Suggestions needed for Denon replacement Please!

[CCallahan]

I have owned an older Denon receiver for about 10-12 years (believe it to be an AVR-3600) and have been very happy with the performance/reliability.

However, I have recently ordered a Denon 2309ci to replace it but since Denon has quit making these for the 2310ci, most likely that unit will not get shipped to me.

So now it looks as though I am stuck trying to find a comparable unit from another company (Yamaha, Onkyo, etc). My budget is for a unit selling around $600 (I ordered the 2309 for $606) that has the same features such as component HD upconvert, auto switching, all new Dolby formats (trueHD, master audio, etc), is at least 100W per channel 5.1, etc.

I will be hooking up a blu-ray, dvd, cd, and satellite receiver.

Problem I found is a lot of sites don't list very detailed specs on the unit like Denon does. My knowledge on the subject is not high enough to make a good decision.

If someone could help point me in the right direction that will be awesome.

Thanks!

 

[AVRat]

Welcome to the site. I'd like to know what speakers you're using and your room size before I make a recommendation.

 

[CCallahan]

Thanks for the quick reply.

My speakers are Snell Acoustics E.5 series (2 front towers with tweeter, mid range, and rear throw speaker, center channel, 2 surround, and a 12" subwoofer.

Room size is 24' L x 19' W.

 

[Highbar]

Why do you think that the unit you ordered wont get shipped to you? I picked up my 2808CI last year months after they started making the 2809CI. There are usually quite a few of the "old/last years" model in the delivery channels when they release a new model. I would wait and make sure that you aren't going to get your unit before you start looking for something different.

 

[CCallahan]

I am going to wait and will find out for sure on Friday.

The reasoning behind is that Denon has stopped producing this model. I had previously ordered this unit week and half ago and found out end of last week my order was cancelled. This was due to them putting in the order to Denon and them saying they would not ship.

The new place I ordered from puts a "blind" order in to their Denon supplier. They have no idea whether or not the units are physically there or will even ship until Friday when the order arrives to them. I even asked them to call the supplier to find out what had been shipped to see if the 2309 was there. They said since it's a Denon product it is impossible for them to do so. Only thing I could do is wait and maybe research other products in case the receiver doesn't show.

Before I ordered this unit almost all other sites I checked were out of stock unless the price was way high. Basically, my luck with getting this unit has not been good and at this point assuming it will not show up.

**Depending on how soon a response is given this may be my last post until tomorrow. I will continue to respond regularly....thanks.**

 

[Lordoftherings]

Some suggestions for you CCallahan.

Hi CCallahan, Welcome to Audioholics.

Your older receiver, the Denon AVR-3600 was one of the best in his time.

If you want to replace it by a similar quality receiver in today's market, you'll have to aim higher on the Denon line, or from another company.
Your budget is about $600 you are saying.

For that money, you'll have to look at a reconditioned (refurb) model.
There are quite a few around that price. And excellent ones too. See below.

1. The Denon AVR-3808ci would be a good choice, but it is over your buget right now.
2. The Denon AVR-2808ci would also be an excellent choice for you, I'm not sure of the price though, but it should be close to your budget, as this is last year model (the AVR-2809ci is this year model, soon to be replaced by the AVR-3310ci).
3. The Pioneer Elite SC-05 is $700, only $100 more than your budget.
4. The Onkyo TX-SR805 (if you can find it) is about between $400 and $600.
5. The Onkyo TX-SR806 is $600 right now (but it will go down, soon as the TX-NR807 appears).
6. The Onkyo TX-SR875 with it's HQV Reon video processor can be had for $800.
7. The Onkyo TX-SR705 or TX-SR706 are $440 and $500 respectively.
8. The Marantz SR8001 can be had for $700.*
9. The Marantz SR7001 can be had for only $500.*
10. The Marantz SR6001 can be had for only $350.*
11. The Marantz SR6003 can be had for $699 or less (that would be a good choice for you).
12. The Marantz SR5003 is about $500 to $550.

* These 3 Marantz models don't have internal decoders for Dolby trueHD and DTS-HD MA. But this not essential, as your blu-ray player could do the decoding.

--> Places to check for great deals are:
1. Accessories 4 less.
2. 6th Avenue electronics.
3. Audiogon.
4. videogon.
5. New Egg.
6. Vann's Electronics.
7. One Call.
8. J & R Music.
9. ABT Electronics.
10. B & H Photo.

>>> That should point you in the right direction.
And don't feel bad if I did not include any Yamaha and Harman Kardon models.
~ It's just that I run out of time and space.

Cheers,

Bob

 

[CCallahan]

Wow...that's a lot of choices.

I will have to do some research on the different features of these. It would be nice to have analog to HD upconvert like the Denon (say, for a Wii) and the Dolby decoders since not all blu-ray players have this and the output is might be questionable.

If someone could add a few Yamaha units that are comparable that would be great. I couldn't find any myself that were comparible for the price.

Thanks.

 

[Lordoftherings]

Wow...that's a lot of choices.

