The Sound Quality of the B&K 507

[DarkDTSes]

Hello,

I've read many good things about the B&K 307. The only negative was that it's highs could sound a little "harsh" or "bright". This was just from one reviewer on one of the more well known online equipment review sites. Is this true? Love to hear from owners or people who have auditioned this AVR.

Thanks!!

 

[zipper]

I have a friend who just got a 507 about 6 months ago & has it driving an Axiom setup of M50's,QS4's,an EP-175 sub,& I'm not sure which center. I'm impressed with it. I've heard it in listening rooms as well & it's as good a sounding receiver as I've heard, although I've not heard the ZX-9 or the 5803. I think he got his on sale for about $2400, so considering the price difference between it & other flagships I think it would be tough to do much better. I'm not real fond of the display but I think that's because I'm used to Yamaha's. It's a classy looking piece with a simple display. I think it's anything but "bright", of course that will depend what you're trying to drive with it.

 

[DarkDTSes]

I have a friend who just got a 507 about 6 months ago & has it driving an Axiom setup of M50's,QS4's,an EP-175 sub,& I'm not sure which center. I'm impressed with it. I've heard it in listening rooms as well & it's as good a sounding receiver as I've heard, although I've not heard the ZX-9 or the 5803. I think he got his on sale for about $2400, so considering the price difference between it & other flagships I think it would be tough to do much better. I'm not real fond of the display but I think that's because I'm used to Yamaha's. It's a classy looking piece with a simple display. I think it's anything but "bright", of course that will depend what you're trying to drive with it.

Hello Zipper,

I agree with you 100%. Whether it sounds bright/harsh could depend on what speakers one is using (in addition to things like the room acoustics...etc.). Just wanted to hear from users and people who have demo'd the AVR any way.

I mean back in the mid-90s Yamaha AVRs were infamous for sounding ultra harsh regardless of what speakers they were powering or other variables. I heard a Yamaha/B&W combo that was downright painful!! I had to end the demo right there it was so bad. But recently it appears Yamaha has fixed things with the RVX1400/2400 models and probably the newest 1500/2500 models. My buddy bought the 1400 a while back and matched them with PSB Image speakers. I was expecting to be in for some pain but was pleasantly surprised to hear a "comfortable" sound. Even if he didn't get a chance to crank it up that time.

Any how, thanks for you input...hope to read more opinions from users and others.

 

[stiletto pat]

B&k Avr-507

DarkDTSes,

This past spring, I compared the B&K AVR-507 against the Denon 5803 (I think) and the Yamaha Z1, and determined that to my ears, the B&K was sonically superior. I listened to the different receivers on reasonably high end Martin Logans, Boston Acoustics, Monitor Audio Golds and a high end Italian line whose name I can't now recall. My distinct impression was that the Yamaha and Denon tended to somewhat "color" the sound, while when listening to the B&K was akin to raising a veil, and hearing everything more clearly.

I bought the B&K, and paired it with Paradigm Studio Reference Series 3's 100s, CC-470 and ADP-470s, with a HSU TN-1220 Sub, driven through the HSU 500 Watt SubAmp. I am extremely happy with the sound, and everyone that hears my system claims to be blown away.

In short, I wholeheartedly recommend the receiver. I plan to upgrade the unit to the Series 2 at some point in the future, and that, in my opinion, is one of the nice things about the B&K line. i.e., it's nice being able to upgrade the software / firmware, rather than just having to sell off your box and buy a new one.

Go and listen, and let us know what you decide.

Pat Frye

 

[zipper]

Wow Pat..........the 100 v3's must sound as smooth as warm butter driven by the 507.........I'd like to hear that combo.

 

[DarkDTSes]

DarkDTSes,

This past spring, I compared the B&K AVR-507 against the Denon 5803 (I think) and the Yamaha Z1, and determined that to my ears, the B&K was sonically superior. I listened to the different receivers on reasonably high end Martin Logans, Boston Acoustics, Monitor Audio Golds and a high end Italian line whose name I can't now recall. My distinct impression was that the Yamaha and Denon tended to somewhat "color" the sound, while when listening to the B&K was akin to raising a veil, and hearing everything more clearly.

