THX Select vs Select2

[gcmarshall]

Looking for general comments, information, etc., on the following topic for discussion--

The Yamaha RX-V4600 (THX Select2) manual specifically refers to THX Select2's ability to put out sound over 7.1 channels when reading a source that only has 5.1 encoding. Conversely, the RX-V2500's (THX Select) manual does not mention the ability to do this, yet it is called a 7.1 channel receiver. How does the 2500 put out 7 channel (versus only 5) if, presumably Select does not do what Select2 does (ie, play 7 channel when reading a 5.1 disc)? Mus the 2500 be presented with a 7.1 encoded disc in order to play sound out of all 7 channels?

Confused in THX land....comments, corrections, etc., welcome.

 

[WndrBr3d]

There's a great article on Audioholics discussing the differences straight from the horses mouth.

 

[gcmarshall]

Actually, that article discusses the difference between Select and Ultra2. My question relates to differences between Select and Select2 and how/if the Yam 2500 cannot do what the 4600 does in terms of 7.1 channel sound as described in my post. Thanks for the link, though.

 

[markw]

there is no such thing as 7.1 movies.

Looking for general comments, information, etc., on the following topic for discussion--

The Yamaha RX-V4600 (THX Select2) manual specifically refers to THX Select2's ability to put out sound over 7.1 channels when reading a source that only has 5.1 encoding. Conversely, the RX-V2500's (THX Select) manual does not mention the ability to do this, yet it is called a 7.1 channel receiver. How does the 2500 put out 7 channel (versus only 5) if, presumably Select does not do what Select2 does (ie, play 7 channel when reading a 5.1 disc)? Mus the 2500 be presented with a 7.1 encoded disc in order to play sound out of all 7 channels?

Confused in THX land....comments, corrections, etc., welcome.

There are hardly any 6.1 movies either. These "magical sixth and seventh channels" are derived somehow from the existing 5 or 6 channels and you either like the effect or you don't. In any case, they ain't "real" discrete channels like the original 5 or six channels

 

[aarond]

http://www.thx.com/mod/products/select2.html

 

[j_garcia]

There are hardly any 6.1 movies either. These "magical sixth and seventh channels" are derived somehow from the existing 5 or 6 channels and you either like the effect or you don't. In any case, they ain't "real" discrete channels like the original 5 or six channels

DTS-ES Discrete DOES have a discrete rear channel. DTS-ES Matrix, like Dolby Digital EX, does not, but they still create a pretty convincing rear surround on a properly setup system.

Hardly any 6.1 movies? Comparatively speaking yes, but 160+ titles isn't exactly a few.

 

[gcmarshall]

could the THX web site be any more vague about the comparison between select and select2? what in the heck does it mean when they say "THX Select brings superior performance to speakers and DVD players. THX Select Certified Products complement the presentation of the THX Select2 category." That doesn't tell me anything. Does the "Select" certification on my Yamaha RX-V2500 then mean nothing as it relates to my receiver. What does Select2 offer that Select does not in terms of my receivers processing? etc., etc. It all seems very vague to me. I still don't see what the "substance" is with THX Select vs. Select2......anyone, Bueller?

 

[j_garcia]

I didn't find it very useful either, but I would say the main point it was getting across is that it still applies to rooms that are under 2000cf. It means your receiver's amps meet the specifications that it can play at reference levels in a room that size or smaller and for processing, it has features such as RE-EQ, standard THX style 80Hz x-over, THX post processing, etc...

 

[markw]

How many discrete 7.1 channel movies are there?

DTS-ES Discrete DOES have a discrete rear channel. DTS-ES Matrix, like Dolby Digital EX, does not, but they still create a pretty convincing rear surround on a properly setup system.

Hardly any 6.1 movies? Comparatively speaking yes, but 160+ titles isn't exactly a few.

In the great scheme of things, and for how long it's been out, 160 is not a heckuva lot of movies.

 

[jcPanny]

Value of THX

I wouldn't worry to much about the THX certification on your new receiver. For example, the Denon 3805 and 3806 are very comparible in featues and power to the Yamaha 2500 and 2600. Denon doesn't pay THX for testing and liscensing so their receiver is not listed as such. Yamaha also has an HTR-5890 model without THX which is identical to the RX-V1500 which has THX.

Just pick the yamaha model (4600, 2600, or 2500) that matches your feature needs and budget.

 

[Thunder18]

THX Select vs. Select2

Select2 adds THX Games mode, that is pretty much the only difference.

 

[satwar]

could the THX web site be any more vague about the comparison between select and select2? what in the heck does it mean when they say "THX Select brings superior performance to speakers and DVD players. THX Select Certified Products complement the presentation of the THX Select2 category." That doesn't tell me anything. Does the "Select" certification on my Yamaha RX-V2500 then mean nothing as it relates to my receiver. What does Select2 offer that Select does not in terms of my receivers processing? etc., etc. It all seems very vague to me. I still don't see what the "substance" is with THX Select vs. Select2......anyone, Bueller?

