Question for SVS owners

[Defcon]

I just got a PB-2000, and while setting it up I notice I have to turn the gain knob pretty high (>3pm) for appreciable output. My speakers are all set to small, crossover at 80Hz in receiver. I've run the receiver calibration (its a Yamaha) as well and it sets the sub at 0dB only when the gain is turned up high.

I know gain knob is not a volume control, just wondering if this is typical for these subs and what do other people have it set at?

 

[TheWarrior]

What size room? Is the sub located in the middle of the wall or in a corner?

 

[Auditor55]

I just got a PB-2000, and while setting it up I notice I have to turn the gain knob pretty high (>3pm) for appreciable output. My speakers are all set to small, crossover at 80Hz in receiver. I've run the receiver calibration (its a Yamaha) as well and it sets the sub at 0dB only when the gain is turned up high.

I know gain knob is not a volume control, just wondering if this is typical for these subs and what do other people have it set at?

Kind of typical. I set the gain on both of my SB-13's to -17 and MCACC sets the sub level in the receiver to -3.5. If lowered the gain to say -25 on my subs, MCACC will probably set it -0.5. Now mind you, the SB Ultra's go from -100 to 0. Ed Mullen from SVS said their amps work best when the gain is set high. If you lowered the gain to the 12 O'clock position, YPAO would probably set the sub level in the receiver to +2.0 or something. I was told that you should have the gain set to that the sub level on the receiver is between -3.0 and -0.

 

[herbu]

I think TheWarrior hit the point. Remember, both your YPAO and the gain knob on your sub are so you can balance the sub volume with the volume of your other speakers.

If you have to turn up the gain to achieve that balance, it could mean some or all of these:
- your speakers are particularly efficient & loud
- your speakers are closer to the mic than the sub
- your sub is in a spot that causes a null at your speaker position
- your sub is small for your room

Turning up the gain to achieve balance is not a bad thing. It is a good thing your system has the ability to produce balance.

 

[Defcon]

Ok I'm finding out that the recommendation in most online articles and the SVS manual to set the gain at 12 for calibration is not quite true anymore?

My suspicion then is that the gain must be a logarithmic control, it doesn't make sense for it to be linear and be set so high.

My speakers have a sensitivity of 90dB so I'd guess reasonably efficient. Room size is 2000 cu.ft. Right now sub is about 5 ft from a corner, next to a wall.

I read somewhere else (may have been here or Avsforum) that post calibration the AVR level should be -10. for that I think I'd have to set the gain to near its max setting! And then the advice was to turn it up in the AVR so you end up at -4/5, because exceeding 0 means adding distortion. Correct?

 

[KenM10759]

I notice most subwoofer makers state in the setup guides to set the gain initially at the midpoint, which is often putting the knob at the "12 o'clock" position.

When I set up my SB2000 with Audyssey that's what I did. My sub is behind and to the left side of my left main speaker, against a wall and 3-1/2 feet from a corner. Being nearly against the wall (the wire connections keep it from being flush), it's face is 16" from the wall. The face of the front main speakers is 29" from the wall. I sit 10 or 12 feet from the speakers.

Audyssey sets the sub to +9 and a 14' distance. It sets my left speaker to -1 at a 9' distance and right speaker to +1 at a 10' distance. Crossovers on the front 3 are set at 60hz by Audyssey.

It sounds good, but I tweak the distances to 10' and both at 0. I leave the sub setting as is. Now it sounds as good as it gets for what it is. I do not notice any distortion. It may be there but less noticeable in those LF ranges.

 

[PENG]

I just got a PB-2000, and while setting it up I notice I have to turn the gain knob pretty high (>3pm) for appreciable output. My speakers are all set to small, crossover at 80Hz in receiver. I've run the receiver calibration (its a Yamaha) as well and it sets the sub at 0dB only when the gain is turned up high.

I know gain knob is not a volume control, just wondering if this is typical for these subs and what do other people have it set at?

I recently set up two PB2000 in a large room, probably around >5000 cu ft and open to another room of larger size. I had to set the PB2000's volume to around 12 noon (Mid point) for the AVR (SR7009) to around 0. In my own much smaller room, my SVS subs are set to around 9 AM, that is less than 1/4 way to maximum. Your room is not big at all, so unless your speakers are much more sensitive, I see no reason why you ended up with 3 PM. I suggest you do a factory reset of the AVR and then re-run Audyssey. I know people think the on screen instructions are easy to follow but I always suggest read up on the Audyssey website first for more details, including reading the FAQ sections.

