Thoughts on Polaroid LCD at Circuit City?

[Adam]

Hey all.

Circuit City has a 46" 1080p Polaroid LCD (4641-TLXB) for $1300 right now. The limited reviews of it that I have found have been very positive.

I was just wondering if anyone here has any opinions on this TV. I'm thinking about finally upgrading from my 27" CRT with this model because of the positive reviews and the price.

Any input would be most welcome. Thanks!

Adam

 

[Joe Schmoe]

That is seriously cheap for a 46" (it would be pretty good even for a 42".) If you like the picture, it might be worth going for. (Not sure how to check reliability, though.)

 

[markw]

I thought polaroids were what Eskimos get from sitting on ice too long.

 

[MDS]

Note that this Polaroid brand is NOT the same Polaroid film company, nor is Westinghouse. The rights to the name were purchased and the company is the same as other lower cost producers that rebadge panels from other companies.

I know one person that bought a 32" Polaroid LCD and is happy with it but that of course is not suffcient to reach a conclusion to whether they are good or bad in general.

 

[stratman]

An off brand, make sure it has a great return policy/warranty. I can tell you about my nightmare with a Dell lcd I have, a rebadged Olevia, junk....and I'm being polite.

 

[OttoMatic]

After having read this, I'll probably stick with the big names.

 

[Adam]

Hey, thanks everyone for your feedback. OttoMatic, great link. Since my post a couple of weeks ago, I had already decided to skip the Polaroid. I'm still pretty much stuck on getting a Toshiba.

 

[croseiv]

Wow! Very, very good info indeed. I too looked at Polaroid, but felt that the price seemed, well, too good. It looks like that is the case. I'm very glad I chose Samsung....

 

[stratman]

Yup Dell/Olevia won't fix it after warranty, they try and sell you another.

 

[hemiram]

Why would they think you would buy another "dead end" TV from them after you got burned the first time?

This is as dopey a business model as the old (and sadly still happening) car dealers that screwed people over, or treated them badly, and then wondered why they didn't sell them another car/truck to you.

Having dealt with several of these dealers over the years, it always cracks me up when I run into one of them and refuse to take their card when they try to give it to me. I bought my present truck online, except for the actual signing of the papers, and it went as smooth as it could be. I told him what I was looking for, he didn't have anything on the lot I wanted, and the next day, he sent me three invoices, with the invoice prices on them, of trucks that matched what I asked for that were at close by dealers. We shot a few emails back and forth that afternoon, and set the final price the next morning. I picked the truck up two days later.

At this point, I have no patience with people who play games, and it seems like the cheap LCD makers are using a business plan that will backfire in the long run.

 

[markw]

Well now, this is certainly scary.

After having read this, I'll probably stick with the big names.

I'm glad I bit the bullet and bought a Toshiba last October.

But a lot of people will but the bigggest for the least and hope no problems arise. I wonder what the odds of that are?

It would be interesting to see the results of a study done three, four or more years a ter the initial purchase to see how many repairs were needed or how many actually survived intact.

Of course, for a poll like this, it will take a few years to build up the sample base.

 

[budbrande]

Actually, out of warranty repairs are not cheap on any television. My six year old Pioneer died two years ago and the bill along with the in home service call was almost $500! I am a Toshiba dealer and recently had a customer call me complaining about the cost to repair their 32" Toshiba LCD television. The total was almost $600.

Anyway, to get back to the subject of purchasing a cheap LCD television here is a little information that may be of interest. Lets take Circuit City for example. Regular and sale prices at Circuit City are not written in stone. Just like buying a car it does not hurt to try and talk the salesman down on the price of the item. For example, my wife wanted a LCD television in our bedroom but after spending so much money on my living room theater I did not want to spend a fortune. I ended up buying a Vizio 37" LCD from Circuit City. It was marked at $799. I walked out with the television and a three year in home service warranty for get this, $799! Sure I had to haggle but i'm a salesman and that is what we do! Even better, I got 18 months no interest on the deal! I realize that in three years I may be on my own but then again I could be like my customer who just spent $600 on his Toshiba that he owned for just under two years. I am pretty sure in three years a 37" LCD televisions will be under $600 so for the cost of repair you just buy another one!

Most electronics are getting like this. Out of warranty repairs are almost as much as the cost of new on many items and I figure televisions are going to be this way sooner or later. Just remember that you can shop smart and don't be afraid to try and get a better deal!

