Universal Remote

[musicholic]

Hi,
I own a Denon 2807, Paradigm 60s and Paradigm 590s, Denon DVD player and Scientific Atlanta cable box. My wife just bought me a Harmony Logitech 880 for Xmas but I've heard good things about the Home theater Master. She paid only $150 for the remote but the HT Master costs twice that and requires programming ($150) I hear. What would you recommend?

 

[racquetman]

Hi,
I own a Denon 2807, Paradigm 60s and Paradigm 590s, Denon DVD player and Scientific Atlanta cable box. My wife just bought me a Harmony Logitech 880 for Xmas but I've heard good things about the Home theater Master. She paid only $150 for the remote but the HT Master costs twice that and requires programming ($150) I hear. What would you recommend?

The Harmony 880 is a great remote. Why would you want to pay twice as much for something else? What do you think you are going to gain???

 

[musicholic]

The manager at the electronics store told me that the HT Master is much more intuitive compared to the Harmony 880.

 

[racquetman]

The manager at the electronics store told me that the HT Master is much more intuitive compared to the Harmony 880.

I've never used the HT Master, but it sounds to me like you need to read between the lines. When the manager said it was much more intuitive you should have heard "my profit margin is greater on the HT Master".

I doubt it is much more intuitive. Even if it was, is that worth an extra $150 to you? Whether it is intuitive or not is a temporary situation. Once you have figured out what you are doing, intuition is no longer a factor. You know what button you need to push and you push it.

Anyway, I'm not sure why I'm trying to talk you out of the other remote. Three hundred bucks just seems like waaaaaaaay too much money for a remote unless you have a really sophisticated system.

 

[Nick250]

I have a Harmony remote. The fact that you managed a post on audio forum means you are already overqualified to setup the Harmony using their on line wizards. If I want to watch a movie, I hit "watch a movie" on the harmony. It turns on my TV and sets it to audio input 5, then it turns on my receiver and sets it to the DVD output, it tells the remote that the volume level on the remote is to control the receiver volume, not the TV volume and finally turns on my DVD player. I am not sure how much more intuitive it can be than to push one button that is marked "watch a movie" and you are done.

Nick

 

[Geno]

I have a Harmony and two Theatre Masters, and they both have their advantages and disadvantages.
The Harmony is, by far, the easiest to program using their great internet interface. In addition to the automatic programming, it has what they call "smart state" technology, which means the remote remembers what the status of each component is at the last command. If one of your components doesn't respond properly to its command, you can step through a "help" routine which corrects any errors. Women especially like Harmonys because they don't have to know anything about macros and programming.

On the other hand the Home Theatre Masters are more difficult to program macros into, but once you've figured them out, they are much easier to customize to your exact wants than the Harmonys. They're also very robust remotes, and very forgiving as far as their IR strength.
Of course, that's just my opinion...I could be wrong

 

[jcPanny]

Urc-300

I got the URC-300 remote with RF basestation for just over $100 from Amazon. I agree with the above feedback that it is harder to setup. I have to manually learn the commands from most of my devices, but I can use it anywhere in the house with the RF interface. If you want or need RF, then it is a good way to go because the Harmony w/ RF is about $300.

The harmony you got should be a great IR remote and easy to program.

 

[emorphien]

The manager at the electronics store told me that the HT Master is much more intuitive compared to the Harmony 880.

I doubt that is possible. I haven't seen anything as intuitive and simple as the Harmony remotes, it takes very little to get them up and running.

 

[agarwalro]

I have been using the Harmony 880 for some time now and could not be happier. I dont understand why some folks feel that it cant be used for "advanced" functions. Its all in the programming.

 

[jmanlp]

My life has been better since I got the 880, I no longer get calls at work from the wife, I no longer fear turning on my HT to watch TV because of all the remotes I had to find, and I know that I have a remote that will never be obsolete (until I go RF, but thats a different story). You can make the remote do as much or as little as you want, it is fully programmable and customizable, but you get to pick each command from an already loaded database.

 

[ronnie 1.8]

I have a Harmony remote. The fact that you managed a post on audio forum means you are already overqualified to setup the Harmony using their on line wizards. If I want to watch a movie, I hit "watch a movie" on the harmony. It turns on my TV and sets it to audio input 5, then it turns on my receiver and sets it to the DVD output, it tells the remote that the volume level on the remote is to control the receiver volume, not the TV volume and finally turns on my DVD player. I am not sure how much more intuitive it can be than to push one button that is marked "watch a movie" and you are done.