I bought the B&K, and paired it with Paradigm Studio Reference Series 3's 100s, CC-470 and ADP-470s, with a HSU TN-1220 Sub, driven through the HSU 500 Watt SubAmp. I am extremely happy with the sound, and everyone that hears my system claims to be blown away.

In short, I wholeheartedly recommend the receiver. I plan to upgrade the unit to the Series 2 at some point in the future, and that, in my opinion, is one of the nice things about the B&K line. i.e., it's nice being able to upgrade the software / firmware, rather than just having to sell off your box and buy a new one.

Go and listen, and let us know what you decide.

Pat Frye

Hiya Pat,

Thank you for your input! I'm actually considering the Paradigm Reference Studios with the B&K 507. Which is why I was particularly glad to read your comment/experience. Is there any reason why you opted not to go with the CC-570? Also, how are the dipole surrounds? Do they do their job in offering you a "diffuse" sound? Or at times do you find them "too vague"? As in some films sometimes you want to be able to localize the sfx.

I'm also considering a PSB Stratus speaker setup. One of the major reasons why I'm considering the B&K as it can deliver 4 ohms loads. Not too many AVRs can. Most are listed as 8 & 6 ohms as you are probably aware.

I haven't heard the Paradigm v3 yet but have heard the previous versions. Have always been happy with what I've heard. But I do admit to finding the PSB Stratus Goldi's more "musical", with a better midrange (possibly why I considered them more musical), and does a noticeably better job (than the v2) in terms of "imaging". As the reviewers say, when I was listening to the PSB Stratus Goldi's/Marantz SR7200 AVR I had to concentrate on the task at hand which was to audition the speaker. Found myself relaxing and enjoying the music instead.

But, I haven't written off the Paradigms at all. I have Paradigms right now. The Performance series from 1995 (and an old Denon recevier). Love the sound. But am in need of an upgrade.

Btw...I'm guessing you didn't find the highs on the B&K to be either "bright" or "harsh" sounding?

Have a good week!! If by chance there are any B&K owners with PSB Stratus speakers PLEASE chime in! Oh, I will definitely let every one here know what I end up with...

 

[mtrycrafts]

Hello Zipper,

I agree with you 100%. Whether it sounds bright/harsh could depend on what speakers one is using (in addition to things like the room acoustics...etc.). Just wanted to hear from users and people who have demo'd the AVR any way.

I mean back in the mid-90s Yamaha AVRs were infamous for sounding ultra harsh regardless of what speakers they were powering or other variables. I heard a Yamaha/B&W combo that was downright painful!! I had to end the demo right there it was so bad. But recently it appears Yamaha has fixed things with the RVX1400/2400 models and probably the newest 1500/2500 models. My buddy bought the 1400 a while back and matched them with PSB Image speakers. I was expecting to be in for some pain but was pleasantly surprised to hear a "comfortable" sound. Even if he didn't get a chance to crank it up that time.

Any how, thanks for you input...hope to read more opinions from users and others.

One must be very careful how they compare any audio component for sonic differences. Human bias enters the picture and cannot be controlled unless, of course, one does a blind comparison, not knowing what is in play, and carefully level matched so there is no confusion about level differences causing differences.

Frequency response is a good indicator of a components transparency. Well designed component, excluding speakers, are below the threshold of differentiation within their design specifications of course.

 

[DarkDTSes]

One must be very careful how they compare any audio component for sonic differences. Human bias enters the picture and cannot be controlled unless, of course, one does a blind comparison, not knowing what is in play, and carefully level matched so there is no confusion about level differences causing differences.

Frequency response is a good indicator of a components transparency. Well designed component, excluding speakers, are below the threshold of differentiation within their design specifications of course.

Hello mtrycrafts,

Very true! Unfortunately such opportunities are unavailble to most of us. Unless we've struck a good relationship with that shop and have given them tens of thousands of dollars worth of buisness...to allow for home "blind a/b tests".

In my case, I live in Toronto, and for the past 5 odd years B&K has not been selling their wares in my country. For reasons I can't accept...but that's another story for another day. So, being as there are no B&K products sold here people like me have to rely on reviews and forums.

Any how, thanks for your input! And I hope to hear from many other people. Especially owners of the 507 (and PSB Stratus speakers? Paradigm Reference speakers?).

Late people.

 

[stiletto pat]

AVR-507 Experiences

DarkDTSes,

Glad my input could be of help. Let me address a few issues.