I will have to do some research on the different features of these. It would be nice to have analog to HD upconvert like the Denon (say, for a Wii) and the Dolby decoders since not all blu-ray players have this and the output is might be questionable.

If someone could add a few Yamaha units that are comparable that would be great. I couldn't find any myself that were comparible for the price.

Thanks.

No sweat. Of course there is an even larger choice, but that's what makes it even more fun and more competition between the manufacturers, so better features and prices for us, the customers.

Your best bet is to start from their respective web sites, to look at their features and specifications, so you have an already good hand on what features you want, and what they offer, the full package what. Check which ones offer Wii, internal decoders for Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD MA (all receivers with HDMI version 1.3 do).
And also check which ones offer upscaling to 1080p through their HDMI output, from all their analog video inputs (best video processors are the HQV Reon VX-50, the Anchor Bay Technologies ABT-2010, the Marvel Qdeo and Gennum, but this last one, don't look for it, as it is only in high end products, same as the HQV Realta).
The Faroudja Genesis FLI-2310 is not bad also, so is the Faroudja Cinema video processor.

Then you go by elimination, and reduce your choice to only few models.

Then you look around for the best prices of these few models.

Then you ask us what we think by teling us your speaker's model numbers and brands, your room dimension, your listening habits, your choice of music and movies, and your usual listening volume level.

Then we tell you the overall performance and perfect match for your taste, speakers and room. Quite simple, isn't?

* As for the Yamaha receivers in your price range, there would be the RX-V1800 (not sure of it's exact street price though), the RX-V863, the RX-V663, the RX-V665, the RX-V765 and the RX-V2700 or the RX-V1700.
But I'm not exactly sure of their street prices. And the last two ones are the older models from 2007. And the RX-V1800 might be over your budget by a couple hundred or so, more or less.

> It's all about what you exactly looking for, without having a single clue.

Cheers,

Bob

 

[CCallahan]

Awesome...thanks.

- From the research I have done so far, the Denon 2808ci is out because it only has (2) hdmi inputs.

- Looks as though the Onkyo #SR805-875 are out of my price range.

So far it looks as though my best bet would be the Onkyo TX-SR706. It has all the features and I'm finding prices around $550. I have never owned an Onkyo and am not aware of the reliability/sound quality. Most the reviews read have been positive.

My next step is to research the Yamaha units posted and see if any are a good fit.

 

[Highbar]

If everyone else was out of stock then there is a good chance that you wont get your unit. The reason for the high prices is because even though it's last years model Denon still does not like resellers lowering the price.

Now, like has been said your old unit is a high end unit and replacing it with a mid range unit you may not be happy. You might have to look at refurbished units. If you get them from a factory supported site than there is no issue, and you can save some big money.

By the way, don't eliminate anything based on the fact that it doesn't haven't a certain number of HDMI ports. HDMI switches are cheap and very easy to use. If I'm not mistaken there's one or two on the market that even switch automatically when they sense a signal.

 

[Lordoftherings]

Hmm...

Your older receiver, the Denon AVR-3600 was one of the best in his time.

If you want to replace it by a similar quality receiver in today's market, you'll have to aim higher on the Denon line, or from another company.
Your budget is about $600 you are saying.

For that money, you'll have to look at a reconditioned (refurb) model.

1. The Denon AVR-3808ci would be a good choice, but it is over your buget right now.
2. The Denon AVR-2808ci would also be an excellent choice for you, I'm not sure of the price though, but it should be close to your budget, as this is last year model (the AVR-2809ci is this year model, soon to be replaced by the AVR-3310ci).
3. The Pioneer Elite SC-05 is $700, only $100 more than your budget.
4. The Onkyo TX-SR805 (if you can find it) is about between $400 and $600.
5. The Onkyo TX-SR806 is $600 right now (but it will go down, soon as the TX-NR807 appears).
6. The Onkyo TX-SR875 with it's HQV Reon video processor can be had for $800.
7. The Onkyo TX-SR705 or TX-SR706 are $440 and $500 respectively.
8. The Marantz SR8001 can be had for $700.*
9. The Marantz SR7001 can be had for only $500.*
10. The Marantz SR6001 can be had for only $350.*
11. The Marantz SR6003 can be had for $699 or less (that would be a good choice for you).
12. The Marantz SR5003 is about $500 to $550.

* These 3 Marantz models don't have internal decoders for Dolby trueHD and DTS-HD MA. But this not essential, as your blu-ray player could do the decoding.

Bob

If everyone else was out of stock then there is a good chance that you wont get your unit. The reason for the high prices is because even though it's last years model Denon still does not like resellers lowering the price.

Now, like has been said your old unit is a high end unit and replacing it with a mid range unit you may not be happy. You might have to look at refurbished units. If you get them from a factory supported site than there is no issue, and you can save some big money.

By the way, don't eliminate anything based on the fact that it doesn't haven't a certain number of HDMI ports. HDMI switches are cheap and very easy to use. If I'm not mistaken there's one or two on the market that even switch automatically when they sense a signal.