 

[billy p]

The gain control basically acts like an attenuator. I'd run your REQ software to achieve the required listening level and adjust the gain accordingly. I've had 3 different sub in the same room and location more or less and the sensitivity of each sub determines where the gain is set. There is no real right or wrong position...IMO.

For example my first sub was set at about 9 o'clock, the SB13u was turned up around -10db and the psa was set around 2pm....which is considered normal....

 

[TheWarrior]

Ok I'm finding out that the recommendation in most online articles and the SVS manual to set the gain at 12 for calibration is not quite true anymore?

My suspicion then is that the gain must be a logarithmic control, it doesn't make sense for it to be linear and be set so high.

My speakers have a sensitivity of 90dB so I'd guess reasonably efficient. Room size is 2000 cu.ft. Right now sub is about 5 ft from a corner, next to a wall.

I read somewhere else (may have been here or Avsforum) that post calibration the AVR level should be -10. for that I think I'd have to set the gain to near its max setting! And then the advice was to turn it up in the AVR so you end up at -4/5, because exceeding 0 means adding distortion. Correct?

Have tried moving it to one of the corners?

INCHES make a difference with subwoofers, which is why Audioholics did a 'Crawling for Bass' article. Even if you prefer it mid-wall, the distance to the wall should be experimented with. You might hear one distance as being 'tighter' and another seeming to have a bit more distortion like a car subwoofer. So some preference does come in to this!

 

[Defcon]

I will be rearranging some furniture soon so can try to experiment. Sub crawl with something this big and heavy is not very easy and I don't have a long RCA cable to even do it right now.

I did a factory reset and reran YPAO and experimented with the gain set between 10am and 3pm, at 10am the receiver sets level to +6dB, at 3pm I get -1.5dB to -2dB, and its 0dB at 2pm. I really wanted a negative level so that when I need to turn it up I can do it in the receiver and not have to exceed 0dB.

I'm trying to find out if this is normal for this sub or excessive.

 

[KenM10759]

I trust you aren't trying to crawl around with the sub itself you should only have to lift it once to put in your listening position.

And yes, having a long RCA/sub cable is kind of required.

 

[billy p]

10 o'clock was to low, hence the +6 on your receiver. Sounds like 2-3 pm works for your situation/room. I would try and set the mains + sub as level as possible . From there you can slowly increase the volume via your receiver for the sub...I usually ran things about 1-2 dbs hot...others go much higher but make certain you have measured correctly when running the sub > 6dbs hot.

 

[Defcon]

I trust you aren't trying to crawl around with the sub itself you should only have to lift it once to put in your listening position.

And yes, having a long RCA/sub cable is kind of required.

I have to crawl just to push the damn thing I thought about lifting it and actually putting iton the couch, but that thought didn't last very long. I wonder if the people with the really heavy subs (150lb+) even bother with this.

 

[speakerman39]

If putting the sub(s) in the listening position is problematic, place it in your room and walk carefully throughout to see where the bass sounds best. That, at the very least, will give you a starting point. But, it still may not be the best place to put the sub(s). Learning more about your room is paramount imho to minimize dips/nulls. No room is perfect so to get the most out of it requires some hard work via trial and error.

Cheers,

Phil

 

[KenM10759]

Unless your a small person or disabled, a 65 pound sub isn't that bad to move it around. I carried one out of the store a put it in my car by myself. I do admit to having my strapping 26 year old son come out to my car and get it into HIS house.

 

[PENG]

The gain control basically acts like an attenuator. I'd run your REQ software to achieve the required listening level and adjust the gain accordingly. I've had 3 different sub in the same room and location more or less and the sensitivity of each sub determines where the gain is set. There is no real right or wrong position...IMO.

For example my first sub was set at about 9 o'clock, the SB13u was turned up around -10db and the psa was set around 2pm....which is considered normal....

I agree with you that it depends on the sub's sensitivity so there isn't right or wrong setting. However, he is talking about the PB2000, and I know the PB2000's sensitivity as I just installed two in a fairly large room, so I know he really shouldn't be at 3 O'Clock in his not so large room. Something is not right there, though at this point I wouldn't know what it is.