Punch in the chest vs SVS PC-2000 Pro

[XenoChron]

Around the holidays I purchased a PC-2000 Pro for my home setup and have enjoyed it very much. I've got nothing definitive to compare the experience to though as it is the first "real" subwoofer I've owned. My purchase was based though on a lot of feedback here and I appreciated all the help.

Anyway, I was recently at a dance competition and sat not far from the audio setup which, due to covid restrictions, was held outside. I was probably 10-12 ft away from the subwoofer used in the setup and frankly, when the bass got moving, it was like I was getting punched in the chest. It was pretty awesome! It was very clean too and not like it was being over driven or anything. I wrote down what it was and vaguely remember it being a 15 inch woofer but I can't find what I wrote and without someone rattling off brands I'd not be able to tell you what it was.

My SVS PC-2000 Pro gets the house shaking pretty good and you certainly feel the bass but it isn't like that punch in the chest feeling I got with this other subwoofer. What's it take to get that feeling? Is it because the PC-2000 Pro is downward firing that I get more rumble than punch? Am I expecting too much?

To be fair, that other sub could easily have cost twice or three times what I paid for my PC-2000 Pro but it was impressive given the open space it was working in.

 

[shadyJ]

A lot of that "chest punch" range occurs above subwoofer band frequencies. Here is an article about it. So you may not just need a more powerful sub, you may also need more powerful main speakers if you want that chest punch sensation.

The sub you saw was likely a sound reinforcement sub for a PA system. Maybe JBL Pro or QSC or something like that. They have a tremendous level of output above 40Hz, but they don't do deep bass at all. The SVS can dig more than an octave lower than these subs, but they can't achieve those kinds of SPLs. Few people really want 130dB anyway. It would rattle every single loose thing in your home.

 

[XenoChron]

A lot of that "chest punch" range occurs above subwoofer band frequencies. Here is an article about it. So you may not just need a more powerful sub, you may also need more powerful main speakers if you want that chest punch sensation.

The sub you saw was likely a sound reinforcement sub for a PA system. Maybe JBL Pro or QSC or something like that. They have a tremendous level of output above 40Hz, but they don't do deep bass at all. The SVS can dig more than an octave lower than these subs, but they can't achieve those kinds of SPLs. Few people really want 130dB anyway. It would rattle every single loose thing in your home.

Great article. Really enjoyed it. Curious though in tests I’ve seen the output of the subwoofer I have doesn’t really fall off until above 200 hz and it seems like the article references 110hz as a “punch” frequency. Wouldn’t the sub still be producing those sounds or is it just it needs some EQ to push that band up a bit and some adjustment on the cross over frequency in the AVR?


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[shadyJ]

Great article. Really enjoyed it. Curious though in tests I’ve seen the output of the subwoofer I have doesn’t really fall off until above 200 hz and it seems like the article references 110hz as a “punch” frequency. Wouldn’t the sub still be producing those sounds or is it just it needs some EQ to push that band up a bit and some adjustment on the cross over frequency in the AVR?


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The default crossover frequency is 80Hz for most systems. So while many subwoofers can play higher, the AVR or AV processor won't let them (usually for good reasons) at the default setting. The crossover frequency can almost always be changed manually though, so you can go into your AVR settings and crank it to maybe 160Hz or 200Hz. If you do that, the sub may become very localizable and all bass will seem like it's coming from the sub's position instead of the system as a whole. You can negate localization by getting multiple subs and setting them up around the room.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I think the biggest factor in what you experienced was total SPL. I’ll reserve my comments on the article but IMO almost always the biggest contributor to chest punch, and pants flapping bass is overall loudness. Ime 30-80hz is more the range of punch. Of course the upper harmonics of these frequencies are tied together. So it’s really it so simple.

 

[XenoChron]

You can negate localization by getting multiple subs and setting them up around the room.

Well now I’ve got a good reason to get another sub.

Sounds like I should find a couple good test tracks and mess with the crossover a bit but as was said the SPL probably had more to do with it. Can’t hurt to play a bit.

Given my outdoor experience had some volume behind it due to the nature of the event and open space I probably got a lot more than might be comfortable in an enclosed setting.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Well now I’ve got a good reason to get another sub.

Sounds like I should find a couple good test tracks and mess with the crossover a bit but as was said the SPL probably had more to do with it. Can’t hurt to play a bit.

