Question for Pro audio amp owners

J

jsulse

Audioholic Intern
Looking to get the most powerful amp I can afford so I have plenty of head room. Trying to decide between Yamaha P2500S (310w @ 4ohm) or P3500S (450w @ 4ohm) to drive LCR. The amps will be driving 4ohm speakers with 98db sensitivity. My question is can I run into trouble with gain/volume control with the P3500S amps relative to the other speakers gain/volume (surrounds or 5.2 or 7.2 system) driven by my AVR? The situation, which maybe a non-issue, is I'm trying to avoid is the LCR volume not "matching" the other speakers. For example, lower listening levels where everything is balanced then moving to higher listening levels the levels are no longer matched. Will Audessy compensate for the differing power abilities of the Yamaha's amps and the AVR's amps?

This really is a setup question and trying to explain my concern as best as possible. I know if the amp is too big then trying to control the volume maybe difficult because a relatively small input signal will give a relatively large wattage output. At what amp size can trouble arise?
 
J

jostenmeat

Audioholic Spartan
You should be fine. Your receiver can handle the surrounds' impedance just fine? Surround effects are very minimal for most movies, and in some movies it's pretty much non-existent. The levels they play are typically lower, and surround speakers are typically closer to the listener, relative to the front three. That all said, Audyssey cannot do anything for a lack of power.

Just level match (which Audyssey will do for you anyhow), and enjoy. I would base my Yamaha decision on cost/value. If only a bit more, go for the bigger model, if a lot more, then don't, pretty simple. If you use anything close to the max capability of either of those amps on those speakers, you won't be able to hear a thing anymore, totally deaf, and all of this talk will just be for, well, naught.

In my multi row theater, I do have an amp powering all 7 channels, but I would be perfectly confident in driving the four surrounds with the receiver. No problem at all, and they don't have 98db sens, not even close, are you kidding me.
 
jp_over

jp_over

Full Audioholic
Just a consideration (also a question because I'm not sure what this specification means), the P Series datasheet lists "Input Sensitivity RL=8Ω" as "+4dBu" for the P3500S & "+3dBu" for the P2500S.

Will this make a difference in needing a Art Cleanbox (or similar product to boost pre-out output) or not with an AVR?

I'm really not sure if this is what "input sensitivity" means however. If anyone could clarify, it might help the OP decide if one is more capable of producing good volume from a standard AVR pre-out.

From this shot of the specs, it "appears to me" (and I'm no expert!) that the higher one goes in the P series line, the more difficult it is to drive the amps with a standard AVR pre-out...

 
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J

jostenmeat

Audioholic Spartan
Interesting point. My Denon 4310 has 1.2v output giving 4dBu input to the amp. Looks like I should not go higher than P3500S.

Posted this link in another thread. It has a formula to convert outut voltage to input signal. Check it out!

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/home-theater-receivers-processors-amps/34075-help-matching-receiver-pro-amp.html
IMO, get the amp that you want, however, I am extremely confident the 3500 will be more than enough. It won't even break a sweat driving those speakers, as my guess. If need be, in the worst case scenario, you can just bridge them, and buy more later. I bet good money you won't.
 
J

jsulse

Audioholic Intern
I bet you are right too. Picked up 2 of the Yamaha P3500S amps today. If I ever want to upgrade for more power I can bridge them and buy a 3rd amp. Highly unlikely though. Also, they could be used for powering any potential dual sub upgrade. Bridged they give 900watts 20Hz-20kHz and 1180watts 1Khz @ 8ohm.
 
WaynePflughaupt

WaynePflughaupt

Audioholic Samurai
Too bad I’m late to the party - I was going to suggest taking a look at Carvin’s amps. For well under the price of the Yamaha 3500, the Carvin DCM-1540 has 425 watts @ 8 ohms and 750 @ 4 ohms. Don’t know if it’s as clean as the Yamaha, but they do have a generous return policy.

You might check my signature for a link to my article on gain structure. Part 7 covers deciphering amplifier sensitivity specs, and Part 8 has a simple exercise you can perform to match the Yamaha amp’s gain settings to your receiver’s internal amps. Once you do that, you can adjust your speaker levels in the menu via your normal procedure.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt
 
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GranteedEV

GranteedEV

Audioholic Ninja
98db/2v/m speakers are DAMN efficient. If your amplifier can even do 200 watts into 4 ohms that's more than 107db at 15 feet away before boundary gain is even considered. In other words, it's more watts than you'll ever use unless you're running a concert hall or something. The loudest transients in movies are at 105db at the seating position.
 
J

jsulse

Audioholic Intern
Thanks Wayne, book marked your page. Got a great deal on the Yamaha's so no regrets there.

GranteedEV, yes got some "headroom" power now! :D Too much, probably. Better than not enough... Cheers
 
jp_over

jp_over

Full Audioholic
Jsulse,

Any possibility of a post purchase brief review on those P3500S amps? :D

It would also be nice to know where you ended up setting the the volume on them.
 
J

jsulse

Audioholic Intern
Will post system components, setup, etc. once all done. Just waiting on LCR speakers now. Been lurking here for months getting helpful tips on what to buy and "how to setup" so would like to give back all I can.
 
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