jillion other factors. I can't believe anyone enjoys listening at reference level, however. It would drive me out of the room.

 

[trickstar74]

Thanks Fmw. I have quite a large room in an open plan 2 story home. The cinema area itself is 9m wide by 14m long with a 4m high ceiling. It's not closed off and is completely open to the rest of the ground level. So yes I've listened at reference levels many times hence my legitimate concern that the new receiver be able to keep up. Any thoughts on the build quality of the internal componentry? How would the Yamaha compare to the old flagship pioneer? Thanks again!

 

[Grassy]

Hello Guys,

Really need your help and after viewing so many of Gene's reviews, I hope he might be able to chime in here if possible. I have had the old Pioneer Flagship since about 2004 and have always loved the build quality and the sound put out through my 5x Sony SSX-90ED speakers and matching centre all of which are 4ohm. I have finally decided to bite the bullet to upgrade to a modern HDMI Receiver. Will the Yamaha drive my speakers and be comparable in quality and sound? What are your thoughts? Thanks in advance!!

I had the same receiver and i loved it and had it replaced with the SC LX86 only because it was damaged either in freight or by the absolute numb scull that was working on it. I didnt get it back till 7 months later and it was also lost in freight by the tech that sent it to pioneer.Pioneer allowed me a replacement and gave me the SC-LX86. As far as your question goes,its well worth the upgrade but i would not ever sell that VSX as it is not a tin box as compared to what they are making now and it has a great amplifier section built in to it. I cant tell you how much i miss mine and having said that i will never deal with pioneer again as they cost me a great machine that cost me $6000.00. If i were you i would hang on to that machine and if you are going to step up i would go for something with a similar build quality. But it will cost you serious money. That's just me though as i did purchase the AVP,POA,DVDA1. I did not want to take a step backwards in build quality.The latest receivers will get the job done with no doubt about that. HDMI is a big step with DTSMA coming into play and you will hear a difference.Best of luck

 

[PENG]

Thanks Fmw. I have quite a large room in an open plan 2 story home. The cinema area itself is 9m wide by 14m long with a 4m high ceiling. It's not closed off and is completely open to the rest of the ground level. So yes I've listened at reference levels many times hence my legitimate concern that the new receiver be able to keep up. Any thoughts on the build quality of the internal componentry? How would the Yamaha compare to the old flagship pioneer? Thanks again!

If m is meter then your room is really big. Unless you sit close to the speakers, say less than 3 meters, neither that Pioneer nor the Yamaha has the power to do that room justice and that is assume you have speakers that are sensitive enough and can handle the power input for them to let you listen at reference level to begin with. Again, it still depends on how close your sitting position is to the speakers, and also the type of music you listen to, before we can tell whether you need more power and how much more you need. Doubling the power output will only get you 3 dB more so probably your sitting position, speakers and subwoofer(s) are the more important factors.

Regarding the copper chassis stuff, theoretically there should be benefits in minimizing induced noise/interference etc., but in practice I found they don't always produced better results than their lower cost counterparts. Take a look of the bench test noise related data of the Marantz flagship models and you will see that they don't do better than the lower cost Marantz or Denon models. To me they are more marketing driven, also gave them reasons to increase their profit margin. Still, I think it's a good thing to have for people (me included) are willing to pay more for the kind of quality that likely will not result in audible benefits.

 

[trickstar74]

Thanks Grassy and Peng for your well thought out replies.

Grassy, in your opinion (since you are a previous ax 10i owner) if I were to purchase a new processor for the hdmi and true hd, master audio etc, and plug that into the ax 10i using it for the amplification ad / da conversion, would I get better sound and more power than using the Yamaha 3050 to do it all?

 

[Seth=L]

The reality is that, except for fairly rare circumstances, amplifiers are a trivial part of home audio and certainly less important than people want you to think.

I think manufacturers are starting to realize this, hence the cheap amp sections in entry level AVRs.

I'm only joking of course.

You might consider looking at external power for at least your front 2 or 3 speakers and let the receiver handle the rest. Most of the power demands in home cinema rest on your front speakers & subwoofer. Of course you can always eek more performance out of your receiver by utilizing the bass management (which I would assume you would already be doing).[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

 

[PENG]

Thanks Grassy and Peng for your well thought out replies.