THX certification is like a "Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval", it is a way for manufacturers to assure customers that they are getting a good performing system. You don't have to take the salesman's pitch at face value as being one of the best audio systems in the store. The "Ultra" family of certifications is for large HT setups (they specify a listening space volume but I don't remember offhand) and "Select" family of certifications for smaller HT setups.

The "Select" certification is applied to speaker and DVD player (etc) equipment, while "Select 2" certification is applied to receiver and amplifier equipment. Different certification for different types of equipment. Same applies to the "Ultra 2" certification process for receiver equipment, while the "Ultra" certification process applies to cables, speakers, DVD player (etc) equipment.

"Complimentary" means that equipment works well together for optimum performance by staying in the same family. If you buy an "Ultra 2" receiver it is preferable to hook up with "Ultra" cables rather than mixdown with "Select" or non-THX certified cables.

 

[mulester7]

THX certification is like a "Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval", it is a way for manufacturers to ensure customers that they are getting a good performing system. You don't have to take the salesman's pitch at face value as being one of the best audio systems in the store. The "Ultra" family of certifications is for large HT setups (they specify a listening space volume but I don't remember offhand) and "Select" family of certifications for smaller HT setups.

The "Select" certification is applied to speaker and DVD player (etc) equipment, while "Select 2" certification is applied to receiver and amplifier equipment. Different certification for different types of equipment. Same applies to the "Ultra 2" certification process for receiver equipment, while the "Ultra" certification process applies to cables, speakers, DVD player (etc) equipment.

"Complimentary" means that equipment works well together for optimum performance by staying in the same family. If you buy an "Ultra 2" receiver it is preferable to hook up with "Ultra" cables rather than mixdown with "Select" or non-THX certified cables.

.....Tonto, who is this newbie masked-man?.....excellent first post.....

 

[satwar]

.....Tonto, who is this newbie masked-man?.....excellent first post.....

Hi,

I am really a newbie, but I browse a lot in this forum trying to learn as much as I can.

 

[MDS]

Select2 is the newest version of the specifications for rooms under 2000 cubic feet. Ultra (now Ultra 2) is for rooms up to 3000 cubic feet.

Select can be applied to receivers and amps too. For reference, the Onkyo 700, 701, and 702 are THX Select certified whereas the just released 703 is THX Select 2 certified.

 

[markw]

good post but just a few questions.

Hi,

I am really a newbie, but I browse a lot in this forum trying to learn as much as I can.

You've prety much nailed the THX goals for speakers, receivers. and perhaps DVD players. With receivers THX has some selectable features and minimum performance standards and with speakers it has to do a lot with dispersion but please tell me, what determines a "THX" cable from a "regular" cable, much less a "Select THX" from a "ultra THX" cable?

IMNSHO, for all the differences in cables it seems to me to be more a marketing gimmick as opposed to a true "certification".

THX, along with specing some hardware requirements, also specifies strict placement of the speakers and the placement of seating within the area. Without these last two the "complimentary" impact of blindly looking for the THX certification on all your gear obviates the THX impact. It's just a bunch of features with no coherent goal, not unlike the Trans Am decals on 80's Firebirds.

IOW, you can get excellent sound without the THX certification on your gear. It's a mimimum standard which much good gear can easily surpass.

 

[satwar]

You've prety much nailed the THX goals for speakers, receivers. and perhaps DVD players. With receivers THX has some selectable features and minimum performance standards and with speakers it has to do a lot with dispersion but please tell me, what determines a "THX" cable from a "regular" cable, much less a "Select THX" from a "ultra THX" cable?

IMNSHO, for all the differences in cables it seems to me to be more a marketing gimmick as opposed to a true "certification".

THX, along with specing some hardware requirements, also specifies strict placement of the speakers and the placement of seating within the area. Without these last two the "complimentary" impact of blindly looking for the THX certification on all your gear obviates the THX impact. It's just a bunch of features with no coherent goal, not unlike the Trans Am decals on 80's Firebirds.

IOW, you can get excellent sound without the THX certification on your gear. It's a mimimum standard which much good gear can easily surpass.

I would be foolish, at my level of knowledge, to dispute the merits of THX certification. I was just trying to help explain the THX lingo that is a little confusing to understand. I have no idea what quantitative measures are taken in the certification, I just know that the certification process is an attempt to quantify performance quality. I can't agrue against the theory that a user can mess up the performance of good system by bad speaker placement.

 

[edwelly]

It's just a bunch of features with no coherent goal, not unlike the Trans Am decals on 80's Firebirds.

That has got to one of the coolest quotes ever...

 

[Ldog]

I wish THX would list the equipment they test that DON'T qualify or pass their testing.. I think it would be more helpful.. I bet with enough money you probably can get the THX logo on anything....

 

[Thunder18]

From the way I understand it, there are products that don't pass THX certification initially, they manufacturer is made aware of what needs to be changed and the the product is re-tested. THX is not going to test a product out of the blue. A particular manufacturer has to request(and pay) to have their product tested by THX.