Given my outdoor experience had some volume behind it due to the nature of the event and open space I probably got a lot more than might be comfortable in an enclosed setting.

Isn’t there always a reason for another sub? Lol!!!

 

[Mr._Clark]

Around the holidays I purchased a PC-2000 Pro for my home setup and have enjoyed it very much. I've got nothing definitive to compare the experience to though as it is the first "real" subwoofer I've owned. My purchase was based though on a lot of feedback here and I appreciated all the help.

Anyway, I was recently at a dance competition and sat not far from the audio setup which, due to covid restrictions, was held outside. I was probably 10-12 ft away from the subwoofer used in the setup and frankly, when the bass got moving, it was like I was getting punched in the chest. It was pretty awesome! It was very clean too and not like it was being over driven or anything. I wrote down what it was and vaguely remember it being a 15 inch woofer but I can't find what I wrote and without someone rattling off brands I'd not be able to tell you what it was.

My SVS PC-2000 Pro gets the house shaking pretty good and you certainly feel the bass but it isn't like that punch in the chest feeling I got with this other subwoofer. What's it take to get that feeling? Is it because the PC-2000 Pro is downward firing that I get more rumble than punch? Am I expecting too much?

To be fair, that other sub could easily have cost twice or three times what I paid for my PC-2000 Pro but it was impressive given the open space it was working in.

I started looking into a few PA type subs awhile back and I noticed they had very pronounced peaks in the db curves. I didn't do any listening tests but they didn't look like they'd sound very good in a HT setup (my primary use). My "research" was extremely limited, and I have no idea what sub you heard at the dance competition, but I suspect it might be rather underwhelming if you tried to set it up in a system with decent home audio speakers.

Personally, I'm a big believer in dual (at least) subs. I have a pair of PC12-NSDs in one of my systems. If I run it with only one sub it's not even close. That's just my opinion.

 

[XenoChron]

Personally, I'm a big believer in dual (at least) subs. I have a pair of PC12-NSDs in one of my systems. If I run it with only one sub it's not even close. That's just my opinion.

I sometime wonder how two of the new 3000 micros would sound against the PC-2000 pro. Those on paper look very nice and quite compact of course. I do realize they don’t go down quite as far the 2000 but the dual opposing woofers seem to be a very sweet design and multiply it by two it would be fun to try.


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[Eppie]

Well now I’ve got a good reason to get another sub.

Sounds like I should find a couple good test tracks and mess with the crossover a bit but as was said the SPL probably had more to do with it. Can’t hurt to play a bit.

Given my outdoor experience had some volume behind it due to the nature of the event and open space I probably got a lot more than might be comfortable in an enclosed setting.

Check out the Subwoofer Candy thread in the forums if you can stream Youtube. Shady has posted lots of tracks for showing off low bass.

 

[XenoChron]

Check out the Subwoofer Candy thread in the forums if you can stream Youtube. Shady has posted lots of tracks for showing off low bass.

Thanks. I’ll check them out today.


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[ryanosaur]

I sometime wonder how two of the new 3000 micros would sound against the PC-2000 pro. Those on paper look very nice and quite compact of course. I do realize they don’t go down quite as far the 2000 but the dual opposing woofers seem to be a very sweet design and multiply it by two it would be fun to try.


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Those little toys are only suitable for small studios and dorm rooms, maybe an office rig for a music lover whose small speakers roll off too high.

if you want that mid bass slam effect, building a Devastator might be the best way to achieve that. But they are not for the faint of heart or those with structurally weak homes.

 

[lovinthehd]

I sometime wonder how two of the new 3000 micros would sound against the PC-2000 pro. Those on paper look very nice and quite compact of course. I do realize they don’t go down quite as far the 2000 but the dual opposing woofers seem to be a very sweet design and multiply it by two it would be fun to try.


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Dual opposed subs can be a good idea (and around for a long time) as long as you put some bigger drivers in it I wouldn't bother with the micro thing unless you have a small room/office and don't care about the lowest frequencies. Two PC2000 Pros would be much better.

 

[XenoChron]

Dual opposed subs can be a good idea (and around for a long time) as long as you put some bigger drivers in it I wouldn't bother with the micro thing unless you have a small room/office and don't care about the lowest frequencies. Two PC2000 Pros would be much better.

Yeah I figured as much. I’ve questioned the idea of them putting 3000 in the name. It messes with the natural progression of their whole line up.

Now as for Devastator…I like the sound of that!


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