Ukraine – Russia … not more of the last thread

SithZedi

SithZedi

Audioholic General
It's not like they have any real ideological connection. China is supporting Russia for entirely mercenary reasons - because the west supports Ukraine and also expecting reciprocal support from Russia for a possible invasion of Taiwan.

Yeah, I would agree that there are some African leaders in China's pockets, but I'm skeptical that it would have significant bearing on the matter.
Agree on ideological. With respect to the second point, I'll go with Frank's advice below:

 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Spartan
This seem to be great news, seems like Scholz and Germany is changing after the official visit to Kyiv and Bucha, the following below is posted in Ukraine now:

photo_2022-06-22 22.31.53.jpeg


After a trip to Ukraine, Scholz said that Germany would not be able to resume its partnership with the russian federation in the near future:

“Partnership with the russian federation, like the one that was listed as a goal in the 2010 strategic concept, is unimaginable anytime soon with putler´s aggressive imperialist russia.”

source: https://t.me/ukrainenowenglish/11497
 
mtrycrafts

mtrycrafts

Seriously, I have no life.
While it would be great if Asian and African countries would get on board with supporting Ukraine and observing sanctions against Russia, I can understand their lack of empathy and their self-interest.

I suspect their lack of concern is a reflection of Ukraine being - to paraphrase Neville Chamberlain - a "faraway country of which we know nothing". It's a squabble amongst white people and of no concern to them.

Why Africa does not appear to be ‘standing with Ukraine’ | Russia-Ukraine war | Al Jazeera

These countries tend to be poor/developing, depend on Russian wheat imports and, if they can score a deal on oil, that opportunity cannot be passed up.
I wonder who they would ask for help if they were in serious trouble.
 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Spartan
This seem to be great news, seems like Scholz and Germany is changing after the official visit to Kyiv and Bucha, the following below is posted in Ukraine now:

View attachment 56593

After a trip to Ukraine, Scholz said that Germany would not be able to resume its partnership with the russian federation in the near future:

“Partnership with the russian federation, like the one that was listed as a goal in the 2010 strategic concept, is unimaginable anytime soon with putler´s aggressive imperialist russia.”

source: https://t.me/ukrainenowenglish/11497
Can we trust Scholz?
Seels like he is changing opinions on things faster than I change socks? :rolleyes:
 
M

Mr._Clark

Audioholic Field Marshall
This seem to be great news, seems like Scholz and Germany is changing after the official visit to Kyiv and Bucha, the following below is posted in Ukraine now:

View attachment 56593

After a trip to Ukraine, Scholz said that Germany would not be able to resume its partnership with the russian federation in the near future:

“Partnership with the russian federation, like the one that was listed as a goal in the 2010 strategic concept, is unimaginable anytime soon with putler´s aggressive imperialist russia.”

source: https://t.me/ukrainenowenglish/11497
Russia's recent veiled threats to invade more countries may be waking them up.
 
Trell

Trell

Audioholic Ninja
Perhaps another miscalculation by Putin as this will hopefully make it abundantly clear to most Germans that Russia is not to be trusted and that any (large) energy dependency is bad.

>>>BERLIN, June 23 (Reuters) - Germany triggered the "alarm stage" of its emergency gas plan on Thursday in response to falling Russian supplies but stopped short of allowing utilities to pass on soaring energy costs to customers in Europe's largest economy.

The measure is the latest escalation in a standoff between Europe and Moscow since the Russian invasion of Ukraine that has exposed the bloc's dependence on Russian gas supplies and sparked a frantic search for alternative energy sources.

The step is largely symbolic, signalling to companies and households that painful cuts are on the way. But it marks a major shift for Germany, which cultivated strong energy ties with Moscow stretching back to the Cold War.