 

[stratman]

The trend has been buy a warranty or replace the component. Dell does not repair their tvs. If you didn't buy a warranty you're out of luck when it needs service.

 

[markw]

Now this raises some questions...

Actually, out of warranty repairs are not cheap on any television. My six year old Pioneer died two years ago and the bill along with the in home service call was almost $500! I am a Toshiba dealer and recently had a customer call me complaining about the cost to repair their 32" Toshiba LCD television. The total was almost $600.

Anyway, to get back to the subject of purchasing a cheap LCD television here is a little information that may be of interest. Lets take Circuit City for example. Regular and sale prices at Circuit City are not written in stone. Just like buying a car it does not hurt to try and talk the salesman down on the price of the item. For example, my wife wanted a LCD television in our bedroom but after spending so much money on my living room theater I did not want to spend a fortune. I ended up buying a Vizio 37" LCD from Circuit City. It was marked at $799. I walked out with the television and a three year in home service warranty for get this, $799! Sure I had to haggle but i'm a salesman and that is what we do! Even better, I got 18 months no interest on the deal! I realize that in three years I may be on my own but then again I could be like my customer who just spent $600 on his Toshiba that he owned for just under two years. I am pretty sure in three years a 37" LCD televisions will be under $600 so for the cost of repair you just buy another one!

Most electronics are getting like this. Out of warranty repairs are almost as much as the cost of new on many items and I figure televisions are going to be this way sooner or later. Just remember that you can shop smart and don't be afraid to try and get a better deal!

I haven't taken apart my LCD and I'm not gonna, but what makes them tick?

I can see where the LCD/plasma going bad can call the game, but isn't there other circuitry that can go bad and be replaced, or the odds against that?

Unless, of course, they are all on one big, soldered PCB which makes component level troubleshooting near impossible?

The reason I ask is that I made $$ in high school in the 60's with a small home TV repair shop and most of the fixes were bad tubes. Troubleshooting was another story but it could be done. I got out when SS came into play and modules came into play. No way a little giuy could afford to keep stock of them.

 

[stratman]

I haven't taken apart my LCD and I'm not gonna, but what makes them tick?

I can see where the LCD/plasma going bad can call the game, but isn't there other circuitry that can go bad and be replaced, or the odds against that?

Unless, of course, they are all on one big, soldered PCB which makes component level troubleshooting near impossible?

The reason I ask is that I made $$ in high school in the 60's with a small home TV repair shop and most of the fixes were bad tubes. Troubleshooting was another story but it could be done. I got out when SS came into play and modules came into play. No way a little giuy could afford to keep stock of them.

My father in law took a Westinghouse lcd for repairs at a rare local electronics repair shop, a faulty power supply and a small board (didn't remember which) came out to 475.00 on a tv that costs about 600.00, t'aint wort it sheriff.

 

[hemiram]

I guess the cheap TV makers figure that if everyone buys the warranty, they won't be pissed in three years or so when it dies, probably just after the warranty expires. If so, they are mistaken.


I've had quite a few things over the years that made no sense to fix, as the parts were unavailable (Usually a custom IC that wasn't made in huge quantities), or insanely priced (A TV I had once needed a flyback, and the damn thing was like half the price it was new, and it wasn't a cheap TV).

I used to have a pile of handheld scanners that had dead CPU's sitting in my closet, but over time, I found other corpses and got them all going and then sold them off. Paying to get them fixed the normal way would have been crazy, but buying a dead scanner for 10 bucks and selling the repaired original for a hundred bucks isn't bad.

I'm looking for a website that has pics of a dead cheapo LCD TV taken apart. I want to see what's in there. If it's as bad as a couple of the LCD PC monitors I've tried (and sometimes have successfully) to fix, I can see why they don't want to even try to mess with them. One of the monitors I opened up had hot glue holding almost everything together, and just getting the back off was a huge puzzle, there was a screw hidden under a little plate that itself was glued into the back. I just got lucky and saw it had an edge that seemed to be seperate from the rest of the back. There were "strings" of glue all over the inside of it, and they managed to put the two PC boards inside it without screws, using the hot glue method. What a mess. That monitor new cost about $400! A $500 Sony monitor wasn't a lot better, but it didn't have hot glue in it, maybe they should have used some, a plug had popped off.