First, I did the best I could at a "semi-blind" ABC test. I actually was favoring the Yamaha going into the test, having read all the reviews at Audioholics and other sites. I went to a Sound Advice Store (Tweeters) in Florida, midweek, early afternoon, when it was essentially empty, dressed in a business suit (late lunch), so the Manager waited on me, and was willing to show me his top products for an extended time period. I sat facing the speakers, while he switched between the componentry. It wasn't a quick endeavor - the B&K earned my respect. I even AB tested it against the Ref 50 Preamp and 200.7 amp, and it was indistinguishable up until about +7 db on the B&K volume indicator - which I will submit to you as being exceptionally loud. At that point, the separates began to show why they were superior, but as I've remarked to many of my friends, that is divorce territory, anyway.

Next, as to the Paradigms. I seriously auditioned somewhere around 15 to 20 different brands of mid-high end speakers, over a 8 month period, and found that I was most impressed with the sound of the Paradigm Studio Reference Series. I think you have to come up with some type of relationship - how much you're willing to spend to get the sound, and the Paradigms seemed a bargain to me. While looking, Paradigm introduced the Series 3s, which were a huge step forward over the Series 2s, in my opinion. I continued to listen to them at several different dealers - one even overdrove them to the point of distortion (huge amps), then when he lowered the volume, they went right back to sounding as sweet as ever. I was suitably impressed.

The CC-470 was the recommendation of a couple of the dealers, after I outlined what I felt my system configuration was going to be. My room size is 17.5 x 22 x 10, with large open spaces on 2 sides. The dealers felt that the driver configuration in the CC-470 more closely approximates the vocal information that the center channel traditionally imparts. I have been extremely pleased with the balance - it's extremely clear just for listening to plain old TV, and it wonderful as well for music or movies. As a system, I think the system provides excellent frequency response across the spectrum, with incredible imaging and clarity.

The dipole surrounds are great. Having timbre matched speakers are the only way to go, and these are essentially two sets of drivers from the Monitor 20s. The tweeters and mids are just so nice (same as what populates the CC-470) that it's a joy to listen to great music. I would like to move them to the side positions at some point in the future, but I still love them. My advice to you if you're going to use them for rear channels in a 5.1 configuration is to mount them closer to your seated head height - 4 to 6 feet above the ground. That way, you'll hear them a bit easier. My height was preordained at about 9 feet, so I just increased their relative volume levels with the B&K controls. I will admit that they are poerhaps a little more vague than direct enclosures, but there are times when you will be very happy with that. Mine are mounted near a bar area, and I find that at low volumes, (like mingling cocktail parties) they really fill the space with clean, low volume sound. I am thrilled with them for movies - Master and Commander was unreal on this system - the cannon shots and breaking wood masts, etc... as are the Pixar movies. Overall, I think I'd choose the same speakers again.

Hope this is helpful. Be advised that Paradigm introduced a new super high end speaker just as I was purchasing my speakers, but I never was able to listen to them prior to my purchase. I have heard them since, and while extremely nice, you'll need to be able to drop some large money on them. I think the major advance is the wonderful wood cabnetry, as the sound is only marginally better. But this is for you to decide. I just think the value proposition of the Studio Reference Series makes them the clear winner in the Paradigm line up.

Good luck with your shopping, and let us know how you proceed.

Pat

 

[DarkDTSes]

DarkDTSes,

Glad my input could be of help. Let me address a few issues.

First, I did the best I could at a "semi-blind" ABC test. I actually was favoring the Yamaha going into the test, having read all the reviews at Audioholics and other sites. I went to a Sound Advice Store (Tweeters) in Florida, midweek, early afternoon, when it was essentially empty, dressed in a business suit (late lunch), so the Manager waited on me, and was willing to show me his top products for an extended time period. I sat facing the speakers, while he switched between the componentry. It wasn't a quick endeavor - the B&K earned my respect. I even AB tested it against the Ref 50 Preamp and 200.7 amp, and it was indistinguishable up until about +7 db on the B&K volume indicator - which I will submit to you as being exceptionally loud. At that point, the separates began to show why they were superior, but as I've remarked to many of my friends, that is divorce territory, anyway.

