Questions...Questions...Questions...

[DJ Scotty]

Is it possible to feed an external power amp out of a receiver with no pre outs? My Onkyo TX-SR600 has no pre outs, but I wanted to begin using it as a processor and get a much larger multichannel power amp (something like say 300 watts x 5) because of the ridiculously large room I'm in; is there a way around this, by perhaps feeding a "line converter" of some kind from the speaker leads or something, as in car audio setups?

Also, is it possible or recommended to add a graphic EQ to a home theater receiver to "punch up" the sound? Could this be done to DTS and Dolby Digital signals -- that is, adding equalization to spice up some of these soundtracks, or is this not recommended -- is the best route to simply play back Dolby and DTS tracks as they were "intended", that is, without any EQ applied to them and just the way they are on the DVD into the receiver?

Also, do any other Onkyo receiver owners find, even with "boosted up" calibration and "IntelliVolume" settings, that they need to bring their master volume levels to at least "50" on the display to even hear anything? I swear, below this, there is little or no impact from any DVD soundtrack, especially Dolby Digital encoded ones; DTS mixes are recorded a bit hotter, requiring a tad bit less volume applied to them, but I swear, most Dolby Digital soundtracks I play back from my DVD collection sound like *** until I reach the "50" mark on my receiver, and only then does the audio begin to "heat up"....the only problem is, I only have until the "70"'s on the display before I reach maximum volume -- this doesnt leave me a lot of room to play with, and I dont like that. Is this typical for an Onkyo amplifier section, as I have been told it is?

 

[DaveOCP]

Instead of trying to connect a power amplifier to that Onkyo (which I'm almost certain cannot be done) just upgrade your receiver instead. If you want to try an EQ, get a receiver with the capability built in, such as Pioneer's MCACC models.

That quirk Onkyo receivers have where there's basically no sound until the Volume is cranked way up is common, but it wasnt always that way. I know my 777 definitely did not behave that way, but every Onkyo model I've tried since then has.

If a big Denon or Pioneer still cant do the job, then add something like a Sunfire amp. Also, perhaps you should consider more efficient speakers. For example, Klipsch RF-7's have an amazing sensitivity of 102db, meaning even very modest receivers should have no trouble driving them to very loud volumes.

 

[MDS]

Without pre-outs, you cannot use an external amp without resorting to a hack like a speaker level to line level converter. Video1 has outputs which are active whenever an analog audio signal is present, so another hack might be to use the video1 outs to feed a 2 channel amp, but that is not really desirable either.

Modern recievers lack tape loops so it is also problematic to use an EQ for anything but the front 2 channels.

As far as the volume goes...There is ALOT of room between 50 and 70ish. If the receiver is calibrated, that is 20 dB. Room acoustics affect that the most - in my room I never have it over 30. 40 is about the max I ever use for movies and that is almost 25 dB below reference level. At night when everything is quiet, I can turn it down as low as 10 and still hear it adequately (but of course in the morning when all of the ambient noise from my surroundings returns, you can't hear it at all when set that low). There is nothing wrong with the amplifier section - if your room is very large you may be one of the few that can actually benefit from more power.

 

[DJ Scotty]

Instead of trying to connect a power amplifier to that Onkyo (which I'm almost certain cannot be done) just upgrade your receiver instead. If you want to try an EQ, get a receiver with the capability built in, such as Pioneer's MCACC models.

Thanks a million, Dave; the only route I would consider would not involve upgrading the receiver. For this matter, I would just start over and do a pre/pro/power amp combo from scratch. You said you are almost certain the connection to a power amp cant be done, but the reply under yours suggests something I was told regarding the possibility of using an inline converter of some kind at the speaker level inputs, so I am going to investigate that lead further because I would truly like to utilize my receiver as a preamp instead of just "getting rid of it." As for the EQ, I was aware that newer receivers like the aforementioned Pioneer and some Yamahas have these equalizing modes built in (although, personally, I would never buy a Pioneer home audio product; to me, that falls somewhere between JVC and Kenwood and Sony non-ES gear) but I was more interested in whether or not an external graphic EQ can be added to a surround receiver to punch up the impact of Dolby and DTS 5.1 soundtracks -- or if this is even recommended.

That quirk Onkyo receivers have where there's basically no sound until the Volume is cranked way up is common, but it wasnt always that way. I know my 777 definitely did not behave that way, but every Onkyo model I've tried since then has.

Yes, I have heard this too. Was wondering why even with my IntelliVolume calibration system cranked up on the DVD input and my speaker calibration levels on the other side of "-", I am still getting weak audio below, say, "50" on the display.

Thanks for your ongoing assistance.

 

[DJ Scotty]

Without pre-outs, you cannot use an external amp without resorting to a hack like a speaker level to line level converter.

Thanks MDS; thats what I wanted to know -- if it was POSSIBLE to connect a multichannel external power amp to a receiver with no preout leads....even though this is a "hack" procedure, how exactly would this work? What would I need in terms of a line level converter? Where can I get one? How would it connect to the receiver?

Video1 has outputs which are active whenever an analog audio signal is present, so another hack might be to use the video1 outs to feed a 2 channel amp, but that is not really desirable either.

I didnt know that about VIDEO 1; so, in other words, it may be possible to run a 2-channel amp to feed just the mains with extra power? Hmmmm....if so, thats not really what I wanted it for....I really wanted to run the whole system -- every channel -- with more power....

Modern recievers lack tape loops so it is also problematic to use an EQ for anything but the front 2 channels.

Ahhhh...yes...the good old Tape Loop monitor, as found in all the old stereo receivers and integrated amps I used to own....I have noticed the lack of these on new receivers. But, let me ask you this: you say its problematic to use the EQ for anything but the two front channels....but is it POSSIBLE? In other words, can I boost DIGITAL signals as those for Dolby Digital and DTS soundtracks on DVDs using an external EQ, or would this require equalizing EACH channel in the chain via external amps for each channel, etc? If so, thats a LOT of work....I wanted to give my system added punch that it seems only an EQ can do....is it better to just run Dolby/DTS tracks in their native form directly from the DVD with no altering of the sound with tone controls, EQ, etc, because THATS the way the audio engineers wanted it?

As far as the volume goes...There is ALOT of room between 50 and 70ish. If the receiver is calibrated, that is 20 dB.

Yes, the receiver is calibrated; and so, you feel that another 20 counts on the volume can make a massive difference and its okay to need to keep kicking the volume up? It's "okay" for me to need to go from "50" to the "60"'s range?

Room acoustics affect that the most - in my room I never have it over 30. 40 is about the max I ever use for movies and that is almost 25 dB below reference level.

Do you own Onkyo equipment and is that what you are referring to here in terms of the numbers? "40" is really quiet on my setup.....but I DO have vaulted, cathedral ceilings and a massive room Im trying to pressurize.....

At night when everything is quiet, I can turn it down as low as 10 and still hear it adequately (but of course in the morning when all of the ambient noise from my surroundings returns, you can't hear it at all when set that low). There is nothing wrong with the amplifier section - if your room is very large you may be one of the few that can actually benefit from more power.

Yes---and that brings me to another question and discussion -- AMBIENT NOISE in a home theater....late at night, like you, is when the home theater gets the quietest and it seems like I have more reserves of power available as I dont make the audio all that loud; but, if there are distractions from the adjoining kitchen, or the dogs start to bark or the phone rings -- you can easily hear this over the sound system, especially during quieter passages on DVD soundtracks....is this normal?