Nick

I've had the 880 for over a year, and love it. They have a great deal they can improve upon, for example, the customized buttons for 2 different activies that include my DVD player. If I add "HDMI format" to one activity, the software automatically adds it to my second activity, whether I want it there or not.

In the above example, my activity is very similar for watching a DVD, and in addition also puts my Denon AVR3805 at -15dB, puts it in mute, delays the plasma powering on until my DVD3930CI has loaded the disc (so I don't look at the player's wallpaper) and sets my Lutron dimmer to a specified brightness. And when I'm done eating dinner , I hit "scene 3", and the lights dim to a warm glow, just nice enough to enjoy my plasma without unnecessary eye strain. Then when I power off, all components are turned off, and my lights go to "scene 1", which is the brightest setting programmed into my dimmer. Not bright enough to bother our eyes, but bright enough to not trip over an ottoman leaving the room! Love love love the 880. And the biggest compliment is, my wife can (and does) use it for 2 activities (watch DVD, watch TiVo), even when I'm not around, and never gets "stuck". It's a fantastic product.

Side note: I'm really curious to see what Logitech has up their sleeves with the soon-to-be-released Harmony 1000. The 880 is so good, short of a few tweaks that have nothing to do with the shape, who is their userbase going to be? I'm certainly a candidate for a consumer of the product, but it actually seems it will be more cumbersome to use. But surely Logitech engineers have considered this. So, I'm very curious to experience the use of the 1000.

 

[MDS]

As a prior post said, each remote has advantages and disadvantages. Being that I own HT Master remotes (currently the MX-350) here is my take:

- The Harmony can be set up automagically using their web interface by simply telling it what components you have. This is nothing more than the standard 'pre-programmed' remotes but rather than entering setup codes, the web interface does it for you.

- Except for the higher end (and higher priced) HT Master models (MX-850), the HT Masters have to be programmed manually; ie you have to learn every command from the original remotes. I actually prefer that approach as you can put the command on any button you want in any mode. You can also change the programming from in front of the tv without having to connect the remote to your computer.

- The Harmony's 'macros' are limited. Some people like the idea that 'watch dvd' will turn off all components other than the dvd player and then setup the recevier for dvd viewing, but what if you don't want to turn off the cable box? The Harmony macros are not fine grained enough for me.

The button layout of the HTM is easier IMO than the Harmony which to me has far too many tiny little buttons spaced too closely together.

So which do you prefer - Easy web setup that may not be exactly what you want or the ability to customize the remote how you see fit (with a bit more effort of course).

They are both good remotes but for me I prefer the total control of the HTM remotes and the 'activity' based notion of the Harmony can also be used with the HTM remotes. The 'smart state' of the Harmony is for novices and offers no value in my opinion. All it does is maintain one bit for each component to track the on/off state and its help feature asks you 'is component x on or off' so it can change its internal state - great for the tech challenged babysitter but worthless for anyone else.

For you programmer types out there it should be obvious that to maintain the on/off state of 8 components requires one byte of memory and simple bit manipulations - not exactly rocket science.

 

[ronnie 1.8]

- The Harmony can be set up automagically using their web interface by simply telling it what components you have. This is nothing more than the standard 'pre-programmed' remotes but rather than entering setup codes, the web interface does it for you.

It can be found on Logitech's website, but I believe they have ten's of thousand's of devices in their database. Even an 11 year old VCR, and an older CD player that I own were in their database, and all components in my system were also included in Logitech's database. I did have to manually learn on average 1-2 commands for each device. And, providing binary (??, not sure, I'm not a programmer) codes I obtained from Denon, Logitech converted them to IR and added 0dB, -20dB, and -40dB to the available codes for the Denon AVR3805. I use the -40dB in all activities so I don't turn-on my system and get "blown away" because I had the volume high in my last acitivity (i.e., "DVDA", used for listening to audio DVD's).

- Except for the higher end (and higher priced) HT Master models (MX-850), the HT Masters have to be programmed manually; ie you have to learn every command from the original remotes. I actually prefer that approach as you can put the command on any button you want in any mode.

When an activity is created, Logitech does suggest default settings for the behavior of commonly-used commands. For example, 'volume down' is passed through the 'volume down' button on the 880. However, I think that button is too small, and control my volume in all activities via the up/down arrows right in the middle. They are larger, and easier to get to. Any IR code can be passed through to any tactile button one wishes, and of course, you can create your own customized buttons for display in the LCD screen.

You can also change the programming from in front of the tv without having to connect the remote to your computer.

True. I will say that with my notebook on my home's wireless network, I tweak my 880 while sitting in front of my TV. But I do need to connect it to my notebook via USB.