Lower gas flows sparked warnings this week that Germany could fall into recession if Russian supplies halted altogether. A major survey on Thursday showed the economy losing momentum in the second quarter. read more

"We must not fool ourselves: The cut in gas supplies is an economic attack on us by (Russian President Vladimir) Putin," Economy Minister Robert Habeck said in a statement. read more

Gas rationing would hopefully be avoided but cannot be ruled out, Habeck said and warned:

"From now on, gas is a scarce commodity in Germany ... We are therefore now obliged to reduce gas consumption, now already in summer."

Russia has denied the supply cuts were deliberate, with state supplier Gazprom (GAZP.MM) blaming a delay in return of serviced equipment caused by Western sanctions. The Kremlin on Thursday said Russia "strictly fulfils all its obligations" to Europe. ...<<<

 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Spartan

Hear the stories of Ukrainians who were forcibly resettled to Russia and escapedThe NYT

Since Russia invaded Ukraine in February, thousands of refugees from Ukraine have been sent to so-called filtration camps, where they have been interrogated and then forced to resettle to Russia.

Here are the accounts of some Ukrainians whose ordeal began when Russian forces attacked their home city of Mariupol.

source: https://t.me/ukrainenowenglish/11503
 
SithZedi

SithZedi

Audioholic General
This article begs the question: What in the name of sanity was the Czech Republic doing sitting on all those Soviet era weapons as a significant component of their military force? They are a NATO member so how were they ever going to contribute effectively to a NATO crisis with those weapons? Were they even testing this 30 to 40 year old equipment? As a requirement of being a NATO member, audits should be performed to see where the money is going.

 
Trell

Trell

Audioholic Ninja
This article begs the question: What in the name of sanity was the Czech Republic doing sitting on all those Soviet era weapons as a significant component of their military force? They are a NATO member so how were they ever going to contribute effectively to a NATO crisis with those weapons? Were they even testing this 30 to 40 year old equipment? As a requirement of being a NATO member, audits should be performed to see where the money is going.

It should be very obvious that upgrading to NATO standard will take many years and is very expensive. In the meantime the old weaponry is there and can be used when needed, and they where: In Ukraine.
 
GO-NAD!

GO-NAD!

Audioholic Spartan
This article begs the question: What in the name of sanity was the Czech Republic doing sitting on all those Soviet era weapons as a significant component of their military force? They are a NATO member so how were they ever going to contribute effectively to a NATO crisis with those weapons? Were they even testing this 30 to 40 year old equipment? As a requirement of being a NATO member, audits should be performed to see where the money is going.

The Czechs joined NATO in 1999. That may seem long enough to change over to western-supplied equipment, but current military procurement can be a painfully slow process - especially for one of the less affluent members. So, I'm not surprised by this.
 
Trell

Trell

Audioholic Ninja
The Czechs joined NATO in 1999. That may seem long enough to change over to western-supplied equipment, but current military procurement can be a painfully slow process - especially for one of the less affluent members. So, I'm not surprised by this.
That is also around the time when countries in Europe thought that they could reduce military expenditure as Russia as appeared to be much more friendly and not such a threat anymore. Then we got the Great Recession in 2008 that hit so many countries very hard, including relatively poor ones like the Czech Republic.
 
M

Mr._Clark

Audioholic Field Marshall
It looks like the U.S. will be sending more advanced shorter range surface to air defense missile systems (NASAMS) to Ukraine, along with “long-range air defense capabilities" of some sort.

It's better than nothing, but it doesn't seem like it's going to be enough to make a huge impact (that's just my impression based on what I've seen being reported from Ukraine, I have no special knowledge when it comes to this).

>>>As for the mention of “long-range air defense capabilities for the Ukrainians” in Sullivan’s statement, that remains a mystery. It may even refer to the future delivery of Patriot SAM systems, which would provide a highly capable upper-tier complement to the NASAMS, as well as bring a significant anti-ballistic missile capability. At this stage, however, there is no official word on other potential systems that might be headed to Ukraine and this could have been just how he described NASAMS.