Grassy, in your opinion (since you are a previous ax 10i owner) if I were to purchase a new processor for the hdmi and true hd, master audio etc, and plug that into the ax 10i using it for the amplification ad / da conversion, would I get better sound and more power than using the Yamaha 3050 to do it all?

I bet the Pioneer has more power though not likely enough to be noticeable. The 3050 has very good DAC in it that I doubt the Pio can do better.

 

[Grassy]

Thanks Grassy and Peng for your well thought out replies.

Grassy, in your opinion (since you are a previous ax 10i owner) if I were to purchase a new processor for the hdmi and true hd, master audio etc, and plug that into the ax 10i using it for the amplification ad / da conversion, would I get better sound and more power than using the Yamaha 3050 to do it all?

That's a great question mate and that is exactly what i did.I was using the AVPA1HD for a while plugged into the multi channel inputs on the VSX before i got my POA amp so i just reset the VSX to factory settings and used its amp to power the AVP via the multichannel inputs.I believe you are in a position where you need to think what you really want for the future that will last. I personally don't like throw away items(tin box units) so i invested in the AVP and so on. My plan was to retire my VSX into the lounge room as i was not bothered about HDMI while viewing TV in there. My theater room was a different story though. At the end of the day its about how much money you have and how much you need to spend and how to balance it out into your plan. I would hang on to the VSX as that receiver was a statement piece and a well built unit and has nice amplification and has the ability to become very nostalgic.It even looks great.As far as your question goes, if your room is small, stick with the 1 receiver solution BUT KEEP THE VSX. If your room is large enough then i would go a pre/pro but with a dedicated amp. If funds are tight then use the VSX as an amp until you have the cash then buy a dedicated amp. Don't forget to weigh up how well your speakers are performing at the present and what will suit them as you should "Match The Hatch."

 

[trickstar74]

Wow! Grassy thank you for putting the time into that response!! That's pretty much what my gut has been telling me. So I'll open up the floor again to everyone. I've got a budget of around $3000.00 Australian dollars. I want to get as future proof a model as I can so I have looked at the Yamaha CX-A5100. What are your thoughts on this? What would you recommend for the money?

 

[Grassy]

I bet the Pioneer has more power though not likely enough to be noticeable. The 3050 has very good DAC in it that I doubt the Pio can do better.

Wow! Grassy thank you for putting the time into that response!! That's pretty much what my gut has been telling me. So I'll open up the floor again to everyone. I've got a budget of around $3000.00 Australian dollars. I want to get as future proof a model as I can so I have looked at the Yamaha CX-A5100. What are your thoughts on this? What would you recommend for the money?

I was speaking to LEN Wallis Audio here in Australia (over the phone)and was told at that price range the Yammy is the best bet. I have never heard one but it is probably the best of the bunch according to them. Go in and get some demos and let your eyes and ears do the work for you.See if you can find a thread on here with owners of that machine and see what they say also.

 

[PENG]

Looks like the RX-A3050 has the same DAC for the main channels as the CX-A5100

• Professional digital-to-analog conversion (ESS SABRE™ Ultra DAC ES9016S and ESS Premiere DAC ES9006A)

As far as I can remember Audioholics had tested some Yamaha AVRs before and found their preamp section performed very well and yielded very good SNR and distortions figures.

I went from AVR to separates and found no advantage except within a year I felt (just the feeling) the prepro was becoming outdated quickly. So instead of investing another 3 to 4K on my next prepro upgrade I will likely go back to an AVR+Amp solution. I think in your case the RX-A3050 plus a good 2 or 3 channel power amp is a good alternative. It is much more cost effective to upgrade with such solution than a full blow separate system. Any AVR in the same class as the 3050 will have more than enough power for the surround channels.

If you must use balanced outputs then the CX-A5100 becomes a no brainer. Most people don't need balanced outputs for home HT applications. One more point, if you believe in Audyssey REQ software then you probably should also consider the Denon AVR-X7200W, otherwise the impressive 3050 is as good as it gets right now.

3dB is a vinyl guy so he probably cares about SQ a lot, and I think he is very impressed with Yamaha AVRs even though I seem to remember he used to think "Boutique" brand such as NAD offered better SQ for music (I might have remembered wrong but you can PM him). I think he is one of those Yammy fan who could tell you all about why Yammy is best.