1. Denon high prices, you got that one right.

2. Like you can see from my above quote, I already told him (refurb model to stay in the same line as his older Denon AVR-3600).
And I give him ten different excellent reputable places for refurbs.
Because his budget is only $600. And for that money, he definitively need to look at refurb models.

*** FOR CCallahan: >>> And by the way CCallahan, the Onkyo TX-SR805 would be a good upgrade for you, and it is not expensive, like you're saying. If one of the place that I already mentioned to you, has it, it should be no more than $600 at the very max. Here's the big secret: TAKE YOUR TIME, there's absolutely no rush. And if you take the time on your side, the right opportunity will present itself just at the right time, because your timing will be already spent at gathering the best info on several good ones. Another tip: Check the weight of each receiver, and try to not go below, let's say 35 pounds at the very minimum, 40 pounds is better, and anything higher than that, you're laughing. <<<

3. He's looking at his own accomodation for features, number of HDMI inputs for his personal needs, ...
Why make life more complicated than it is? He won't need an HDMI switcher if he pick the right receiver. Besides, the ones that have only a couple of them (HDMI inputs) are 99.9% from the lower end.

* I'm sensing a signal here...
Can you sense it too?

 

[CCallahan]

Ok...found out today the Denon 2309ci I ordered did not show up. So, my order was cancelled again.

Here are the units I am considering as a replacement:

Onkyo TX-SR706 (so far cheapest I have found is $615)

Yamaha RX-V1800 (found for $660...I know this is higher than my original budget but only by $60)

The Onkyo looks solid but does not have analog to HDMI upconvert like the Denon has. The Yamaha looks very solid and seems to have all the features the 2309 has.

All the other units were either too expensive or the features lacking.

What do you guys think? (I am going to continue checking prices)

-Thanks.

 

[CCallahan]

So far...I have narrowed my choices down to 2....but need to research the Marantz items better.

Onkyo TX-SR806 (Recond.) - found for $625 after shipping

Yamaha RX-V1800 - found for $660

Any thoughts on which unit has an edge?

 

[PENG]

Is the RX-V1800 new with factory warranty? If it is go for it and forget about the 806. I am sure LOTR can give you a few reasons why the 806 is not as good as the 805.

 

[bandphan]

Jeremy's 805 is still for sale

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56484

 

[Lordoftherings]

Hurry up! Last Onkyo TX-SR805 BLACK model.

So far...I have narrowed my choices down to 2....but need to research the Marantz items better.
Onkyo TX-SR806 (Recond.) - found for $625 after shipping
Yamaha RX-V1800 - found for $660

Any thoughts on which unit has an edge?

YES, THIS ONE, click on the link just below, and buy it right away.

Hurry up, this is the last Onkyo TX-SR805 BLACK at only $599.99
It will be gone in the next few hours.

Here: http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/ONKTXSR805/Onkyo/TX-SR805-THX-Ultra2-130w-x-7ch-HDMI-805-Receiver/1.html

Bob

 

[Lordoftherings]

The Onkyo TX-SR805 is the #1. (Well, right after the 876 & 906.)

Is the RX-V1800 new with factory warranty? If it is go for it and forget about the 806. I am sure LOTR can give you a few reasons why the 806 is not as good as the 805.

Very true Peng, but I won't bother, because I just give a link to CCallahan of the Onkyo TX-SR805 just about half hour ago (see post above), that just came available at accessories 4 less ($599.99), ant it is the last one!

And YES CCallahan, the Onkyo TX-SR805 is MUCH BETTER that the 806.
The 805 weights 51 pounds! And the 806 only weights 37.5 pounds.
That says a lot about their different power supply, and it also shows on the test bench, BIG TIME.


* By the way Peng, I agree with you about the full factory warranty.
But between the Yammy 1800 (37.3lbs) and the Onkyo 806 (37.5lbs), overall performance, power, build quality, features, ergonomics and value wise, it's pretty much a toss up.
*** But, and it's a big BUT, the Onkyo 805 walk all over them.

Regards,

Bob

 

[CCallahan]

Sorry for my delay....my internet went down yesterday evening and I have been troubleshooting it today and finally got it back up.

Thanks for the link....I went to it and it was already sold out.

..


..


..


..
Oh wait...it's sold out because I bought the last one!

Thanks for everyone's help on this. It would have taken me forever to make a decision on which unit to get and in the end, would have been the wrong choice.

If anyone cares I can post again after hooking the unit up and give my thoughts on the performance.

 

[Adam]

Congrats! You had me going there, but I'm glad that you were able to get it. I hope that you really enjoy your new toy.

 

[gqmagic]

IMO once you have a Denon 3*** - 4*** series or Marantz 7*** - 8*** series, looking at something in the Denon 2's or Marantz 5-6's WILL NOT be comparable sound or build quality .

Even going back a year or 2 for the higher end model of a Denon 3*** or better yet a 4***, same for Marantz go to a 8*** will be a real upgrade.

Video switching, more hdmi, more abc, isn't has important to me as the sound and build quality, and at refurbed prices for last years top or near top of the line for the same price as a entry or mid range new, to me I always will go for what was the higher up the line one.

I also think most people who buy like this are satisfied far longer.