In terms of NASAMS performance, the closest counterpart in Ukrainian service is likely the Cold War-era Buk (SA-11 Gadfly), a highly mobile tracked system that has reportedly been particularly successful but which has also suffered its fair share of attrition. The Buk has a maximum engagement range of 22 miles but shares the same problem as the S-300, in that only limited numbers (if any) are able to be transferred to Ukraine from NATO or other friendly nations.<<<


 
M

Mr._Clark

Audioholic Field Marshall
It looks like the U.S. will be sending more advanced shorter range surface to air defense missile systems (NASAMS) to Ukraine, along with “long-range air defense capabilities" of some sort.

It's better than nothing, but it doesn't seem like it's going to be enough to make a huge impact (that's just my impression based on what I've seen being reported from Ukraine, I have no special knowledge when it comes to this).

>>>As for the mention of “long-range air defense capabilities for the Ukrainians” in Sullivan’s statement, that remains a mystery. It may even refer to the future delivery of Patriot SAM systems, which would provide a highly capable upper-tier complement to the NASAMS, as well as bring a significant anti-ballistic missile capability. At this stage, however, there is no official word on other potential systems that might be headed to Ukraine and this could have been just how he described NASAMS.

In terms of NASAMS performance, the closest counterpart in Ukrainian service is likely the Cold War-era Buk (SA-11 Gadfly), a highly mobile tracked system that has reportedly been particularly successful but which has also suffered its fair share of attrition. The Buk has a maximum engagement range of 22 miles but shares the same problem as the S-300, in that only limited numbers (if any) are able to be transferred to Ukraine from NATO or other friendly nations.<<<
Here are a couple snips of Sullivan's statements concerning additional air defenses from earlier today:

>>>MR. SULLIVAN: So, he [Zelensky] did have some specific requests [when he spoke to Biden this morning]. His first request in the presentation he made was for further air defense systems. In particular, at the top of his mind was the set of missile strikes that took place in Kyiv and other cities across Ukraine, and his desire to get additional air defense capabilities that could shoot down Russian missiles out in sky. . . . So what I will tell you is this: that by the end of this week, we’ll make sure that you get some expert military briefers who can walk through what it will actually mean tangibly, in terms of the defense of Ukrainian airspace and particularly population centers. <<<


I have to believe that the NASAM deal has been in the works for some time, but the timing of the WH briefing seems to be tied to Russia's launch of cruise missiles from Belarusian airspace on Saturday:

>>>Russian forces launched missile attacks from Belarus on Saturday in the first strikes of their kind since Russia abandoned its offensives north and east of Kyiv.
A wave of six Russian Tu-22M3 “Backfire” bombers launched 12 Kh-22 cruise missiles from Belarusian airspace at ground targets in Kyiv, Chernihiv, and Sumy oblasts. The Ukrainian government claimed this is thus far the first time Russian aircraft have launched airstrikes on Ukrainian territory from Belarusian airspace.<<<


Unfortunately, Ukraine appears to have very little in the way of air defenses right now that can protect against this type of an attack.

And, the reported Russian supply of more advanced missiles to Belarus looks like it was triggered by Lukashenko getting uneasy about the consequences to Belarus for letting Russia use Belarus to launch attacks into Ukraine:

>>>WARSAW, Poland — Russia will provide nuclear-capable Iskander-M missiles to Belarus and upgrade the country’s fighter jets to allow them to carry tactical atomic weapons, President Vladimir Putin said over the weekend.

A “decision was made in our country: Within the next several months, we will transfer to Belarus the Iskander-M tactical missile systems, which are known to use both ballistic and cruise missiles, both conventional and nuclear,” Putin said on June 25 following a meeting with his Belarusian counterpart, Alexander Lukashenko.<<<


It might be just my imagination, but in recent photos Lukashenko looks like he's not sleeping well these days. I guess that's one consequence of getting into bed with the devil.
 
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