 

[Joe Schmoe]

I guess the cheap TV makers figure that if everyone buys the warranty, they won't be pissed in three years or so when it dies, probably just after the warranty expires. If so, they are mistaken.

Yeah. There are people who think that 3 years of good performance for $1000 is a good deal, but I am not one of them. For that kind of money, I expect at least 15 years!

 

[Hi Ho]

I haven't taken apart my LCD and I'm not gonna, but what makes them tick?

I can see where the LCD/plasma going bad can call the game, but isn't there other circuitry that can go bad and be replaced, or the odds against that?

Unless, of course, they are all on one big, soldered PCB which makes component level troubleshooting near impossible?

The reason I ask is that I made $$ in high school in the 60's with a small home TV repair shop and most of the fixes were bad tubes. Troubleshooting was another story but it could be done. I got out when SS came into play and modules came into play. No way a little giuy could afford to keep stock of them.

I'm not a technician but I work at one of those rare repair shops and in my experience LCD and plasma TVs have been extremely reliable. That said, we don't work on Westinghouse, Olevia, Polaroid, etc. mainly because our suppliers do not supply parts for those brands. We only sell brands that we have found to be reliable. Mitsubishi, Sharp, Panasonic, Sony, Pioneer, Pioneer Elite, Samsung (LCD panels only). Of course there are other good brands out their and we to work on all the major brands except for Phillips/Magnovox which has a very poor track record.

I can only recall two LCD sets that have come in for repair. One was a Sharp that was hit hard by a power surge, another was a Sony 46" XBR3 with a bad LCD panel. The Sharp needed a new power supply board and Sharp covered the cost even though it was out of warranty. The Sony was under warranty.

The most likely thing to go in an LCD is a power supply board, or so I hear. The same seems to be true with plasma sets.

Rear projection sets are a completely different story. The most common problem, by far, on CRT based projections sets is failure of the convergence board ICs. This typically costs $200-$400 to repair.

When it comes to microdisplays (DLP, LcOS, LCD) everything changes again. It varies greatly by brand. Samsung has been, by far, the worst when it comes to reliablity of their microdisplay sets. When we sold them there was an 80% failure rate. That is completely unacceptable and needless to say we no longer carry them. Light engine failure (color wheel, optics, or DM board) is the most common problem with Samsung microdisplays. Replacement light engines start at around $600 and go up from there.

Sony has also had light engine problems, though not to the extent that Samsung has. The green blob is widely documented in online forums and I am here to confirm that it definetely does exist. Luckily Sony is fixing them at no cost. Some Sony LCD RP sets have suffered from what I call the star field effect where the blue LCD panel fails and blue dots grace the screen.

Mitsubishi had what I would consider a lemon about two years ago. The WD-**525 series was their most troublesome line we've ever encountered. It was mostly DM boards.

TV repairs are expensive. My advice is to stick with a name brand with a good reputation. If you're really concerned I would get an extended warranty, especially if you're purchasing a microdisplay set.

 

[MDS]

You know I keep putting off my purchase of a big screen TV. Isn't it kind of ironic/funny/discomforting that after more than 50 years since the invention of TV that NOT ONE TV ever shipped has an accurate gray scale?

Salesman push the extended warranty first and foremost beause it makes the company big money but in some cases you could almost justify it because the brand new, multi-thousand dollar, TV you just bought is basically a piece of junk that will fail in no time.

It is beyond my understanding how any company could ship a TV that is known to have bands, clouds, or green/red/blue push and yet it seems that every single brand has one problem or another - and yet still commands a very high price. I guess I'll just wait a little longer.

 

[Hi Ho]

I agree, MDS. I wouldn't buy a TV with known problems. Obviously a lot of people just deal with it or don't care. I have never been all that impressed with the Sony XBR2/3 sets but the salesmen sure do push them. I see the infamous clouding issues on those sets and it really puts me off. I personally think the Sharp LCDs look best but they don't pull as big of a profit so the salesmen don't push them as hard. I also have never seen the banding issue that so many, including yourself, seem to be worried about on Sharp LCDs. I have setup many Sharp D62U sets and all have had no issues. The same goes for the D92U line. I know you were leaning towards the Sharp sets. I say go for it! You'll wait forever if you keep waiting for the perfect display. That will never exist. There will always be something that isn't quite right.