Interesting to note. But did you or do you find the highs the least bit "bright" or "harsh" sounding as some reviewers have claimed? That's really the only sticking point for me...that and not knowing if B&K will be offering an upgrade for HDMI support.

While I know I can connect my source equipment directly to my future projector I would like the option of being able to perform video switching at the AVR.

I know the upcoming Denon 4806 will have 3 HDMI in/1 HDMI out. DVI support. I also heard it will be a built-in DVDO scaler built-in. The list of special features is long. Sounds very attractive. And is my other choice. It's just that I've heard a lot of good things about B&K. Which is why i started this thread in the first place.

The CC-470 was the recommendation of a couple of the dealers, after I outlined what I felt my system configuration was going to be. My room size is 17.5 x 22 x 10, with large open spaces on 2 sides. The dealers felt that the driver configuration in the CC-470 more closely approximates the vocal information that the center channel traditionally imparts. I have been extremely pleased with the balance - it's extremely clear just for listening to plain old TV, and it wonderful as well for music or movies. As a system, I think the system provides excellent frequency response across the spectrum, with incredible imaging and clarity.

You never asked about the CC-570s? Was there a specific reason why the 470 was recommended instead? I mean technically. Besides knowing what your room/system config would be.

The dipole surrounds are great. Having timbre matched speakers are the only way to go, and these are essentially two sets of drivers from the Monitor 20s. The tweeters and mids are just so nice (same as what populates the CC-470) that it's a joy to listen to great music. I would like to move them to the side positions at some point in the future, but I still love them. My advice to you if you're going to use them for rear channels in a 5.1 configuration is to mount them closer to your seated head height - 4 to 6 feet above the ground. That way, you'll hear them a bit easier. My height was preordained at about 9 feet, so I just increased their relative volume levels with the B&K controls. I will admit that they are poerhaps a little more vague than direct enclosures, but there are times when you will be very happy with that. Mine are mounted near a bar area, and I find that at low volumes, (like mingling cocktail parties) they really fill the space with clean, low volume sound. I am thrilled with them for movies - Master and Commander was unreal on this system - the cannon shots and breaking wood masts, etc... as are the Pixar movies. Overall, I think I'd choose the same speakers again.

I definitely would like to try using dipoles for surrounds next. Though, I guess it becomes a personal choice. As in some movies some surround sfx you DO want to be able to localize the sound instead of having a vague idea. Whereas, at other times, you want a diffuse sound for ambience.

Hope this is helpful. Be advised that Paradigm introduced a new super high end speaker just as I was purchasing my speakers, but I never was able to listen to them prior to my purchase. I have heard them since, and while extremely nice, you'll need to be able to drop some large money on them. I think the major advance is the wonderful wood cabnetry, as the sound is only marginally better. But this is for you to decide. I just think the value proposition of the Studio Reference Series makes them the clear winner in the Paradigm line up.

Good luck with your shopping, and let us know how you proceed.

Pat

Yes, I know about their "elite" line. Well out of my future budget.

I've heard the same being said for PSB's new "elite" line of speakers. That while there is an improvment in sound of the Stratus series the improvement is also "incremental". In other words not really worth the substantial jump in asking price.

Any how, you're input is always appreciated! And YES I will definitely let every one on this thread know if I end up with the 507 or Denon 4806. Have a good weekend!

 

[stiletto pat]

B&K AVR-507

DarkDTSes,

Let me address some of your questions.

1. I do not feel that the sound of the B&K is harsh, bright or dull. It is clear, true and accurate. It has the ability to be very warm or very bright, depending upon the source material. In shourt, I am very discriminating about my sound, and if the unit had all the features in the world but didn't sound good, I wouldn't have purchased the B&K. In short, I believe that the sound of the B&K combined with the Paradigms represents an outstanding matchup.

2. I'm not using the HDMI interfaces, so I really can't address your concerns with any authority. Right now, I'm only using Super video, but soon hopefully, a new HD Plasma will be sitting in my cabinet...

3. Several of the dealers suggested that the drivers utilized in the CC-570 were not as optimized for voice reproduction as those in the CC-470. The CC-470 uses the same tweeter and midrange drivers as the 100s and ADP-470. From my experience, I must tell that you that it just sounds extremely sweet. When I listened to the CC-570, although I liked it, I came away with the feeling the CC-470 was a better sounding solution, was less bulky, weighed less, and cost less, as well. To me, it was a matter of bigger is not always better. But hey, you should definately listen for yourself and make your own decision.