- The Harmony's 'macros' are limited. Some people like the idea that 'watch dvd' will turn off all components other than the dvd player and then setup the recevier for dvd viewing, but what if you don't want to turn off the cable box?

I never turned off my cable box when I had one. You simply go into "devices", choose the cable box's power options, and select the 3rd radio button, stating your cable box has no power off/on controls. It will then never be turned off/on automatically. I do this for my DVD player and monitor, as I wish to control precisely when they power on (i.e., I enter x seconds pause before "power on".). I then throw in the commands "power off" for each device upon exiting (powering off) the activity.

The button layout of the HTM is easier IMO than the Harmony which to me has far too many tiny little buttons spaced too closely together.

Agreed! Though I do get used to them, and have the advantage of smallish fingers. However, it's proving very difficult for my mom in-law, whose fingers are very large.

So which do you prefer - Easy web setup that may not be exactly what you want or the ability to customize the remote how you see fit (with a bit more effort of course).

I've put significant effort into the manner in which my activities are entered, and exited, and they behave exactly as I wish. I'm sure most people don't program the 880 to the extreme I do, but the options are there if one wishes. I'm certain I've tweaked my 880 literally hundreds of time, but I'm an obsessive perfectionist!

The 'smart state' of the Harmony is for novices and offers no value in my opinion. All it does is maintain one bit for each component to track the on/off state and its help feature asks you 'is component x on or off' so it can change its internal state - great for the tech challenged babysitter but worthless for anyone else.

When I leave the activity "TiVo HD", for example, to watch a DVD, while in the middle of a TiVo'd program, I simply hit "activities", to see all activities available on my 880, then "DVD-V", and like magic, all the correct components are on/off. But the smart state feature is bypassed when telling the 880 a device has no power off/on buttons, as I have for half my components. I believe the only component I allow the 880 to automatically turn off/on via smart state is my AVR. All other components I control by telling the 880 the device has no power off/on button.

Also, I'm in no way trying to say the 880 is better than brand x, as I have no experience with brand x. Just trying to lay the record straight for a few, I believe, misleading statements.

 

[Kai]

Even my lowly Harmony 659 performs much in the same way as the 880 and is loved by my wife.
She is a remotaphobiac, there I said it hehehe, and always complained about having to use multiple remotes. Now simply push a button and the activity you selected starts. It is not perfect but darn close.
I will be buying the 880 soon. Only because the coolness factor is superior to the 659. Perhaps there are some differences with the workings of both remotes but if it performs as well as the 659 I am one happy camper.

 

[ronnie 1.8]

Even my lowly Harmony 659 performs much in the same way as the 880 and is loved by my wife.
She is a remotaphobiac, there I said it hehehe, and always complained about having to use multiple remotes. Now simply push a button and the activity you selected starts. It is not perfect but darn close.
I will be buying the 880 soon. Only because the coolness factor is superior to the 659. Perhaps there are some differences with the workings of both remotes but if it performs as well as the 659 I am one happy camper.

According to Harmony support, all Harmony remotes have identical functionality. I managed a 659 (from northern Cal) for my in-law's (in southern Cal) for about a year. They would tell me they didn't quite like so and so, and I would tweak the behavior within their account, call and tell them to update their 659. The whole process worked well. Now they have the 880 (Santa brought it to them... ).

 

[Methodical]

What if their web site does not have your component? How is it programmed into the remote? - Harmony 880

 

[ronnie 1.8]

What if their web site does not have your component? How is it programmed into the remote? - Harmony 880

If you haven't already, I would suggest you call Harmony support. They may have your component under a category that isn't obvious.

If they truly do not have it, you simply identify the component yourself (under Add Device), and map each button of the source component to your 880. Very easy.

 

[Methodical]

If you haven't already, I would suggest you call Harmony support. They may have your component under a category that isn't obvious.

If they truly do not have it, you simply identify the component yourself (under Add Device), and map each button of the source component to your 880. Very easy.

Cool. From what I've been reading it seems to be a nice little remote, especially for the wife and kids. By the way, I am contemplating purchasing the remote - don't have it yet.

Thanks

 

[adk highlander]

I will add another vote for the WAF. Once this has been put in your house it will make it a much happier place.

Oh and before you buy look around. I picked mine up for 140 shipped.

 

[ronnie 1.8]

+1 for my personal WAF. There is absolutely no way she could use our system (not a reflection of her intelligence in any way) without a universal remote. And the 880 is just so easy to use - when programmed properly. I have all the necessary buttons in the display for each activity. It's really very easy to use.