Hope this helps you.

Pat

 

[DarkDTSes]

DarkDTSes,

Let me address some of your questions.

1. I do not feel that the sound of the B&K is harsh, bright or dull. It is clear, true and accurate. It has the ability to be very warm or very bright, depending upon the source material. In shourt, I am very discriminating about my sound, and if the unit had all the features in the world but didn't sound good, I wouldn't have purchased the B&K. In short, I believe that the sound of the B&K combined with the Paradigms represents an outstanding matchup.

2. I'm not using the HDMI interfaces, so I really can't address your concerns with any authority. Right now, I'm only using Super video, but soon hopefully, a new HD Plasma will be sitting in my cabinet...

3. Several of the dealers suggested that the drivers utilized in the CC-570 were not as optimized for voice reproduction as those in the CC-470. The CC-470 uses the same tweeter and midrange drivers as the 100s and ADP-470. From my experience, I must tell that you that it just sounds extremely sweet. When I listened to the CC-570, although I liked it, I came away with the feeling the CC-470 was a better sounding solution, was less bulky, weighed less, and cost less, as well. To me, it was a matter of bigger is not always better. But hey, you should definately listen for yourself and make your own decision.

Hope this helps you.

Pat

Hello Pat,

Thanks for commenting! Always appreciated!!

Glad to know more of how you feel about the sound quality coming from the B&K. I ask these questions because I live in Canada and they don't sell B&K products here. And I would have no way of auditioning a B&K AVR unless I convinced one of my buddies to purchase one first. Or unless I "happened" to be in NYC on a business trip in which case I could have dropped into Andrew Singer's shop for an audition.

Thats any interesting fact about the CC-470 vs the CC-570. I've actually heard someone else say the same thing. Guess I WILL have to go see for myself when I find the time. Assuming they have both centers handy. After listening to the 570 you didn't feel the 470 was lacking anything?

Have a nice weekend!

 

[stiletto pat]

B&K AVR-507 & Paradigm Studio Reference Series Speakers

DarkDTSes,

I think that the CC-570 is a bigger, bolder speaker than the CC-470, but I'm not so certain that this quality is what one wants out of a Center Channel Speaker. I think that you need to be able to reproduce vocal information, since that seems to be the predominant information that is routed to the Center Channel Speaker. To that extent, I felt that the CC-470 excelled, even over the CC-570. Again, I have to respectfully suggest that you listen for yourself and make your own judgments. You should certainly be able to find Paradigm dealers in Canada.

Pat

 

[DarkDTSes]

DarkDTSes,

I think that the CC-570 is a bigger, bolder speaker than the CC-470, but I'm not so certain that this quality is what one wants out of a Center Channel Speaker. I think that you need to be able to reproduce vocal information, since that seems to be the predominant information that is routed to the Center Channel Speaker. To that extent, I felt that the CC-470 excelled, even over the CC-570. Again, I have to respectfully suggest that you listen for yourself and make your own judgments. You should certainly be able to find Paradigm dealers in Canada.

Pat

Hey Pat,

Well, being as the vast majority of the movie information does come from the center wouldn't it make sense to get the most capable center? Which if you're looking at the specs alone...make that choie be the 570? With it's dedicated drivers? I mean, the "experts" recommend that we buy the best center we can afford. Now whether the 470 or the 570 is a better fit sonically will be up to the person doing the listening (room acoustics, amp used...etc.). You said it was the 470. As I said, I have yet ot go audition the v3 series at all.

Both center speakers use the same tweeters so the voice information should sound the same. it's when the center is called upon to deliver some mids and lows is where I am "assuming" would set them apart.

But who knows? As you said, the 470 does seem to share 2 of the same drivers as the 100. The tweeters and the mids (though with the 470 the "mids" are referred to as "mid-bass"). I'm guessing in the 470 the mid-bass drivers are exactly the same as the midrange driver in the 100s...just crossed at different points to handle different duties.

Any how, thanka again for your input! Will let you know what I end up with when I do.

Oh, btw...did you get a chance to audition the PSB Stratus series...forgot to ask you about that...

Have a nice weekend!!